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Author Topic: US boycotts UNESCO after UNESCO's recognition of Palestine  (Read 2322 times)
shua
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« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2011, 04:53:13 pm »
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I hear the Palestinians are going to go to the World Health Organization next.....Would they really defund THAT?

That will be less likely to be approved. People actually care about seeing that funded.
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ag
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« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2011, 07:07:48 pm »
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That will be less likely to be approved. People actually care about seeing that funded.

Given the margin at UNESCO, even if a few states defect, chances are, if they ask for it, they will be admitted into any UN organization, where decisions are to be taken by simple majority.

BTW, Mexican abstension is extremely controversial down here - Mexican Senate is raising huge stink about it. There is no way Mexico is voting against Palestinian membership of anything - even to stick w/ abstension is not going to be very simple.
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nickjbor
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« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2011, 12:36:58 am »
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You live in Mexico?
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« Reply #28 on: November 02, 2011, 08:10:01 am »
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Looks like someone's been reading the Chinese classics:

Quote from: Thirty-Six Stratagems
1.3. Kill with a borrowed knife
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WARNING: Selling oil in euros has been proven to be hazardous to one's health.
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« Reply #29 on: November 02, 2011, 01:03:35 pm »
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I feel ashamed to be an American

Israel has retaliated for the UNESCO recognition by accelerating settlement construction within their biblical homeland of east Jerusalem and the West Bank 

me thinks it is time for Israel to simply annex Samaria and Judea and let the chips fall where they may
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« Reply #30 on: November 02, 2011, 03:01:04 pm »
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I feel ashamed to be an American

Israel has retaliated for the UNESCO recognition by accelerating settlement construction within their biblical homeland of east Jerusalem and the West Bank 

me thinks it is time for Israel to simply annex Samaria and Judea and let the chips fall where they may

Well, that would certainly shake things up. But seriously, if that happened I would expect actually serious diplomatic actions (withdrawal of ambassadors, embargoes) against Israel.   
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Judäischen Volksfront
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« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2011, 11:48:37 pm »
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It's sad that jmfcst's comment either leads to Israel ceasing to exist as a Jewish state, or an Apartheid regime, or a Final Solution to a problem of Six Million untermenschen (maybe this time round there will be less emphasis on concentrating them in camps and more on giving them quick showers).

EDIT: Another option would be for the Israeli government to require all Jews to wear yellow stars in public to receive special privileges not available to the majority Arabs in Israel.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2011, 11:58:25 pm by EternalCynic »Logged

dead0man
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« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2011, 12:42:33 am »
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I must remind again that this Palestinian state won't accept Palestinian refugees (even those living INSIDE the Palestinian state) and it wants to be a "pure" (Arab Muslim only) state.  A decent chunk of the state isn't under the control of the people proclaiming this new state and the people that do rule that chunk are against this entire charade.  ALL of the people voting against it at the UN want there to be a Palestinian state, even the US and Israel, but not this back door way.  It needs to be done the right way, with everybody involved sitting down at the table and hammering something out.  This is simply a political move used to reinforce to the "believers" that Israel and the US (always conveniently ignoring everybody else that is saying "no" too) are always wrong and the fun loving Palestinians just want to live in their own state in peace.

Now pick the part you think you might be able to get me on and ignore the rest.  May I suggest the last line?  Those first few are (apparently) really hard to spin.
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Insula Dei
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« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2011, 11:26:10 am »
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Why should the Palestinian State accept refugees? Seems inconsistent when you don't like the Mexicans to move into the US yourself.
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dead0man
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« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2011, 11:35:08 am »
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PALESTINIAN refugees. 

And when have I ever said I don't like Mexicans moving into the US?
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Insula Dei
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« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2011, 11:42:29 am »
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PALESTINIAN refugees. 

And when have I ever said I don't like Mexicans moving into the US?

I don't know, you seem the anti-immigration sort of guy.

And as the refugees mainly used to live in Israel, I'm hardpressed to see how they are anything but Israeli refugees.
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dead0man
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« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2011, 12:08:27 pm »
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Even the ones IN Palestinian territory?
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Jacobtm
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« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2011, 03:20:23 pm »
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Asking for formal recognition just like any other country at the U.N. is not ''back door''.

Somalia, Sudan, and Haiti have official recognition at the U.N. Being a country without problems isn't a prerequisite that any other country is held to, nor is the permission of Israel needed for any other country.

Palestine deserves the same, to deny them that is to keep them in a drastically inferior position where Israel can continue to build illegal settlements on Palestinian land, stalling for more time to simply keep building more and more illegal settlements.
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Why do so many people here cheer on war crimes?
Israel and the United States "killing dozens of civilians with explosives", as you phrase it, has, throughout history, almost always been a good thing.
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« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2011, 07:02:20 pm »
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I feel ashamed to be an American

Israel has retaliated for the UNESCO recognition by accelerating settlement construction within their biblical homeland of east Jerusalem and the West Bank 

me thinks it is time for Israel to simply annex Samaria and Judea and let the chips fall where they may

I almost agree with you here- I really like the idea, but I'm not sure how Palestine could be a viable state. It'd have more exclaves than a meditatized German principality.
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ag
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« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2011, 09:18:21 pm »
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I must remind again that this Palestinian state won't accept Palestinian refugees (even those living INSIDE the Palestinian state) and it wants to be a "pure" (Arab Muslim only) state. 

At least 2/3 of the above statement is an outright lie (whether deliberate or not I don't know). Palestinian refugees residing in the West Bank and Gaza are as "accepted" as anyone else there, and nobody has ever seriously suggested they won't be citizens of the new state. Nor is the Palestinian Authority (as distinct from Hamas or from certain individuals) proposing a purely Muslim state (nor a purely Arab: nobody is talking of getting rid of, say, Samaritans).

Until and unless you disavow the above statement, I will not take any of your statements about the Middle East seriously.
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dead0man
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« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2011, 11:15:18 pm »
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link
Quote
BEIRUT: Palestinian refugees will not become citizens of a new Palestinian state, according to Palestine’s ambassador to Lebanon.

From behind a desk topped by a miniature model of Palestine’s hoped-for blue United Nations chair, Ambassador Abdullah Abdullah spoke to The Daily Star Wednesday about Palestine’s upcoming bid for U.N. statehood.

The ambassador unequivocally says that Palestinian refugees would not become citizens of the sought for U.N.-recognized Palestinian state, an issue that has been much discussed. “They are Palestinians, that’s their identity,” he says. “But … they are not automatically citizens.”

This would not only apply to refugees in countries such as Lebanon, Egypt, Syria and Jordan or the other 132 countries where Abdullah says Palestinians reside. Abdullah said that “even Palestinian refugees who are living in [refugee camps] inside the [Palestinian] state, they are still refugees. They will not be considered citizens.”

<snip>

Neither this definitional status nor U.N. statehood, Abdullah says, would affect the eventual return of refugees to Palestine. “How the issue of the right of return will be solved I don’t know, it’s too early [to say], but it is a sacred right that has to be dealt with and solved [with] the acceptance of all.” He says statehood “will never affect the right of return for Palestinian refugees.”

The right of return that Abdullah says is to be negotiated would not only apply to those Palestinians whose origins are within the 1967 borders of the state, he adds. “The state is the 1967 borders, but the refugees are not only from the 1967 borders. The refugees are from all over Palestine. When we have a state accepted as a member of the United Nations, this is not the end of the conflict. This is not a solution to the conflict. This is only a new framework that will change the rules of the game.”

<snip>
meanwhile link
Quote
The future independent Palestinian state will not include a Jewish minority, a top Palestinian official told USA Today on Wednesday, adding that it was in the best interest of both peoples to "be separated."

Maen Areikat, PLO Ambassador to the United States, made the comment just as the Palestinian Authority, led by President Mahmoud Abbas, was preparing to offer up Palestinian statehood to a vote in the United Nations General Assembly later this month.

Answering a question about the legal status of a Jewish minority in the future state, Areikat apprently rejected the issue, saying: "I believe, I still believe that as a first step we need to be totally separated," adding "I think we can contemplate these issues in the future."

"After the experience of the last 44 years, of military occupation and all the conflict and friction, I think it will be in the best interest that the two peoples should be separated,
" Areikat added.

<snip>
Ok, they aren't saying it will be Arab Muslim only, they just don't want da Joos.  I suppose that's a touch better.  That was my mistake.
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ag
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« Reply #41 on: November 04, 2011, 01:39:24 am »
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Before quoting some no-name ambassador in an obscure paper, who is (if he is quoted right) obviously trying to play on Lebanese internal politics, you might have checked the biography of this refugee from Safed:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Abbas

I am sure, his citizenship is also in question.

Bye

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dead0man
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« Reply #42 on: November 04, 2011, 01:46:36 am »
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later
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GMantis
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« Reply #43 on: November 05, 2011, 03:57:16 pm »
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It's rather funny how so many countries who recognize Palestine abstained from the vote and in the case of the Czech Republic even voted no.

I feel ashamed to be an American

Israel has retaliated for the UNESCO recognition by accelerating settlement construction within their biblical homeland of east Jerusalem and the West Bank 

me thinks it is time for Israel to simply annex Samaria and Judea and let the chips fall where they may
You do know how hypocritical and ridiculous an American sounds when he justifies possession of a territory based on ancient history?

I must remind again that this Palestinian state won't accept Palestinian refugees (even those living INSIDE the Palestinian state) and it wants to be a "pure" (Arab Muslim only) state.  A decent chunk of the state isn't under the control of the people proclaiming this new state and the people that do rule that chunk are against this entire charade.  ALL of the people voting against it at the UN want there to be a Palestinian state, even the US and Israel, but not this back door way.  It needs to be done the right way, with everybody involved sitting down at the table and hammering something out.  This is simply a political move used to reinforce to the "believers" that Israel and the US (always conveniently ignoring everybody else that is saying "no" too) are always wrong and the fun loving Palestinians just want to live in their own state in peace.

Now pick the part you think you might be able to get me on and ignore the rest.  May I suggest the last line?  Those first few are (apparently) really hard to spin.
Most of your other points have been addressed, so I'll limit myself to the underlined part: you really think that Israel wants an independent Palestinian state?
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dead0man
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« Reply #44 on: November 06, 2011, 05:20:16 am »
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Yes, a peaceful one.
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GMantis
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« Reply #45 on: November 06, 2011, 04:58:16 pm »
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Yes, a peaceful one.
And one that is very small, fragmented and totally under the control of Israel.
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bgwah
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« Reply #46 on: March 17, 2012, 01:17:00 am »
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Anyone else catch the Daily Show on Thursday? Tongue
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dead0man
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« Reply #47 on: March 17, 2012, 01:23:43 am »
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Yes, it was funny. Especially the part in Gabon.  I can't believe they (Comedy Central, being the stingy Jews that they are) actually sent him there.
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Redalgo
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« Reply #48 on: March 17, 2012, 01:53:58 am »
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I don't think I've ever seen an episode without a guest before. I'm glad they did a piece on this. :]
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dead0man
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« Reply #49 on: March 17, 2012, 01:57:34 am »
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I've been watching since before Stewart took over and I don't think I've seen it either...but I've missed episodes and tend to forget things.
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