Greece 2012
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Author Topic: Greece 2012  (Read 221725 times)
You kip if you want to...
change08
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #1150 on: June 20, 2012, 09:24:10 AM »

What's with DIMAR joining? Didn't they reject this exact coalition less then a month ago?

Yeah, but now they don't want a 3rd election.
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RodPresident
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« Reply #1151 on: June 20, 2012, 01:23:44 PM »

I don't understand DIMAR too, they're giving legitimacy to this government. I believe now that Kouvelis is most hated politician in Greece. Maybe Samaras was fearing that government can suffer more dissidences.
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Zanas
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« Reply #1152 on: June 20, 2012, 02:35:56 PM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...
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You kip if you want to...
change08
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #1153 on: June 20, 2012, 02:37:57 PM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Yeah, let's just ignore the whole probability of Greece finally falling off the cliff, dragging Europe down with it if there was a third election.
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Bacon King
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« Reply #1154 on: June 20, 2012, 03:52:46 PM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Not only that- if Dimar didn't enter government, they'd probably lose a lot of their moderate voters to PASOK. 
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Dereich
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« Reply #1155 on: June 20, 2012, 03:57:39 PM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Not only that- if Dimar didn't enter government, they'd probably lose a lot of their moderate voters to PASOK. 

I would have guessed that DIMAR ran on a "we're more moderate then the SYRIZA crazies but AREN'T the ones who screwed up the country in the first place like PASOK" kind of platform.
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Hash
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« Reply #1156 on: June 20, 2012, 04:04:07 PM »

I don't understand DIMAR too, they're giving legitimacy to this government.

And this is a bad thing... why exactly?

I don't get why the far-left is seemingly crossing fingers for this government to be a disaster, so that Greece falls off the cliff and hence sends the whole world down the drain. Don't you guys know when to stop petty politics and actually think about other factors that partisanship and ideology?
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politicus
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« Reply #1157 on: June 20, 2012, 04:51:11 PM »

I don't understand DIMAR too, they're giving legitimacy to this government.

And this is a bad thing... why exactly?

I don't get why the far-left is seemingly crossing fingers for this government to be a disaster, so that Greece falls off the cliff and hence sends the whole world down the drain. Don't you guys know when to stop petty politics and actually think about other factors that partisanship and ideology?

Its not about good vs. bad. Its just strange to see the party act this way. It will kill them in the long term.
We have an analytical focus on this, not a normative/emotional like you seem to have on this matter.
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Landslide Lyndon
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« Reply #1158 on: June 20, 2012, 06:46:49 PM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Not only that- if Dimar didn't enter government, they'd probably lose a lot of their moderate voters to PASOK. 

Exactly. DIMAR ran on a platform promising to join the government whichever party came first and acting as a moderating factor that would stop the extremes from ND and SYRIZA from taking total control of the government. And that's exactly what they did.

For example, they vetoed Samaras's intention to put in the government fascists like Voridis and Georgiadis and to repeal our version of the DREAM act which opened a path to citizenship for immigrants that came here as kids and attended greek schools.
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Peter the Lefty
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« Reply #1159 on: June 22, 2012, 09:34:05 AM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Not only that- if Dimar didn't enter government, they'd probably lose a lot of their moderate voters to PASOK.  

Exactly. DIMAR ran on a platform promising to join the government whichever party came first and acting as a moderating factor that would stop the extremes from ND and SYRIZA from taking total control of the government. And that's exactly what they did.

For example, they vetoed Samaras's intention to put in the government fascists like Voridis and Georgiadis and to repeal our version of the DREAM act which opened a path to citizenship for immigrants that came here as kids and attended greek schools.

Wow...you'd think PASOK would've vetoed that decision anyway.  
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justfollowingtheelections
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« Reply #1160 on: June 23, 2012, 07:32:06 PM »

The number of female MPs by party:

SYRIZA 22
ND 18
Independent Greeks 7
DIMAR 5
KKE 4
PASOK 3
Golden eggs 1 (Michaloliakos' wife)
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Zanas
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« Reply #1161 on: June 26, 2012, 10:35:20 AM »

I don't understand DIMAR too, they're giving legitimacy to this government.

And this is a bad thing... why exactly?

I don't get why the far-left is seemingly crossing fingers for this government to be a disaster, so that Greece falls off the cliff and hence sends the whole world down the drain. Don't you guys know when to stop petty politics and actually think about other factors that partisanship and ideology?
Aren't you pushing this a little bit too far ?...

Greece won't fall off anything. They will tear it apart, and it will survive. States are not companies you know. Stop believing that what's best for the market and companies is also best for the people.

The far-left, which is just plain left now that "the left" is, well, not the left anymore, is not crossing fingers for this government to be a disaster : it knows that this government will be a disaster for the people, because it will only think in matter of budget cuts. The left is "crossing fingers" worldwide to start treating people like, well, people, and not employees that you can fire or livestock.
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minionofmidas
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« Reply #1162 on: June 27, 2012, 07:44:51 AM »

So I amused myself with a new electoral system for Greece.
The starting point was, really, "what if instead of that 50-seat bonus they just used D'Hondt in the constituencies to achieve pseudo proportionality, like the Spanish and the Portuguese?" The problem is, obviously, that Greek constituencies have between 1 and 42 seats available - people in smaller constituencies would have voted differently with a different electoral system.
So I drew new ones. ;D For essentially lazy reasons, the corridor for constituency size has been set at from 6 to 17 seats (so Athens B was the only place too large and none of the peripheries was too small for a constituency of its own) and new constituencies' seat totals are just component constituencies' seat numbers, tallied. THis also means there are only 288 seats, not 300.

Tally:
ND 76
Syriza 63
PASOK 48
Anel 36
KKE 25
ChrA 18
Dimar 15
Greens 1
LAOS 0. Lack of pronounced strongholds.
Disy 3
DX! 1
Drasi 2
all other 0
ND 107
Syriza 99
PASOK 39
Anel 16
ChrA 12
Dimar 12
KKE 3. What a disaster of a result, with a sprinkling of bad luck (under this system) on top to really rub it in. Entirely deserved, of course.
All other 0
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ND 32.2, 4
Syriza 23.1, 3
PASOK 15.9, 2
Dimar 8.6, 1

The Disy vote in the Rhodopes transferred to Dimar en bloc.

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ND 34.7, 3
Syriza 19.3, 2
PASOK 15.5, 1
Anel 9.0, 1

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ND 40.1, 4
Syriza 16.3, 2
PASOK 14.9, 1

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ND 27.8, 6
Syriza 27.0, 5
PASOK 10.2, 2
Anel 8.9, 1
Dimar 7.5, 1
ChrA 6.8, 1

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ND 33.3, 5
Syriza 22.3, 3
PASOK 12.4, 2
Anel 8.7, 1
ChrA 7.4, 1
Dimar 5.7, 1

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ND 33.9, 5
Syriza 20.2, 3
PASOK 15.7, 2
Anel 8.3, 1
ChrA 7.4, 1

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ND 33.6, 4
Syriza 21.6, 3
PASOK 15.2, 2
Anel 8.0, 1

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ND 33.7, 5
Syriza 26.9, 4
PASOK 14.4, 2

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Syriza 32.7, 3
ND 26.6, 2
PASOK 10.8, 1

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ND 33.9, 5
Syriza 23.9, 3
PASOK 14.1, 2

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ND 29.4, 5
Syriza 27.4, 4
PASOK 11.5, 1
Anel 7.5, 1
ChrA 6.9, 1
Dimar 5.9, 1

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ND 35.0, 6
Syriza 33.9, 6
PASOK 15.2, 2
Anel 9.9, 1
ChrA 9.6, 1
Dimar 6.5, 1
Seems to be something wrong with the may percentages. Seat distribution was calculated from the raw vote totals, though.

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ND 32.7, 4
Syriza 25.3, 3
PASOK 14.9, 1

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Syriza 30.1, 5
ND 27.3, 5
PASOK 14.5, 2
ChrA 6.5, 1
Anel 6.5, 1
Dimar 5.9, 1

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ND 41.4, 4
Syriza 20.1, 2
PASOK 12.7, 1
ChrA 8.8, 1

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ND 33.6, 4
Syriza 23.3, 3
PASOK 14.4, 2
ChrA 9.0, 1

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Syriza 30.2, 5
ND 26.5, 4
ChrA 10.0, 1
Anel 9.5, 1
PASOK 7.7, 1

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ND 30.9, 6
Syriza 27.0, 6
PASOK 8.7, 1
ChrA 7.8, 1
Dimar 7.4, 1
Anel 6.3, 1
KKE 4.7, 1

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Syriza 33.2, 4
ND 23.6, 2
PASOK 9.0, 1
Dimar 7.9, 1

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ND 32.3, 5
Syriza 27.4, 5
Dimar 8.5, 1
PASOK 8.4, 1
Anel 6.7, 1

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Syriza 36.8, 5
ND 19.3, 2
PASOK 8.3, 1
Anel 8.2, 1
ChrA 7.9, 1

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Syriza 30.0, 4
ND 27.4, 4
PASOK 8.6, 1
Dimar 7.9, 1
Anel 7.7, 1

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Syriza 33.0, 5
ND 23.1, 4
Anel 9.1, 1
ChrA 8.9, 1
PASOK 8.1, 1
Dimar 6.0, 1
KKE 5.5, 1

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ND 28.7, 2
Syriza 22.4, 2
PASOK 14.7, 1
KKE 11.0, 1

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ND 31.7, 3
Syriza 24.4, 3
PASOK 14.5, 1
Anel 9.6, 1

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Syriza 32.1, 6
ND 21.5, 4
PASOK 18.5, 4
Anel 7.7, 1
Dimar 7.2, 1
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LastVoter
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« Reply #1163 on: July 01, 2012, 03:03:34 AM »

I believe that should there be a third election, Dimar voters would "vote utile" for Syriza, at least a number of them, in order to get Syriza the majority premium of 50 seats. So Dimar has their last shot at being in charge with a nice parliamentary group...

Yeah, let's just ignore the whole probability of Greece finally falling off the cliff, dragging Europe down with it if there was a third election.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=GqgOvzUeiAA

Change bolshevik to falling off the cliff.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #1164 on: July 19, 2012, 12:16:56 PM »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aU3Gfe0MG0c

No comment really.
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