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Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion
International Elections
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Sibboleth
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Malta 2013
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Topic: Malta 2013 (Read 2849 times)
Hashemite
YaBB God
Posts: 30154
Political Matrix
E: -1.29, S: -7.30
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #25 on:
March 10, 2013, 02:56:56 pm »
Both parties basically ran on the same platform, fwiw.
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Quote
20:12 oakvale Taylor Swift's 22 was originally titled 75 in reference to her ex Flanby's proposed tax rate
Quote
20:49 Snowstalker yes, but i'm the kind of fascist who would have backed the allies
20:57 Snowstalker sadly, it's a legitimate ideology tarnished by the incompetent mussolini and the vile hitler
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #26 on:
March 11, 2013, 03:07:23 am »
The first counts have now been completed everywhere. Results look clear cut everywhere except districts 8 and 13: Labour gain fourth seats in districts 3, 4 and 5 and otherwise as you were. In both 8 and 13 the Nationalists are narrowly ahead but not by enough to be entirely confident they'll get 3 seats.
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #27 on:
March 11, 2013, 05:15:01 am »
District 13 (Gozo) has nearly finished counting and it's now clearly going to remain 3 Nationalist 2 Labour; a few transfers have leaked but not enough to change the outcome.
District 8 has only had two counts, so it's too early to tell. On the first count the Nationalists were ahead but didn't have three quotas, so AD transfers will be important there.
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #28 on:
March 11, 2013, 07:12:53 am »
Quote from: YL on March 11, 2013, 05:15:01 am
District 13 (Gozo) has nearly finished counting and it's now clearly going to remain 3 Nationalist 2 Labour; a few transfers have leaked but not enough to change the outcome.
Oops, jumped to conclusions a bit quickly there: on the 10th count over 200 Nationalist votes didn't transfer, and Justyne Caruana (Labour) beat Fredrick Azzopardi (Nationalist) by 3966 to 3957 for the last seat. So that district ended up 3-2 to Labour.
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
Moderator
YaBB God
Posts: 53025
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #29 on:
March 11, 2013, 08:33:03 am »
I've put together an outline map for the (recently redistributed) districts. Results maps later (i.e. when I've stopped working for the day).
When did Labour last win the most seats on Gozo?
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'Gentlemen, a desert. A place of savage reference for the good people of Ohio. A place to fear and love. A blasted region. Something to remind us what we hewed out of. A place without malls. An Other for Ohio's Self. Cacti and scorpions and the sun bearing down. Desolation. A place for people to wander alone. To reflect. Away from everything. Gentlemen, a desert.'
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #30 on:
March 11, 2013, 01:14:03 pm »
District 8 after 12 counts:
Quota 3948
Carmona (L) 3948 elected
Fenech (N) 3948 elected
Fenech Adami (N) 3948 elected
Zammit (L) 2895
Scicluna (L) 2515
Debono (L) 2149
Buttigieg (N) 1613
Asciak (N) 1445
Castaldi (N) 905 to be eliminated
In total that's 11859 Nationalist votes (very marginally over three quotas) and 11507 Labour votes (2.91 quotas). So the Nationalists look favourites for three, but after what happened in district 13 and with Labour's obviously better balancing of their candidates I don't think this can be called yet.
The last AD candidate was eliminated on the 12th count. Of their 665 votes on count 11, 208 went Nationalist and 199 Labour.
Update: the 13th count reduced the Nationalist lead to 236 votes (11777-11531). Asciak is next to be eliminated.
«
Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 02:33:57 pm by YL
»
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #31 on:
March 11, 2013, 02:18:46 pm »
District 12 has finished counting, and is 3 Nationalist, 2 Labour.
Apart from districts 8, 12 and 13, the others look like (NB some of them have other candidates still not eliminated, but none look to have a chance):
1 (13 counts): L 3.31 quotas, N 2.65. 3-2
2 (4 counts): L 4.23 quotas, N 1.68. 4-1
3 (13 counts): L 4.11 quotas, N 1.82. 4-1
4 (12 counts) L 4.00 quotas, N 1.95. Looking like 4-1
5 (14 counts) L 4.03 quotas, N 1.91. Presumably 4-1
6 (15 counts) L 3.56 quotas, N 2.39. 3-2
7 (8 counts) L 3.44 quotas, N 2.52. 3-2
9 (15 counts) L 2.57 quotas, N 3.19. 2-3
10 (18 counts) L 2.40 quotas, N 3.50. 2-3
11 (13 counts) L 2.71 quotas, N 3.27. 2-3
So assuming 2-3 in district 8, and with 2-3 in district 12 and 3-2 in district 13, the STV part of the election looks like Labour 38 (+4) Nationalists 27 (-4).
«
Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 02:48:32 pm by YL
»
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
Moderator
YaBB God
Posts: 53025
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #32 on:
March 11, 2013, 06:17:31 pm »
More maps tomorrow-ish.
«
Last Edit: March 12, 2013, 01:19:33 pm by Sibboleth
»
Logged
'Gentlemen, a desert. A place of savage reference for the good people of Ohio. A place to fear and love. A blasted region. Something to remind us what we hewed out of. A place without malls. An Other for Ohio's Self. Cacti and scorpions and the sun bearing down. Desolation. A place for people to wander alone. To reflect. Away from everything. Gentlemen, a desert.'
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #33 on:
March 12, 2013, 03:06:57 am »
You're going to have to edit that, but I doubt you'll mind.
In district 8, Asciak's elimination for count 14 left the situation as
Buttigieg (N) 3664
Zammit (L) 2991
Scicluna (L) 2543
Debono (L) 2155
So on count 15 Debono was eliminated. 16 votes went to Buttigieg, 894 to Zammit (elected easily) and 1145 to Scicluna, meaning Labour snatched the third seat by 8 votes.
Districts 4 and 5 both finished 4-1 as expected, so the final STV result is 39-26. I'm not sure exactly what the rules are for the "fix", but what I've read suggests the Nationalists will get some extra seats from it, effectively compensating them for their incompetent transfer management.
«
Last Edit: March 12, 2013, 03:13:00 am by YL
»
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
Brodie
Newbie
Posts: 1
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #34 on:
March 12, 2013, 11:14:11 am »
Can someone please explain to me this top-up procedure? I know that in 2008 the PN won the most first preferences and yet failed to win a majority of seats, and for that reason they were entitled to top-up seats to give them a single seat majority (35-34). I've read on some sources (okay, wikipedia, shoot me!) that PN are getting four extra seats to ensure proportionality. I was under the impression this only happened under the 2008 scenario, and not for the runner up. Can someone please explain this?
I've 39 for Labour, 26 for PN. Wikipedia claims 26-30 for PN, which does give them a fairly proportional seat share. I've just not read about this secondary top-up provision.
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Sibboleth
Realpolitik
Moderator
YaBB God
Posts: 53025
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #35 on:
March 12, 2013, 01:33:45 pm »
Logged
'Gentlemen, a desert. A place of savage reference for the good people of Ohio. A place to fear and love. A blasted region. Something to remind us what we hewed out of. A place without malls. An Other for Ohio's Self. Cacti and scorpions and the sun bearing down. Desolation. A place for people to wander alone. To reflect. Away from everything. Gentlemen, a desert.'
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #36 on:
March 12, 2013, 01:35:22 pm »
Quote from: Brodie on March 12, 2013, 11:14:11 am
Can someone please explain to me this top-up procedure? I know that in 2008 the PN won the most first preferences and yet failed to win a majority of seats, and for that reason they were entitled to top-up seats to give them a single seat majority (35-34). I've read on some sources (okay, wikipedia, shoot me!) that PN are getting four extra seats to ensure proportionality. I was under the impression this only happened under the 2008 scenario, and not for the runner up. Can someone please explain this?
I've 39 for Labour, 26 for PN. Wikipedia claims 26-30 for PN, which does give them a fairly proportional seat share. I've just not read about this secondary top-up provision.
Here's a description.
Basically it sounds like a fudge.
The Nationalists are applying for recounts in both the close districts (8 and 13). If one of these is successful, so that the STV result is 38-27, then according to the method described the Nationalists' entitlement of extra seats would be 3.04, which presumably rounds up to 4 (it can't be 3, as the total number of seats must be odd) giving 38-31. If they're both successful, so that the STV result is 37-28, then the entitlement is 1.25, so presumably they'd get two seats, giving 37-30.
The system doesn't give AD any seats, even though doing the same calculation with their vote gives an entitlement of 1.28.
Update 13 March: the recount requests were turned down, so the final STV result is 39-26, with the four extra Nationalist seats giving 39-30.
«
Last Edit: March 13, 2013, 07:13:19 am by YL
»
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
Moderator
YaBB God
Posts: 53025
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #37 on:
March 12, 2013, 01:46:58 pm »
It's a legacy of the 1981 election when Labour won the most seats but the Nationalists polled more votes and promptly threw a hissy fit of epic proportions.
Logged
'Gentlemen, a desert. A place of savage reference for the good people of Ohio. A place to fear and love. A blasted region. Something to remind us what we hewed out of. A place without malls. An Other for Ohio's Self. Cacti and scorpions and the sun bearing down. Desolation. A place for people to wander alone. To reflect. Away from everything. Gentlemen, a desert.'
YL
YorkshireLiberal
YaBB God
Posts: 736
Political Matrix
E: -5.35, S: -6.70
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #38 on:
March 12, 2013, 02:21:31 pm »
Quote from: Sibboleth on March 12, 2013, 01:46:58 pm
It's a legacy of the 1981 election when Labour won the most seats but the Nationalists polled more votes and promptly threw a hissy fit of epic proportions.
AIUI this is a recent (2007) extension; the previous version only corrected "wrong winner" results like the 1981 one, as happened in 2008.
It seems strange to me to use STV but then only look at first preference votes to do this, although it does seem that most of the oddities in Malta before this year haven't been caused by features of STV as opposed to other district-based systems. And it seems that the rule still only applies under certain circumstances, which might well not apply if three parties won seats in the STV phase.
«
Last Edit: March 12, 2013, 02:28:33 pm by YL
»
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Somewhat reluctant Labour supporter
Sibboleth
Realpolitik
Moderator
YaBB God
Posts: 53025
Re: Malta 2013
«
Reply #39 on:
March 12, 2013, 08:29:11 pm »
Logged
'Gentlemen, a desert. A place of savage reference for the good people of Ohio. A place to fear and love. A blasted region. Something to remind us what we hewed out of. A place without malls. An Other for Ohio's Self. Cacti and scorpions and the sun bearing down. Desolation. A place for people to wander alone. To reflect. Away from everything. Gentlemen, a desert.'
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