towards a spiritualist Mormonism/Mormon non-theism

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any suggestions?

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my goal is to create a theology that, while upholding the spiritual and historical value of the Latter-Day Saint movement, comes to terms with the untenable nature of claims such as continuing revelation through prophets, historicity of the Nephites and Lamanites, admits the intellectual dishonesty of Mormon archaeology and other scholarship, and so forth.

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the bible never asks someone to pray for truth, even though it says the Holy Spirit guides us into all truth.  Instead, it claims the measure of truth is the Word of God:

John 17:17 "Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth."

Therefore, if the Christian God is talking to you through prayer, it will be speaking in accord with scripture.

Could you imagine someone asking you to pray to God if adultery was ok?!  No.  Why not?  Because adultery clearly violates the scripture.  It wouldn't matter what you claim was the answer given to you in prayer, if the message in prayer came from the same spirit responsible for scripture, then it will be in agreement with scripture, which is why the Apostles attempted to win converts by simply presenting the gospel as it aligned to scripture.

So, if the book of Mormon is the true Christianity, then it should align with the both the OT and NT, or at least the OT (if the book of Mormon declares superiority over the NT).  But we know that is not the case because Mormon doctrine of the origin of God is completely contrary to both the OT and NT.

And just what is the word of God?

the Book of Mormon is the word of God, revealed to man after He re-established communication with the human race through the prophet Joseph Smith, Jr.

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the Book of Mormon is the word of God, revealed to man after He re-established communication with the human race through the prophet Joseph Smith, Jr.

when did this supposed lapse in communication begin, exactly?

after the Lamanites killed off the last of the Nephites, 385AD.

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I was reporting from the annals of Mormon theology, not necessarily from personal belief.

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"that's a shame."  -Jerry Seinfeld

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I am starting an independent Latter-Day Saint movement.  This movement is unaffiliated with the LDS Church.  We call ourselves "Mormon Spiritualists" or alternatively, "Latter-Day Saint non-theists".  To get the movement off the ground, I am seeking a high-profile defector/convert from the LDS Church.  If Mr. Romney were to join our movement we would experience a beneficial surge in media attention.  In order to incentivize Mr. Romney's conversion, I, as de facto leader of the Independent Mormon movement, am willing to offer him a special 5% tithing rate over the next five years, before it reverts back to the normal 10% rate.  Mr. Romney currently pays 10% to the LDS Church; he would have saved over a million dollars had he theoretically been a part of our movement last year (before factoring in tax deduction).

I understand that the Governor is a busy man, but please raise this issue to him at his earliest convenience.  If he declines to join, hasten to notify us so we can move on to seeking other high-profile LDS defectors, such as the Udall family.  If he would like more information, he (or someone on his behalf) should not hesitate to contact me by replying to this e-mail, or calling me at (631) 487-0523.

Thank you and God Bless,
David J Hanover.

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interesting you should bring up that point, which I anticipated.  I have begun working on the Canonical Text of my movement, currently with the working title Towards a Latter-Day Saint Non-Theism: A 21st Century addendum to the Book of Mormon.  Perhaps in the section I have planned which is titled "Suggestions for an Interpretative Theology" I shall address this question, namely, if I am taking the various pillars of Mormonism to task, why am I doing it in a spirit of continuity?

here is a segment from the Foreword to my work, which may be illustrative for you:

The author’s goal as regards this “21st Century Addendum” is multi-faceted.  First, he would like to carve out a space to work within the Latter-Day Saint tradition while coming to terms with the untenability(2) of its theological-historical claims; the serious problems of its oftentimes ruthless and disgusting history; the intellectual bankruptcy of Mormon scholarship, particularly its archaeology, which attempts to find basis for the utter fiction that is the Historicity of the Nephites and Lamanites; and, the unfortunate commoditization of the religion propagated by the largest church within the movement, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.


(please note that any segment of the work taken prior to its official 'publishing' is very much subject to change, and, thus, non-Canonical.)



I encourage you to continue to poke and prod me, Nathan, for I value your insights on these topics; in fact you will likely be referenced in the work itself (as will jmfcst).

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I'm far too lightheaded and exhausted from alcohol abuse last night to reply now, but you're helping me to organize my thoughts, and I will keep you and the rest of the Community appraised as this thing rolls on.

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yes BRTD, I have actually been in discussion with another author on this project, and he basically recommended that I spend more time on the inside of LDS to gain material.  I was going to ask a missionary online at lds.org if baptism was free but they apparently are understaffed and I gave up.  I'll get to it again soon.

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currently beginning work on 'On Staying Sober: A Practical Defence', which will narrate my own story as regards substance use, and how LDS doctrine, tradition, and heritage have helped me to overcome my substance abuse problem.  moreover, I will argue that this should not mean that the LDS Church should stand in the way of drug de-criminalization/legalization; in fact, I will take to argue that the proper interpretation of Latter-Day Saint tradition is not opposed to the legality of drugs as such, but simply preaches voluntary abstinence at the individual/household level.

the second part of the section on substance will be a 'more secular' argument in favor of the disease model of addiction and the concurrent treatment of the problem as a public health problem; and will scathingly criticize the LDS Church and its adherents for their support of criminalization.

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I should note, in doing research, it is simply amazing how Mormon understanding of issues such as diet, exercise, hydration, mind-body connection, and disease model of addiction dates to the mid-1800s, long before the scientific/rational community was able to arrive at the same conclusions... an affirmation of my faith.

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it is likely that it is a minority position within the LDS movement.

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interesting, it seems like most of the BYU students replying to this article oppose Prop 8:

http://universe.byu.edu/index.php/2012/02/16/letter-religious-freedom/