WI: Alexander Hamilton Survives

[Frodo]

Assuming he survives his duel with Aaron Burr, how differently would history have turned out?  Would he have gone on to win the Presidency after eight years of Jeffersonian rule?  

[Assistant to the Regional Manager Cathcon]

I've wondered this myself. It doesn't seem as though he had that much of an ambition for the Presidency. More like he preferred to work from behind the scenes and muck stuff up. However, after Adams' defeat, he was pretty much the most prominent man in the party and might be pushed forward to save his party from the Republicans. He'd probably be one of our smartest Presidents and while I'm not that big a fan of his policies, I think he could come to be ranked as one of our greatest.

[Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I've wondered this myself. It doesn't seem as though he had that much of an ambition for the Presidency. More like he preferred to work from behind the scenes and muck stuff up. However, after Adams' defeat, he was pretty much the most prominent man in the party and might be pushed forward to save his party from the Republicans. He'd probably be one of our smartest Presidents and while I'm not that big a fan of his policies, I think he could come to be ranked as one of our greatest.

A thing to remember about Hamilton is that he pursued the policies he did for the purpose of ensuring the survival of the fragile Republic, from ending up like France (tyranny of the mob, followed by a strong man brought in to restore order).

The problem with Hamilton is that he was easily caricatured and he lacked the common touch that a Jefferson or a Washington possessed, in spite of his improverished upbringing. I don't see how he would have defeated Jefferson in 1804. Though it is possible he could have steered the party away from the disasatrous shenanigans of people like Timothy Pickering and the Harford Convention later on.

[Communists For McCain]

Arguably, the inevitable doom of the Federalist Party was secured when Hamilton died.
Pretty much, he was the only real strong personality the Federalist Party had after John Adams lost the Presidency.
I mean look at the presidential candidates they put forward post Adams:

Charles Pinckney!?
Rufus King!!!?

I mean holy hell Batman!  The most successful post Adams candidate they had was actually a dissident Democratic Republican LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR of New York who was like the nephew of the then recently deceased Vice President.  And this was during an unpopular war.

The Federalist Party was so weak John Q. Adams, the son of John F'ing Adams, defected to Democratic Republican in 1808 (just a few years after the death of Hamilton).  That alone should tell you how screwed the Federalist Party was.

With Washington dying prematurely, John Adams doing I don't know what, and Alexander Hamilton f***ing dead, the Federalist Party simply had no hope.
I would argue, however, that the Federalist Party, due to it's very nature as a party of the elite in radically liberal America, was doomed to fail.

The Democratic Republican Party, with it's numerous powerful personalities and it's wide coalition ("progressive Democratic" Jeffersonians and economically nationalist Madisonians) naturally had an enormous advantage.  While Hamilton would arguably have the strongest personality amongst the Federalists I also get the perception (like someone else mentioned) that he was more of a backstage kind of guy.  However, an eight year Hamiltonian presidency wouldn't save the Federalist Party, it would probably only delay the inevitable doom of it.

The Federalist Party mantra was the idea of a strong central government ruled by an elite few to go along with their program of economic nationalism and industrialization.  Naturally the power base was in the Northeast where there were many urban areas and expanding industry.
The Democratic Republican Party consisted of agrarian "liberal" laissez faire Jeffersonians and  economically nationalist Madisonians and various other groups that rallied against elitist rule and for the empowerment and education of the common man.
Arguably, the presence of economic nationalists such as Madison and Clay in the DR camp suggested that a strong national government could be reconciled with representative democracy.  Elitist rule, however, could not be reconciled with a decentralized and weak national government.
Thus why I believe that the defeat of the Federalist Party and the triumph of the Democratic Republicans was inevitable.  In spirit, a big tent party could exist in the DR, one could never exist in the Federalist Party.

[Assistant to the Regional Manager Cathcon]

This place is like where posts go to die. At least 5 posts have disappeared from existence in this thing, including 2 of mine.

[Frodo]

This place is like where posts go to die. At least 5 posts have disappeared from existence in this thing, including 2 of mine.

Because -along with Kalwejt's posts- they had nothing to do with the topic at hand.  I want to discuss Alexander Hamilton, not the poster.  And I am grateful that Ernest kept this thread from going off-track. 

[Assistant to the Regional Manager Cathcon]

Moving back on topic, the duel that killed Al was prompted by a dispute between Burr & him over the NY gubernatorial election. It seems Hammy was set out to smear his long time rival & make sure Burr couldn't get elected. Might Hammy at one point himself step into the race & use this to later pit himself back into the arena?

[Assistant to the Regional Manager Cathcon]

Nevermind. Looks like Burr was already beaten by the time he shot Al.

[Frodo]

Would we have gotten involved in the Napoleonic wars (i.e. the War of 1812) had Alexander Hamilton been president? 

[Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Why don't we first figure out how he becomes President. Its one thing for him to survive, it is quite another for him to overcome the DR advantages going forward and the already damaged reputation of the Federalist party as a organ of elitism. Hamilton himself had been smeared relentlessly in the proceeding decade and a split had developed within the party between him and Adams. How does this translate into a Hamilton Presidency?

[True Federalist]

I don't think that even if he were the Federalist nominee that Hamilton could have defeated either Jefferson or Madison, so I can't see his survival preventing the War of 1812.  What is likely is that he would have repudiated the separatist movement in New England that gave birth to the Hartford Convention and publicly defected from the Federalists to the Republicans.  The Embargo and the War of 1812 had essentially forced the Republicans to adopt many Federalist principles albeit not for Federalist positions, so such a switch would not be unwarranted.

In the wake of the British attack on Washington, and the resulting forced resignation of John Armstrong, Jr., I think it is possible that Madison calls on Hamilton to fill that post instead of Monroe, or that when Madison shifts Monroe to War, he inserts Hamilton into the post of Secretary of State rather than leaving it vacant.  From either post, Hamilton would have a shot at securing the Republican nomination for the Presidency in the election of 1816.

If he fails in 1816, then I doubt Hamilton would ever become President.  By 1825, he would be age 68 (or 70) and older than everyone (except Reagan if Hamilton was age 68) who took the office.  [Incidentally, if Romney wins this November, he will be the fourth oldest person to take office as President, after Reagan, William H. Harrison, and Buchanan.]

[Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I don't think that even if he were the Federalist nominee that Hamilton could have defeated either Jefferson or Madison, so I can't see his survival preventing the War of 1812.  What is likely is that he would have repudiated the separatist movement in New England that gave birth to the Hartford Convention and publicly defected from the Federalists to the Republicans.  The Embargo and the War of 1812 had essentially forced the Republicans to adopt many Federalist principles albeit not for Federalist positions, so such a switch would not be unwarranted.

In the wake of the British attack on Washington, and the resulting forced resignation of John Armstrong, Jr., I think it is possible that Monroe calls on Hamilton to fill that post instead of Madison, or that when Monroe shifts Madison to War, he inserts Hamilton into the post of Secretary of State rather than leaving it vacant.  From either post, Hamilton would have a shot at securing the Republican nomination for the Presidency in the election of 1816.

If he fails in 1816, then I doubt Hamilton would ever become President.  By 1825, he would be age 68 (or 70) and older than everyone (except Reagan if Hamilton was age 68) who took the office.  [Incidentally, if Romney wins this November, he will be the fourth oldest person to take office as President, after Reagan, William H. Harrison, and Buchanan.]

There appears to be something wrong in that middle paragraph. I think you have accidentally switched Monroe and Madison around.

[Assistant to the Regional Manager Cathcon]

I don't think that even if he were the Federalist nominee that Hamilton could have defeated either Jefferson or Madison, so I can't see his survival preventing the War of 1812.  What is likely is that he would have repudiated the separatist movement in New England that gave birth to the Hartford Convention and publicly defected from the Federalists to the Republicans.  The Embargo and the War of 1812 had essentially forced the Republicans to adopt many Federalist principles albeit not for Federalist positions, so such a switch would not be unwarranted.

In the wake of the British attack on Washington, and the resulting forced resignation of John Armstrong, Jr., I think it is possible that Monroe calls on Hamilton to fill that post instead of Madison, or that when Monroe shifts Madison to War, he inserts Hamilton into the post of Secretary of State rather than leaving it vacant.  From either post, Hamilton would have a shot at securing the Republican nomination for the Presidency in the election of 1816.

If he fails in 1816, then I doubt Hamilton would ever become President.  By 1825, he would be age 68 (or 70) and older than everyone (except Reagan if Hamilton was age 68) who took the office.  [Incidentally, if Romney wins this November, he will be the fourth oldest person to take office as President, after Reagan, William H. Harrison, and Buchanan.]

That would be quite epic, but would the DR's be ready, by 1816, to embrace their arch-enemy? I like the idea though. Fits in with JQA's own switch a couple of years earlier during the Jefferson admin.

[True Federalist]

I think you have accidentally switched Monroe and Madison around.

Confusing M&M for each other is a weakness of mine., thanks for catching that.

would the DR's be ready, by 1816, to embrace their arch-enemy? I like the idea though. Fits in with JQA's own switch a couple of years earlier during the Jefferson admin.

 As for whether Hamilton could be embraced by the Republicans, I think it is a possibility.  He'd already managed to rehabilitate his personal reputation considerably by the time of his duel, and if as Secretary of War he gets the credit for American successes late in the War of 1812, I could see him attracting the support of the young War Hawks such as Clay and Calhoun.  Other than their choice of who to go to war with, Hamilton's politics coincided with theirs on a number of points.

Monroe won the Republican nomination in 1816 despite the already existing dissatisfaction with the congressional caucus method of choosing who the next Republican presidential nominee was because his opponents were unable to coalesce around someone else.  Hamilton might have been able to provide the nucleus around which the National Republicans form ahead of when they did in our timeline.

[Communists For McCain]

I don't know guys, Hamilton becoming a Democratic Republican?

He was THE FEDERALIST.