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Author Topic: CO: PPP: Obama up double-digits  (Read 3352 times)
Gass3268
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« Reply #50 on: April 11, 2012, 12:53:58 pm »
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But not compared to some moderate and even states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Ohio, Michigan, Maine, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida that voted in GOP extremists who are becoming very unpopular very quickly.

Name one "GOP extremist" in Wisconsin or even an "unpopular" GOP office holder. 
hint: their isn't one. 

Anyone in the legislature not named Dale Schultz. 
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #51 on: April 11, 2012, 12:59:53 pm »
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But not compared to some moderate and even states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Ohio, Michigan, Maine, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida that voted in GOP extremists who are becoming very unpopular very quickly.

Name one "GOP extremist" in Wisconsin or even an "unpopular" GOP office holder. 
hint: their isn't one. 

Anyone in the legislature not named Dale Schultz. 

Actually I'm not an expert on his district, but that Rino might be the ONE and only unpopular R in the state.  That mining bill was such a disgrace to his legacy and the entire democrat party.   
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #52 on: April 11, 2012, 01:05:54 pm »
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The emphasis is on DISGRACEFUL.  Think of the Harrison Ford line in the movie 'Sabrina': "I'm not about to throw away a billion dollars."  Well every democrat was the deciding vote to throw away TENs of billions of dollars.  Disgrace.   
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ajb
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« Reply #53 on: April 11, 2012, 01:21:10 pm »
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But not compared to some moderate and even states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Ohio, Michigan, Maine, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida that voted in GOP extremists who are becoming very unpopular very quickly.

Name one "GOP extremist" in Wisconsin or even an "unpopular" GOP office holder. 
hint: their isn't one. 

Anyone in the legislature not named Dale Schultz. 

Actually I'm not an expert on his district, but that Rino might be the ONE and only unpopular R in the state.  That mining bill was such a disgrace to his legacy and the entire democrat party.   

"Surviving recall vote" is really defining "popular" downward.
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Gass3268
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« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2012, 01:25:36 pm »
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But not compared to some moderate and even states like Wisconsin, Iowa, Ohio, Michigan, Maine, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida that voted in GOP extremists who are becoming very unpopular very quickly.

Name one "GOP extremist" in Wisconsin or even an "unpopular" GOP office holder. 
hint: their isn't one. 

Anyone in the legislature not named Dale Schultz. 

Actually I'm not an expert on his district, but that Rino might be the ONE and only unpopular R in the state.  That mining bill was such a disgrace to his legacy and the entire democrat party.   

I was answering your extremist question, not the unpopular question. Obviously most of the Republican's are popular in their districts, but that doesn't mean they aren't extremists. I'm predicting that at least 2 state senate seats are going to go to the Democrats in June. The map is a bit more favorable this time then it was last year.

Shultz's area is the most Democratic district currently represented by a Republican. It went to Obama 59.8-38.6, while only going to Walker/Johnson 52.6-47.4 before going pretty handily for Kloppenburg. I am guessing he's pretty popular in his district if he can continue to win.
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #55 on: April 11, 2012, 01:32:18 pm »
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"Surviving recall vote" is really defining "popular" downward.

A majority supports, votes for, and RE-Elects = "popular" = "Surviving recall vote."

I don't know how you rationalize decisive victory into "defining downward," but it made me laugh. 
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #56 on: April 11, 2012, 01:37:17 pm »
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Gass3268, So outside of the statehouse not one extremist? ? ?  You do realize modest adjustments to balance budgets and improve the economy isn't exactly a definition of extreme right?
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Gass3268
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« Reply #57 on: April 11, 2012, 01:45:44 pm »
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Gass3268, So outside of the statehouse not one extremist? ? ?

How about the majority of people in Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties? They are the ones that send most of the extremists to the statehouse year after year. 

You do realize modest adjustments to balance budgets and improve the economy isn't exactly a definition of extreme right?

Yeah but taking away a right is a definition of extremism.
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Hashemite
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« Reply #58 on: April 11, 2012, 01:53:37 pm »
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hint: their isn't one. 

The word is there, dear troll.
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #59 on: April 11, 2012, 01:54:41 pm »
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Gass3268, So outside of the statehouse not one extremist? ? ?

How about the majority of people in Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties?

You do realize modest adjustments to balance budgets and improve the economy isn't exactly a definition of extreme right?

Yeah but taking away a right is a definition of extremism.

Sigh, Collective Bargaining is not a right, it is a privilege.  Walker gave public employees the privilege to opt out of these belligerent Unions.  I know that expansion of freedom is scary to you, but it is not extremist.  Thinking you have a right from God to Bargain against the taxpayers of Wisconsin IS extremist.

Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties are the most productive, highest tax-paying people in the state, what is extreme about them?      
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ajb
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« Reply #60 on: April 11, 2012, 02:01:54 pm »
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Gass3268, So outside of the statehouse not one extremist? ? ?

How about the majority of people in Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties?

You do realize modest adjustments to balance budgets and improve the economy isn't exactly a definition of extreme right?

Yeah but taking away a right is a definition of extremism.

Sigh, Collective Bargaining is not a right, it is a privilege.  Walker gave public employees the privilege to opt out of these belligerent Unions.  I know that expansion of freedom is scary to you, but it is not extremist.  Thinking you have a right from God to Bargain against the taxpayers of Wisconsin IS extremist.

Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties are the most productive, highest tax-paying people in the state, what is extreme about them?      

I guess I'm with Ronald Reagan on this one:
"These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland. The values that have inspired other dissidents under Communist domination.  They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost.  They remind us that freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.  You and I must protect and preserve freedom here or it will not be passed on to our children.  Today the workers in Poland are showing a new generation not how high is the price of freedom but how much it is worth that price."

Also:

"I happen to be the only president of a union ever to be a candidate for President of the United States.
As president of my union -- the Screen Actors Guild -- I spent many hours with the late George Meany, whose love of this country and whose belief in a strong defense against all totalitarians is one of laborís greatest legacies. "

http://www.reagan.utexas.edu/archives/reference/9.1.80.html

It's a measure of today's Republican party that it now views defending something Ronald Reagan saw as a bulwark against totalitarianism makes you in to a leftist extremist.
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Gass3268
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« Reply #61 on: April 11, 2012, 02:09:35 pm »
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It's really funny how many of Reagan's views wouldn't be acceptable in today's Republican party.
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« Reply #62 on: April 11, 2012, 02:10:49 pm »
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It's really funny how many of Reagan's views wouldn't be acceptable in today's Republican party.

It makes me wonder if this is hyperbole or if this really is 21st century analog of 1930 Germany.
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #63 on: April 11, 2012, 02:16:19 pm »
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Gass3268, So outside of the statehouse not one extremist? ? ?

How about the majority of people in Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties?

You do realize modest adjustments to balance budgets and improve the economy isn't exactly a definition of extreme right?

Yeah but taking away a right is a definition of extremism.

Sigh, Collective Bargaining is not a right, it is a privilege.  Walker gave public employees the privilege to opt out of these belligerent Unions.  I know that expansion of freedom is scary to you, but it is not extremist.  Thinking you have a right from God to Bargain against the taxpayers of Wisconsin IS extremist.

Ozaukee, Waukesha and Washington Counties are the most productive, highest tax-paying people in the state, what is extreme about them?      

I guess I'm with Ronald Reagan on this one:
"These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland. The values that have inspired other dissidents under Communist domination.  They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost.  They remind us that freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.  You and I must protect and preserve freedom here or it will not be passed on to our children.  Today the workers in Poland are showing a new generation not how high is the price of freedom but how much it is worth that price."

Also:

"I happen to be the only president of a union ever to be a candidate for President of the United States.
As president of my union -- the Screen Actors Guild -- I spent many hours with the late George Meany, whose love of this country and whose belief in a strong defense against all totalitarians is one of laborís greatest legacies. "

http://www.reagan.utexas.edu/archives/reference/9.1.80.html

It's a measure of today's Republican party that it now views defending something Ronald Reagan saw as a bulwark against totalitarianism makes you in to a leftist extremist.

Reagan was probably talking about private sector Unions.  He ordered the air traffic controllers back to work and desertified that Union as I recall.  

I guess I'm with FDR on this one:
"The process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service," Roosevelt wrote in 1937 to the National Federation of Federal Employees. Yes, public workers may demand fair treatment, wrote Roosevelt. But, he wrote, "I want to emphasize my conviction that militant tactics have no place" in the public sector. "A strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent on their part to prevent or obstruct the operations of Government."
And the last prominent American Socialist
Frank Zeidler, Milwaukee's mayor in the 1950s and the last card-carrying Socialist to head a major U.S. city, supported labor. But in 1969, the progressive icon wrote that the rise of unions in government work put a competing power in charge of public business next to elected officials. Government unions "can mean considerable loss of control over the budget, and hence over tax rates," he warned.  There was "a revolutionary principle rather quietly at work in American government," he wrote.

I think I heard that 100 decibel principle at work in the Wisconsin capitol last year.  It sounded something like "I will not pay a dime toward my million dollar pension!!!"

Walker's modest shift is to try securing necessary government at a better price. The public unions, whose model depends on making government labor as costly as taxpayers will bear, object.  
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #64 on: April 11, 2012, 02:19:47 pm »
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It's really funny how many of Reagan's views wouldn't be acceptable in today's Republican party.

It makes me wonder if this is hyperbole or if this really is 21st century analog of 1930 Germany.

It's really funny how FDR and Frank Zeidler would be right-wing-extremists in today's democrat party.
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Snowstalker
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« Reply #65 on: April 11, 2012, 02:21:50 pm »
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It's really funny how many of Reagan's views wouldn't be acceptable in today's Republican party.

It makes me wonder if this is hyperbole or if this really is 21st century analog of 1930 Germany.

It's really funny how FDR and Frank Zeidler would be right-wing-extremists in today's democrat party.

It's even funnier how that's not true at all.
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #66 on: April 11, 2012, 02:23:47 pm »
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It's really funny how many of Reagan's views wouldn't be acceptable in today's Republican party.

It makes me wonder if this is hyperbole or if this really is 21st century analog of 1930 Germany.

It's really funny how FDR and Frank Zeidler would be right-wing-extremists in today's democrat party.

It's even funnier how that's not true at all.
I'd like to know how the truth "(isn't) true at all."
« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 02:25:37 pm by AmericanNation »Logged

ajb
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« Reply #67 on: April 11, 2012, 02:31:17 pm »
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I think I heard that 100 decibel principle at work in the Wisconsin capitol last year.  It sounded something like "I will not pay a dime toward my million dollar pension!!!"


If that's what you heard, then you simply weren't listening:

"In fast-moving events Friday: Leaders of the state's biggest public worker unions said they would give in to the governor's demand for concessions on workers' benefits if Walker would give up his bid to repeal nearly all public union bargaining rights; Walker rejected that offer, saying government needed more flexibility in dealing with its employees; "

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/116470423.html
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #68 on: April 11, 2012, 02:34:35 pm »
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If I was a Liberal and wanted government to start new programs and 'do' a thousand more 'wonderful' things, I wouldn't be able to because the stupid public Unions are sucking up all the money.  If someone says "tax the rich" my head will explode.  You could CONFISCATE the wealth of the "Rich" and it wouldn't be enough!    
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« Reply #69 on: April 11, 2012, 02:36:00 pm »
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This shows that Walker is more interested in radical change than in solving real problems.
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Effective policing requires to know when backing down is in the best interest of public safety.  By all accounts, the culture of the Ferguson Police was ignorant of that fact, and instead treated Cartman of South Park as a role model for how to be a police officer.
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« Reply #70 on: April 11, 2012, 02:40:32 pm »
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If I was a Liberal and wanted government to start new programs and 'do' a thousand more 'wonderful' things, I wouldn't be able to because the stupid public Unions are sucking up all the money.  If someone says "tax the rich" my head will explode.  You could CONFISCATE the wealth of the "Rich" and it wouldn't be enough!    

The point is to punish them for their crimes. I prefer the guillotine.
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #71 on: April 11, 2012, 02:41:04 pm »
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I think I heard that 100 decibel principle at work in the Wisconsin capitol last year.  It sounded something like "I will not pay a dime toward my million dollar pension!!!"


If that's what you heard, then you simply weren't listening:

"In fast-moving events Friday: Leaders of the state's biggest public worker unions said they would give in to the governor's demand for concessions on workers' benefits if Walker would give up his bid to repeal nearly all public union bargaining rights; Walker rejected that offer, saying government needed more flexibility in dealing with its employees; "

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/116470423.html

Sigh, They made that up after they lost the PR battle badly the first few days.  
"Trust us governor, we will reverse our decades long pattern of behavior and work on behalf of the taxpayers! ! !"  "Just give us all our power back so we can take you out."

They have repeatedly refused to do what you are claiming they agreed to, in the communities that are not operating under act 10 because Union controlled school boards rammed through contract extensions and are now broke and must lay off teachers.  They would rather fire their "brothers and sisters" than make the concessions they already "agreed to."
« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 02:48:15 pm by AmericanNation »Logged

ajb
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« Reply #72 on: April 11, 2012, 02:50:52 pm »
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I think I heard that 100 decibel principle at work in the Wisconsin capitol last year.  It sounded something like "I will not pay a dime toward my million dollar pension!!!"


If that's what you heard, then you simply weren't listening:

"In fast-moving events Friday: Leaders of the state's biggest public worker unions said they would give in to the governor's demand for concessions on workers' benefits if Walker would give up his bid to repeal nearly all public union bargaining rights; Walker rejected that offer, saying government needed more flexibility in dealing with its employees; "

http://www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/116470423.html

Sigh, They made that up after they lost the PR battle badly the first few days.  
"Trust us governor, we will reverse our decades long pattern of behavior and work on behalf of the taxpayers! ! !"  "Just give us all our power back so we can take you out."

They have repeatedly refused to do what you are claiming they agreed to, in the communities that are not operating under act 10 because Union controlled school boards rammed through contract extensions and are now broke and must lay off teachers.  They would rather fire their "brothers and sisters" than make the concessions they already "agreed too."

Don't forget, of course, that the Wisconsin state pension system was one of the very few in the country that was properly funded all along, while composing 1.35% of the state budget:

http://www.stateline.org/live/details/story?contentId=556976

And, since pension contributions were deferred compensation, Wisconsin public-sector workers were actually paying for their pension themselves after all. What Gov. Walker was asking them to do was not to contribute more to their pensions, but to take a pay cut.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2011/02/25/the-wisconsin-lie-exposed-taxpayers-actually-contribute-nothing-to-public-employee-pensions/
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AmericanNation
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« Reply #73 on: April 11, 2012, 02:55:15 pm »
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wow!,

 not paying anything toward your pension = "paying for their pension themselves after all"

and

"deferred compensation" = I get paid after I stop working via "Magic"
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ajb
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« Reply #74 on: April 11, 2012, 03:00:18 pm »
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wow!,

 not paying anything toward your pension = "paying for their pension themselves after all"

and

"deferred compensation" = I get paid after I stop working via "Magic"
No, "deferred compensation", meaning "I'll take some of my salary now, and put some of it into a pension fund instead."
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