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| | |-+  Zimmerman charged with Second Degree Murder
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Author Topic: Zimmerman charged with Second Degree Murder  (Read 1565 times)
The Mikado
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« on: April 11, 2012, 05:40:04 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?
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« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2012, 05:49:28 pm »
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Predictions for a verdict?
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« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2012, 06:18:56 pm »
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It's still going to make federal hate crime charges harder since he didn't think  "Oooooooh, tonight I'll kill a black kid".
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And let's be honest, Obama could take a selfie of his junk in the bathroom mirror with his BlackBerry, have it transferred to canvas and you'd have people saying it ought to be hung in the National Gallery.

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« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2012, 06:19:40 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

They may accept a plea for that but charge high, accept lower?  Badger?  Thoughts?
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And let's be honest, Obama could take a selfie of his junk in the bathroom mirror with his BlackBerry, have it transferred to canvas and you'd have people saying it ought to be hung in the National Gallery.

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« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2012, 06:23:04 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

They may accept a plea for that but charge high, accept lower?  Badger?  Thoughts?

Overcharging is common.

I saw a similar case where the DA (guess who) charge Murder 1, Murder 3, and Voluntary Manslaughter.  The first two were dismissed at the preliminary hearing.  He was found not guilty on the third.

Joe Amendola was his lawyer.  Wink
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J. J.

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« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2012, 06:52:46 pm »
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Not guilty from the facts of the case, but he'll probably have crappy legal representation and of course a hostile jury so it's debatable.
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Sam Spade
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« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2012, 06:58:43 pm »
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Sounds to me like overcharging, hoping he's dumb enough to take Voluntary Man as a plea.  And quiet down the nutjob blacks, though it won't.

Based on the facts, I don't see how you get a verdict for more the Voluntary Man, or if you do, how that verdict is upheld.
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RG Fritz
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« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2012, 07:00:31 pm »
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He will attempt to have the case dismissed under Stand Your Ground.  That will fail.  Then, they will plea bargain for manslaughter.
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« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2012, 07:02:31 pm »
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Whatever happens, he will get a chance to have a trial. Trayvon Martin never did.
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« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2012, 07:10:09 pm »
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This is very fair. I doubt Angela Corey would have charged without having good reason, she's a tough prosecutor and knows her job. Pulling the race card on either side right now is absolutely ridiculous. I'm sure Corey will be enemy number one for the right-wing, because she didn't do what they wanted.
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« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2012, 07:12:39 pm »
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Not guilty from the facts of the case, but he'll probably have crappy legal representation and of course a hostile jury so it's debatable.

I wouldn't be ready to say not guilty.  The forensic evidence will be telling.
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J. J.

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« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2012, 07:14:22 pm »
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We still don't know all the facts of the case, not as well as the people involved. I would not say guilty or not guilty based on public media reports alone. Let the process play out.
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They call me PR
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« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2012, 07:31:05 pm »
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Not guilty from the facts of the case

wat
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« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2012, 07:41:53 pm »
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I thought an arrest might be coming down the pipe when I saw this yesterday:

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The following are details from a press conference by the former attorneys for George Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch volunteer who authorities say fatally shot an unarmed teenager in Florida. The attorneys said Tuesday that they're no longer representing him, because they have lost contact with him.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/10/zimmerman-attorneys-to-speak/?hpt=hp_c1

The whole incident just seemed strange, calling a press conference to tell reporters they are no longer representing their client.  I suspect the fact they no longer seemed to know their client's whereabouts was alarming to Angela Corey.

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Uhrig said Zimmerman has taken his own steps since they lost contact with him on Sunday, including:

– Speaking to Fox News' Sean Hannity by phone, apparently off the record. "(Hannity) is not willing to tell us what our client told him."

What?  Zimmerman was not in contact with his attorneys but was willing to talk with Faux News?  No comment.


« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 07:45:21 pm by Ogre Mage »Logged
Paul Kemp
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« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2012, 07:47:42 pm »
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I really haven't paid attention to this at all (or at least as much as most people) but people don't actually think he shouldn't be charged, do they? Even if you think he's not guilty, let it go to trial.

On the matter of guilt or innocence, my belief is that the shooting wasn't justified in any manner. Even with a "Stand Your Ground" law, it is my opinion that he declined that right when he started pursuing Martin.

Obviously, no one has all the facts though.
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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2012, 07:57:56 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.
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« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2012, 08:05:48 pm »
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Wormyguy's special talent is disagreeing with everything that a majority of people believe.
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« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2012, 08:15:54 pm »
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I really haven't paid attention to this at all (or at least as much as most people) but people don't actually think he shouldn't be charged, do they? Even if you think he's not guilty, let it go to trial.

On the matter of guilt or innocence, my belief is that the shooting wasn't justified in any manner. Even with a "Stand Your Ground" law, it is my opinion that he declined that right when he started pursuing Martin.

Obviously, no one has all the facts though.

You have put your finger on a salient point -- the reason this case blew up the way it did was because the shooter was, up till this point, not charged and the local police seemed to just take his statements at face value in spite of the fact there were significant problems with his story.  One would think they would have tried a little harder when there was a dead body of an unarmed teenager.

Faux News and its affiliates, of course, are making a full-blown attempt to stir up white resentment.  I suspect most of them have never had the experience of being accosted by the police or store security "driving while black," "walking while black" or "shopping while black."
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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2012, 09:01:50 pm »
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http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/10/zimmerman-attorneys-to-speak/?hpt=hp_c1

The whole incident just seemed strange, calling a press conference to tell reporters they are no longer representing their client.  I suspect the fact they no longer seemed to know their client's whereabouts was alarming to Angela Corey.

Quote
Uhrig said Zimmerman has taken his own steps since they lost contact with him on Sunday, including:

– Speaking to Fox News' Sean Hannity by phone, apparently off the record. "(Hannity) is not willing to tell us what our client told him."

What?  Zimmerman was not in contact with his attorneys but was willing to talk with Faux News?  No comment.
You trying to get a job at NBC?

The very next line says:

Quote
– Calling the special prosecutor's office directly, as opposed to through his attorneys, and offering to come in and answer investigators' questions. The prosecutor's office told Zimmerman that they weren't going to talk to him without counsel, Uhrig said.
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Paul Kemp
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« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2012, 09:31:56 pm »
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I can't believe I didn't think of this before. Here's a somewhat similar situation that happened on Long Island a few years ago, with a black father shooting a white teen in front of his home:

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/miller-place-man-who-shot-teen-surrenders-heads-to-jail-1.2086763

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Black-Father-Finally-Jailed-For-Killing-White-Teen-98042434.html

Interesting case to compare and contrast.
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Sam Spade
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« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2012, 09:54:09 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Go re-read the Florida statute, Torie.  By your post, it implies that you haven't.  Smiley
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J. J.
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« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2012, 09:56:50 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Some of his story might check out.  911 supposedly asked him for the address and claims he stopped to check the house number.

This one is going to be dependent on forensics, i.e. how far was Martin away from the gun, and what was the angle of the bullet?
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J. J.

"Actually, .. now that you mention it...." 
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Torie
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« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2012, 10:05:07 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Go re-read the Florida statute, Torie.  By your post, it implies that you haven't.  Smiley

I didn't. Does it have a curve ball in it?
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Sam Spade
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« Reply #23 on: April 11, 2012, 10:11:59 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Go re-read the Florida statute, Torie.  By your post, it implies that you haven't.  Smiley

I didn't. Does it have a curve ball in it?

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0782/0782ContentsIndex.html&StatuteYear=2011&Title=-%3E2011-%3EChapter%20782
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« Reply #24 on: April 11, 2012, 11:20:58 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Go re-read the Florida statute, Torie.  By your post, it implies that you haven't.  Smiley

I didn't. Does it have a curve ball in it?

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0782/0782ContentsIndex.html&StatuteYear=2011&Title=-%3E2011-%3EChapter%20782

If Zimmerman is telling the truth, I think it would be justifiable under this statute:


782.02 Justifiable use of deadly force.—The use of deadly force is justifiable when a person is resisting any attempt to murder such person or to commit any felony upon him or her or upon or in any dwelling house in which such person shall be.


http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0782/Sections/0782.02.html
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J. J.

"Actually, .. now that you mention it...." 
- Londo Molari

"Every government are parliaments of whores.
The trouble is, in a democracy the whores are us." - P. J. O'Rourke

"Wa sala, wa lala."

(Zulu for, "You snooze, you lose.")
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