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Ogre Mage
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« Reply #25 on: April 11, 2012, 11:49:36 pm »
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http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/10/zimmerman-attorneys-to-speak/?hpt=hp_c1

The whole incident just seemed strange, calling a press conference to tell reporters they are no longer representing their client.  I suspect the fact they no longer seemed to know their client's whereabouts was alarming to Angela Corey.

Quote
Uhrig said Zimmerman has taken his own steps since they lost contact with him on Sunday, including:

– Speaking to Fox News' Sean Hannity by phone, apparently off the record. "(Hannity) is not willing to tell us what our client told him."

What?  Zimmerman was not in contact with his attorneys but was willing to talk with Faux News?  No comment.
You trying to get a job at NBC?

The very next line says:

Quote
– Calling the special prosecutor's office directly, as opposed to through his attorneys, and offering to come in and answer investigators' questions. The prosecutor's office told Zimmerman that they weren't going to talk to him without counsel, Uhrig said.

Which part of the bolded statement is not clear?  Since you seem so sympathetic to Zimmerman's position, perhaps you can explain why he stopped communicating with his legal counsel but was willing to talk with Sean Hannity.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 11:52:59 pm by Ogre Mage »Logged
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« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2012, 12:13:26 am »
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My guess is that he'll be found not guilty.
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« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2012, 12:23:34 am »
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This is very fair. I doubt Angela Corey would have charged without having good reason, she's a tough prosecutor and knows her job. Pulling the race card on either side right now is absolutely ridiculous. I'm sure Corey will be enemy number one for the right-wing, because she didn't do what they wanted.

Since she's a Republican and Zimmerman is a registered Democrat, that'd be quite odd. And probably why it won't happen.
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« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2012, 12:36:50 pm »
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Spade, would you go for a trial by judge (if that's an option in FL) or a jury, assuming no plea bargain is achieved?

I think the jury would be scared as hell to acquit, but a judge might look strictly at facts, not sentiment or be influenced by fear.

Interesting question (to me).
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« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2012, 12:45:34 pm »
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Spade, would you go for a trial by judge (if that's an option in FL) or a jury, assuming no plea bargain is achieved?

I think the jury would be scared as hell to acquit, but a judge might look strictly at facts, not sentiment or be influenced by fear.

Interesting question (to me).

They'll probably be trying to get a jury who doesn't know / hasn't paid attention to the case in the media.
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« Reply #30 on: April 12, 2012, 02:29:54 pm »
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At this point, knowing that he's actually going to be tried and attention paid is enough for me--a guilty verdict may well be impossible under current FL law. It's too late to make up for the negligence that the killing of this kid got in the first days when evidence could have been gathered but Zimmerman was treated like nothing had happened. But it's the best that could happen now.
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« Reply #31 on: April 12, 2012, 02:54:56 pm »
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Spade, would you go for a trial by judge (if that's an option in FL) or a jury, assuming no plea bargain is achieved?

I think the jury would be scared as hell to acquit, but a judge might look strictly at facts, not sentiment or be influenced by fear.

Interesting question (to me).

They'll probably be trying to get a jury who doesn't know / hasn't paid attention to the case in the media.
Good luck.
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« Reply #32 on: April 12, 2012, 02:57:48 pm »
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The whole incident just seemed strange, calling a press conference to tell reporters they are no longer representing their client.  I suspect the fact they no longer seemed to know their client's whereabouts was alarming to Angela Corey.

Quote

– Speaking to Fox News' Sean Hannity by phone, apparently off the record.

What?  Zimmerman was not in contact with his attorneys but was willing to talk with Faux News?

You trying to get a job at NBC?

The very next line says:

Quote
– Calling the special prosecutor's office directly,

Which part of the bolded statement is not clear?  Since you seem so sympathetic to Zimmerman's position, perhaps you can explain why he stopped communicating with his legal counsel but was willing to talk with Sean Hannity.
Wannabe NBC producer contends that Angela Corey would be alarmed that the attorneys didn't know where Zimmerman was; but Zimmerman had called her office.

BTW, Zimmerman's new lawyer suggested that it was quite unusual for a pair of lawyers to announce they weren't going to represent Zimmerman any more, and then talk to the press for another hour.

Maybe Angela Corey was concerned that she was looking at the possibility of a murder conviction overturned on grounds of incompetent legal defense.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2012, 03:03:17 pm by jimrtex »Logged
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« Reply #33 on: April 12, 2012, 03:35:20 pm »
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Spade, would you go for a trial by judge (if that's an option in FL) or a jury, assuming no plea bargain is achieved?

I think the jury would be scared as hell to acquit, but a judge might look strictly at facts, not sentiment or be influenced by fear.

Interesting question (to me).

They'll probably be trying to get a jury who doesn't know / hasn't paid attention to the case in the media.
Good luck.

This is the United States.  It'd be, sadly, trivially easy to find a dozen people who have never even heard of this case.
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« Reply #34 on: April 13, 2012, 12:46:30 am »
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The guy is obviously an idiot (note this previous behavior that caused his attorneys to jump ship), so turning a jury on him shouldn't be too hard.
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« Reply #35 on: April 13, 2012, 02:01:54 pm »
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Second degree is too much. It'll end up being something much less.

The main difference between Florida's law and the Castle "Make My Day" Law, is standing your ground.

In a state such as Ohio, if someone is forcefully intruding into your home or even your car, you can simply kill that person if you feel your life is in danger. However, once that person is turned away running, you can no longer do that.

Under Florida's law, however, that person could be running and be in a car and you can say, "Gimme that sniper rifle" and still take them out no matter how far they've ran.

Technically, as terrible a case as this is, the facts will have to be determined, but the law may very well be on Zimmerman's side.

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« Reply #36 on: April 13, 2012, 02:53:58 pm »
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Technically, as terrible a case as this is, the facts will have to be determined, but the law may very well be on Zimmerman's side.

Yes, that's how I feel. With the law being the way it is, it's easy to get away with killing people, and the verdict will reflect that.
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« Reply #37 on: April 13, 2012, 03:12:28 pm »
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A bit surprised...I'd thought they would've gone for Voluntary Manslaughter.

Thoughts?

As to why not VM, it seemed too "deliberate" in the sense of a rather calm and measured approach to it all by the Z man, assuming there is no evidence of an "unexpected" physical altercation alleged by Zimmerman.

Go re-read the Florida statute, Torie.  By your post, it implies that you haven't.  Smiley

I didn't. Does it have a curve ball in it?

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0782/0782ContentsIndex.html&StatuteYear=2011&Title=-%3E2011-%3EChapter%20782

If Zimmerman is telling the truth, I think it would be justifiable under this statute:


782.02 Justifiable use of deadly force.—The use of deadly force is justifiable when a person is resisting any attempt to murder such person or to commit any felony upon him or her or upon or in any dwelling house in which such person shall be.


http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0782/Sections/0782.02.html

I'm pretty sure the duty to retreat still applies, no? Here's further reading, for when it doesn't:

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0776/0776ContentsIndex.html
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« Reply #38 on: April 15, 2012, 02:41:44 pm »
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The whole incident just seemed strange, calling a press conference to tell reporters they are no longer representing their client.  I suspect the fact they no longer seemed to know their client's whereabouts was alarming to Angela Corey.

Quote

– Speaking to Fox News' Sean Hannity by phone, apparently off the record.

What?  Zimmerman was not in contact with his attorneys but was willing to talk with Faux News?

You trying to get a job at NBC?

The very next line says:

Quote
– Calling the special prosecutor's office directly,

Which part of the bolded statement is not clear?  Since you seem so sympathetic to Zimmerman's position, perhaps you can explain why he stopped communicating with his legal counsel but was willing to talk with Sean Hannity.
Wannabe NBC producer contends that Angela Corey would be alarmed that the attorneys didn't know where Zimmerman was; but Zimmerman had called her office.

BTW, Zimmerman's new lawyer suggested that it was quite unusual for a pair of lawyers to announce they weren't going to represent Zimmerman any more, and then talk to the press for another hour.

Maybe Angela Corey was concerned that she was looking at the possibility of a murder conviction overturned on grounds of incompetent legal defense.

I see you conveniently edited out the full text of what I had posted and have sunk to referring to me as a "wannabe NBC producer" which is typical trollish behavior.  That is very much like something one would see on Faux News.

The attorneys statements essentially say that Zimmerman had gone rogue and they do not know where he is or what he is doing (since he is not following their instructions).  They realized they needed to absolve themselves of responsibility for his actions.  

Quote
"He has gone on his own. I don't know what he's doing or who he's talking to," Sonner said. "... “I cannot represent a client who doesn’t stay in contact with me.”

It is not a coincidence that Corey arrested Zimmerman exactly one day after this statement was made.
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« Reply #39 on: April 16, 2012, 11:01:25 am »
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Wannabe NBC producer contends that Angela Corey would be alarmed that the attorneys didn't know where Zimmerman was; but Zimmerman had called her office.

BTW, Zimmerman's new lawyer suggested that it was quite unusual for a pair of lawyers to announce they weren't going to represent Zimmerman any more, and then talk to the press for another hour.

Maybe Angela Corey was concerned that she was looking at the possibility of a murder conviction overturned on grounds of incompetent legal defense.
The attorneys statements essentially say that Zimmerman had gone rogue and they do not know where he is or what he is doing (since he is not following their instructions).  They realized they needed to absolve themselves of responsibility for his actions.  

Quote
"He has gone on his own. I don't know what he's doing or who he's talking to," Sonner said. "... “I cannot represent a client who doesn’t stay in contact with me.”

It is not a coincidence that Corey arrested Zimmerman exactly one day after this statement was made.
Corey filed charges, and Zimmerman voluntarily surrendered the same day, with new competent counsel.

Zimmerman realized he was getting crap representation, and probably called Corey saying he was willing to testify before a grand jury, or to talk to her investigators, or surrender if she charged him with a crime.

Remember, he didn't have a lawyer when he talked to the police the night of the shooting or the day after when he did the walk through.

She told him he needed a lawyer, and likely that he needed a good one, that she was not willing to risk getting a conviction overturned based on ineffective legal representation.   

While it is unlikely that she would make a comment on Sonner specifically, that someone would talk to the press for an hour about their former client really brings into question their professional ethics.
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