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|-+  Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion
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| | |-+  Political party shifting?
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Author Topic: Political party shifting?  (Read 929 times)
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MagneticFree
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« on: April 19, 2012, 12:13:43 am »
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I think after the 2012 elections is the start of both political parties shifting positions.  

The Republicans becoming more Libertarian, open to legalizing drugs, civil unions, non-intervention, more focused on economy and business.  I've noticed alot of Tea Party people and social Conservatives are not thrilled with Romney and could form a new party in another decade or something.

Democrats appealing to working class hispanics, unions, the poor, and possibly catering to religious right (catholics)

What's your say?
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« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2012, 12:20:18 am »
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no, its difficult to see the religious right voting democrat. The democratic party has a large secular and jewish following and many of them won't want to be in the same party as evangelicals.
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« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2012, 07:17:20 am »
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Can't see it unless the religious right leaves the Republican party. No way the Bachmanns and Santorums of them are quiet about legalizing drugs or civil unions. But as we drift into much more economic-centric times, I could see them becoming a purely fiscally conservative party and the Democrats pure fiscal liberals, with positions on social issues varying from person to person.
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morgieb
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« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2012, 07:26:02 am »
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Can't see it unless the religious right leaves the Republican party. No way the Bachmanns and Santorums of them are quiet about legalizing drugs or civil unions. But as we drift into much more economic-centric times, I could see them becoming a purely fiscally conservative party and the Democrats pure fiscal liberals, with positions on social issues varying from person to person.
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« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2012, 09:05:51 am »
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I think after the 2012 elections is the start of both political parties shifting positions.  

The Republicans becoming more Libertarian, open to legalizing drugs, civil unions, non-intervention, more focused on economy and business.  I've noticed alot of Tea Party people and social Conservatives are not thrilled with Romney and could form a new party in another decade or something.

Democrats appealing to working class hispanics, unions, the poor, and possibly catering to religious right (catholics)

What's your say?
The GOP doesn't favor civil unions now? Its the gay marriage topic issue that the GOP dreads. Legazlizing drugs for medical use I could see the GOP being in favor of in the future like in California that has happened. I know California is a pretty blue state but I'm just using CA as an example if that makes any sense.
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hopper
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« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2012, 09:15:07 am »
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I think after the 2012 elections is the start of both political parties shifting positions.  

The Republicans becoming more Libertarian, open to legalizing drugs, civil unions, non-intervention, more focused on economy and business.  I've noticed alot of Tea Party people and social Conservatives are not thrilled with Romney and could form a new party in another decade or something.

Democrats appealing to working class hispanics, unions, the poor, and possibly catering to religious right (catholics)

What's your say?
No the Tea Party has faded. I know Amy Kremer is still on TV doing publicity for the Tea Party but I just see the Tea Party thing as a fad that has passed. The Tea Party lost all their postiive image during the whole debt ceiling debate last year.

The Republicans really haven't loved any Presidential Candidate since Reagan besides George W. Bush in 2000 I think and we all know what happened there. I really don't think they were totally in love with George H.W. Bush in 1988 either I think but since he worked as Reagan's VP for 8 years it was "safe" for conservatives to sort of love him if you know what I mean.
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« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2012, 09:18:46 am »
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Democrats will become more working-class oriented, winning minorities and blue-collar whites. Republicans will be a combination of WASPs (especially white-collar suburbia) and other assorted groups of white people.
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« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2012, 09:50:28 am »
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Democrats will become more working-class oriented, winning minorities and blue-collar whites. Republicans will be a combination of WASPs (especially white-collar suburbia) and other assorted groups of white people.
Are you including White Hispanics in your theory as well?
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Snowstalker
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« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2012, 12:44:07 pm »
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Cubans are affluent and will probably remain a Lean R group. Hispanics overall will be more integrated as white Hispanics are considered white, black Hispanics black, etc. Mexicans and Puerto Ricans are more working-class and will likely remain Democratic, though based on Mexico's politics, Mexicans may become somewhat more right-wing in the future.
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Miles
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« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2012, 01:58:43 pm »
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I think, sadly from my view, that both parties will move towards social liberalism.
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SJoyce
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« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2012, 06:03:41 pm »
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I think, sadly from my view, that both parties will move towards social liberalism.

Aren't they always moving towards social liberalism (wouldn't a social conservative today be considered a liberal 50 years ago)?
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Lowly Griff
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« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2012, 09:58:15 pm »
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I think, sadly from my view, that both parties will move towards social liberalism.

Aren't they always moving towards social liberalism (wouldn't a social conservative today be considered a liberal 50 years ago)?

Social issues are more "complex" now than they were fifty years ago, but I would wager that the average Republican motivated by social issues today is at the very least no more liberal than one fifty years ago. We're back to debating long settled precedents regarding social issues.

I think that the Democratic Party has quietly been shifting for the better part of two decades and has done so without causing great damage to the institution. It may have kept us as perennial underdogs for some time, but that time is coming to an end as the demographics spell doom for one party, and it's not us. The Democratic Party has moved closer to the center than it was in past decades (I've never understood people saying Democrats are more liberal than they were when it comes to economic issues). Both parties have become more conservative on economics, with the main difference now being on social issues. Democrats champion old Republican economic policies while the new Republicans champion something that can only be laughed at by Democrats and any old school Republican.

The Republican Party, on the other hand, is heading face-first into something that they cannot retract from until the party finally implodes. Out of the ruins of the social conservative movement will come the three components: Corporatists, Libertarians and Evangelicals. I feel that the Evangelicals will find themselves without a home in the coming years, as I'm sure the Libertarians and Corporatists can work something out (social liberalism with corporate capitalism that masquerades as free enterprise).
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« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2012, 10:12:02 pm »
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Cubans are affluent and will probably remain a Lean R group. Hispanics overall will be more integrated as white Hispanics are considered white, black Hispanics black, etc. Mexicans and Puerto Ricans are more working-class and will likely remain Democratic, though based on Mexico's politics, Mexicans may become somewhat more right-wing in the future.
Any data on that? I'd be pretty surprised if Cubans were affluent considering they came with literally nothing to US.
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SJoyce
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« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2012, 08:26:35 pm »
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I think, sadly from my view, that both parties will move towards social liberalism.

Aren't they always moving towards social liberalism (wouldn't a social conservative today be considered a liberal 50 years ago)?

Social issues are more "complex" now than they were fifty years ago, but I would wager that the average Republican motivated by social issues today is at the very least no more liberal than one fifty years ago. We're back to debating long settled precedents regarding social issues.

I think that the Democratic Party has quietly been shifting for the better part of two decades and has done so without causing great damage to the institution. It may have kept us as perennial underdogs for some time, but that time is coming to an end as the demographics spell doom for one party, and it's not us. The Democratic Party has moved closer to the center than it was in past decades (I've never understood people saying Democrats are more liberal than they were when it comes to economic issues). Both parties have become more conservative on economics, with the main difference now being on social issues. Democrats champion old Republican economic policies while the new Republicans champion something that can only be laughed at by Democrats and any old school Republican.

The Republican Party, on the other hand, is heading face-first into something that they cannot retract from until the party finally implodes. Out of the ruins of the social conservative movement will come the three components: Corporatists, Libertarians and Evangelicals. I feel that the Evangelicals will find themselves without a home in the coming years, as I'm sure the Libertarians and Corporatists can work something out (social liberalism with corporate capitalism that masquerades as free enterprise).

Well then 100 years or something, a significant length of time ago. But you're entirely correct on how the parties have been shifting, or at least the Democrats. I could see the Libertarians abandoning the Republicans quite soon to either make a significant LP or join the Democrats (people a la Schweitzer, Tester, Webb, and Paul Hackett), with a Corporationist-Evangelical alliance (you'll be conservative economically, we'll be conservative socially). Hey, I vote Democrat locally (for my State Rep./State Senator/Governor/Mayor, and usually do so for House/Senate when there's no LP candidate or the Republican's a social conservative). When Ralph Nader's backing Ron Paul, this is entirely possible.
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JohanusCalvinusLibertas
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« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2012, 09:18:10 pm »
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The Tea Party is alive and well. Second, social conservatives have massive problems with corpratists.  We'd stay in alliance with the libertarians. The corpratists and the moderates are made for each other. They can also take the neocons with them as we kick them out of the GOP.
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SJoyce
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« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2012, 10:42:46 pm »
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The Tea Party is alive and well. Second, social conservatives have massive problems with corpratists.  We'd stay in alliance with the libertarians. The corpratists and the moderates are made for each other. They can also take the neocons with them as we kick them out of the GOP.

I have never seen how that works. Libertarians really have massive issues with neocons and especially social conservatives. That alliance would break the first time a libertarian tries to repeal drug laws, or a social conservative tries to shove through some kind of national marriage amendment. The coalition may work economically (ex: Tea Party), but shatters when social and foreign policy issues take center stage.
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