Countries with no suburbs

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

do any exist?

[John Dibble]

If they do, they probably aren't very advanced.

You obsess over things way too much. Nader, now suburbs.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It boggles my mind why anyone would want to live in such awful places. It's like moving to Fallujah.

According to an online directory I found, there's a total of 3 strip clubs in the entire suburban Twin Cities area, technically 4 but one is all male. And there's a total of 14 in the Twin Cities. What the hell do people do out in that wasteland that is the suburban Twin Cities? I wonder this every time I drive through it and see lots of identical looking houses.

[12th Doctor]

It boggles my mind why anyone would want to live in such awful places. It's like moving to Fallujah.

According to an online directory I found, there's a total of 3 strip clubs in the entire suburban Twin Cities area, technically 4 but one is all male. And there's a total of 14 in the Twin Cities. What the hell do people do out in that wasteland that is the suburban Twin Cities? I wonder this every time I drive through it and see lots of identical looking houses.

One of the things that I pride myself for, is having developed an understanding that it is okay that not all people share my values and just accepting the fact.  In fact, I have even come to the point of maturity that I can acctually understand where they are coming from and try to relate to it.

Obviously, you have not yet reached this point of development.  Many never do.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Oh well. Pretty much everyone I know down here agrees with me though that the Twin Cities are hoping places and the suburbs are boring as hel (except for the Mall of America). I actually have lots of friends who grew up in the suburbs and they all hated it.

[opebo]

BRTD, there are even lots of suburbs here in Thailand.  They suck.

I think your best bet would be Europe, where 'suburban' is typically a very downmarket address.  All the richer people prefer to live in central cities, and suburbs are mostly where the working class or poor immigrants dwell.

[Bono]

BRTD, there are even lots of suburbs here in Thailand.  They suck.

I think your best bet would be Europe, where 'suburban' is typically a very downmarket address.  All the richer people prefer to live in central cities, and suburbs are mostly where the working class or poor immigrants dwell.

You obviously don't know europe that well.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I've heard some horrible stories about German suburbs. Although the French had an interesting way of dealing with it, they forced all the poor people outside the cities and basically built a lot of sh**tholes around it. So most suburbs in France are Camden or East St. Louis type ones. Beats the hell out of your typical lily-white one in the US, that's for sure, although I definately can't approve of that since it's class warfare at the worst.

What I would do if I were dictator of Minnesota is expand the Twin Cities areas to take in Richfield and St. Louis Park and South St. Paul, etc., although I'd bulldoze the space wasting suburban communities in those areas, and then build urban style housing or apartments in its place. Then I'd basically wipe out the outer layers and force the people back into the new urban style housing I'm building, saving a lot of space. Then put a bunch of government run farms and factories in the old suburban areas, thus keeping all the pollution and problems away from residential areas, and stopping further sprawl.

[Bono]

Oh well. Pretty much everyone I know down here agrees with me though that the Twin Cities are hoping places and the suburbs are boring as hel (except for the Mall of America). I actually have lots of friends who grew up in the suburbs and they all hated it.

You allwyas have a lot of friends who support your beliefs. First it was private schools, now this. Unless you are a magnet of other looney leftists, and a repeler of anyone to the right of Pelosi, I seriously doubt your assertions.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Oh well. Pretty much everyone I know down here agrees with me though that the Twin Cities are hoping places and the suburbs are boring as hel (except for the Mall of America). I actually have lots of friends who grew up in the suburbs and they all hated it.

You allwyas have a lot of friends who support your beliefs. First it was private schools, now this. Unless you are a magnet of other looney leftists, and a repeler of anyone to the right of Pelosi, I seriously doubt your assertions.

I go to a very liberal university in a pretty damn liberal city, and most of my friends would classify as "loony leftists" to you although I'm significantly to the left of most of them. I don't associate with anyone who likes Bush though, I know that.

[12th Doctor]

He is a better question, if I were a father, why would I want my family to be around all the crime and depravity if they don't have to be?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

You don't. My aunt has lived in Minneapolis for over 10 years, she lives in a fairly safe neighborhood that's probably safter than the one I live in, and has never been the victim of any sort of crime.

I remember growing up in my sterile boring yet safe city when my mom would talk about how awful it was her sister actually had to lock her doors every night. oh the humanity!

[12th Doctor]

You don't. My aunt has lived in Minneapolis for over 10 years, she lives in a fairly safe neighborhood that's probably safter than the one I live in, and has never been the victim of any sort of crime.

I remember growing up in my sterile boring yet safe city when my mom would talk about how awful it was her sister actually had to lock her doors every night. oh the humanity!

Trust me, most cities are not like that.  Minneapolis must be safer and more wealthy than Erie, cauae where I live is nothing like what you described.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

There are some fairly bad parts of Minneapolis, but most of the city is not like those areas. She lives fairly close to the University of Minnesota where she works, so I guess it's not entirely safe since you do have the rioting drunk college students, but even with the recent riots up there they wasn't any property damage in her neighborhood.

[A18]

Antarctica doesn't have many, but I already claimed it.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I looked up the stats on Minneapolis and Erie:

http://www.city-data.com/city/Erie-Pennsylvania.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Minneapolis-Minnesota.html

first of all, Erie is not a major city. There's more people in Sioux Falls.

Anyway, the stats are interesting. Yes, Minneapolis is wealthier, median income is about $38k compared to $28k for Erie. However, crime is not. Minneapolis has a crime index of 597.1, with 330.6 being the national average. Erie however has a 269.1, which is LOWER than the national average. There aren't any crime stats for my city, but I'd guess that they're pretty close to Erie's.

[David S]

It boggles my mind why anyone would want to live in such awful places. It's like moving to Fallujah.

According to an online directory I found, there's a total of 3 strip clubs in the entire suburban Twin Cities area, technically 4 but one is all male. And there's a total of 14 in the Twin Cities. What the hell do people do out in that wasteland that is the suburban Twin Cities? I wonder this every time I drive through it and see lots of identical looking houses.

Is quality of life measured by the number of strip clubs?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

not exactly, but the corrrelation of strip clubs to how fun a city is is usually pretty accurate.

anyway, I think we're basically comparing apples to oranges above, since not only is Minneapolis almost 4x the size of Erie, but it sounds as if soulty lives in one of the most dangerous parts of Erie, while my aunt lives in one of the safest parts of Minneapolis. However this proves my point, you can live in a major city and not have to worry about a drive by gang shooting every night. There's no reason to flee to the cultural wasteland of suburbia.

[12th Doctor]

I looked up the stats on Minneapolis and Erie:

http://www.city-data.com/city/Erie-Pennsylvania.html
http://www.city-data.com/city/Minneapolis-Minnesota.html

first of all, Erie is not a major city. There's more people in Sioux Falls.

Anyway, the stats are interesting. Yes, Minneapolis is wealthier, median income is about $38k compared to $28k for Erie. However, crime is not. Minneapolis has a crime index of 597.1, with 330.6 being the national average. Erie however has a 269.1, which is LOWER than the national average. There aren't any crime stats for my city, but I'd guess that they're pretty close to Erie's.

Erie is much smaller than Minneapolis.  Only about 1/5 as large.  When crime happens here, we tend to notice and it happens often.  I know 15 college girls who mugged and raped or almost raped my first year up here, by the locals.  Homeless people also tend to congregate here.  Some of them are nice and I have helped them out when I could.  Some are not so nice.  The police are very busy here.  Also, the areas surrounding Erie have basically molded into the cities, they are barely suburbs anymore, and there is no telling where the city stops and they begin, without a map, so Erie acctually has a population about the size of Pittsburgh (proper).  Still far smaller than the Minneapolis/St.Paul area, but large enough to count.

[12th Doctor]

not exactly, but the corrrelation of strip clubs to how fun a city is is usually pretty accurate.

anyway, I think we're basically comparing apples to oranges above, since not only is Minneapolis almost 4x the size of Erie, but it sounds as if soulty lives in one of the most dangerous parts of Erie, while my aunt lives in one of the safest parts of Minneapolis. However this proves my point, you can live in a major city and not have to worry about a drive by gang shooting every night. There's no reason to flee to the cultural wasteland of suburbia.

Is there a non-dangerous part of Erie?  If there is, I have yet to find it.  It is estimated that 50% (!) of all crimes in this city go unreported or are just ignored by the police, because there are too few police in the city and county to respond to all of the problems.

[opebo]

What's the street scene like in Minneapolis and Erie?

[12th Doctor]

Erie is not as safe as the city like to claim.  The way they run the statistics happen to favor Erie's image quite a bit.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

well the crime rate is lower than the national average. it's also lower than the rate in Des Moines, Iowa, and anyone who gets scared in Des Moines is one wussy person.

[12th Doctor]

What's the street scene like in Minneapolis and Erie?

Erie has a lot of clubs.  There is a bar or a church on ever single corner of the town.  The downtown is making a big ome back, but there is still a lot of work to be done.  Most of that comeback is because of Ridge and all the money he gave to the area, which was in serious decline through the 70's, 80's and 90's.  The unemployment rate is about 8.5%  and the mayor has been indicted for major federal offenses and ethics violations.

[12th Doctor]

well the crime rate is lower than the national average. it's also lower than the rate in Des Moines, Iowa, and anyone who gets scared in Des Moines is one wussy person.

As I explained, and as one of the police officers here told me, there is a lot more crime than the statistics show.  Most of it gets buried.