At Public Universities, Fewer Students Graduating Within 4 Years

[Frodo]

Public universities pushing ‘super-seniors’ to the graduation stage

By Daniel de Vise, Published: June 2

MADISON, Wis. — Some of the nation’s top public universities are prodding dallying students toward the graduation stage, trying to change a campus culture that assumes four-year completion is the exception rather than the rule.

It’s a move supported not just by parents whose wallets are depleted by tuition bills. University leaders are pushing for on-time completion amid criticism over wasted tax dollars, spiraling tuition and America’s plummeting global rank in college attainment.

Fewer than half of students graduate in four years at 33 of the 50 state flagship schools. The overall four-year graduation rate is 31 percent for public colleges and 52 percent for private ones, the federal government reported this year.

The universities of Maryland and Virginia are among the exceptions, with on-time graduation rates of 63 percent and 85 percent, respectively. U-Va.’s rate is the highest among public flagship schools.

“Four years and out” is a long tradition at private colleges, a value reinforced by the parents who pay the bills. Public universities, by contrast, have long tolerated the five- or six-year degree. But too often, the slow track leads nowhere.

“The longer it takes people to graduate, the less likely they are to graduate — ever,” said William Bowen, former Princeton president and co-author of the book “Crossing the Finish Line.”

[Franzl]

It's certainly uncommon for students here to actually complete undergraduate studies in the "recommended" 6 semesters.

[Kaine for Senate '18]

U-Va.’s rate is the highest among public flagship schools.

Good to see.

[JohnnyLongtorso]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

[Kevin]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

Agreed, most students learn little from these classes other then how they f**K up their GPA.

I'm speaking both my personal experience as well as what I've heard from people back at college.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

Agreed, most students learn little from these classes other then how they f**K up their GPA.

I'm speaking both my personal experience as well as what I've heard from people back at college.

I learned a bit from some of them, but those were the ones I would have taken on my own initiative anyway.

[Holmes]

Some of my general education classes were interesting, but overall pointless.

[anvi]

Anyone know about a good career-fair I can go to?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It was 5 1/2 years for me.

Popular T-shirt at my university: "Graduating in 4 years is like leaving the party at 10 o'clock."

[Associate Justice PiT]

     At UC Berkeley, majors in the realms of Chemistry & Engineering are very strict about graduating in four years. Funny enough, I've heard that the people in the Physics department don't care so much.

[TJ in Oregon]

It was 5 1/2 years for me.

Popular T-shirt at my university: "Graduating in 4 years is like leaving the party at 10 o'clock."

I have a suspicion not leaving the party at 10 o'clock when they really should is a big part of the reason many people don't graduate in 4 years.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

You can't just get rid of general education requirements if you want to have a liberal arts university as opposed to just a trade school.  The biggest obstacle to people graduating in four years seems to be all those classes required for a major that are only offered once a year and don't have enough spaces for everyone to register.

[Kevin]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

You can't just get rid of general education requirements if you want to have a liberal arts university as opposed to just a trade school.  The biggest obstacle to people graduating in four years seems to be all those classes required for a major that are only offered once a year and don't have enough spaces for everyone to register.

That and Gen Ed's.

FYI in countries like Britain, Canada and to the best of my knowledge mainland Europe's educational system stops with the interdisciplinary requirements at the end of secondary school.

I.e. if you go to university to be a math major your only studying classes pertinent to that degree while your going through undergraduate education.

Then again I've heard European's and others say that the reason we have classes like gen ed's gives American's an advantage. So I really don't know what to think?

[Queen Mum Inks.LWC]

I was 5 years, but my major was one of the biggest in the university, plus I was in the honors program (due to a scholarship, not really by choice)... and that makes me wonder, how much of this is due to the growing of things like Honors programs and "Leadership" minors, etc.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

another factor is that life after college tends to suck these days, so there's some effort to put it off as long as possible.

( lots of VA avatars in this thread for some reason )

[Franzl]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

You can't just get rid of general education requirements if you want to have a liberal arts university as opposed to just a trade school.  The biggest obstacle to people graduating in four years seems to be all those classes required for a major that are only offered once a year and don't have enough spaces for everyone to register.

That and Gen Ed's.

FYI in countries like Britain, Canada and to the best of my knowledge mainland Europe's educational system stops with the interdisciplinary requirements at the end of secondary school.

I.e. if you go to university to be a math major your only studying classes pertinent to that degree while your going through undergraduate education.

Then again I've heard European's and others say that the reason we have classes like gen ed's gives American's an advantage. So I really don't know what to think?

The problem is secondary education doesn't teach you enough in most places in America, and that's why colleges spend time doing it.

[opebo]

Relating this (conversely) to my position on the work-week and holiday-time: If four years were vouchsafed them in a less productive past, why should we not allow the children 6 or 8 years now?

[Kushahontas]

They should just cut 30 credits from the bloated general education requirements that most universities have.

Agreed, most students learn little from these classes other then how they f**K up their GPA.

I'm speaking both my personal experience as well as what I've heard from people back at college.

I definitely agree with you, here. Another problem is that so many college freshman have no idea what the hell they want to do, much less how to properly structure 4 years of 120 credit hours. I would've likely been done about a semester or two ahead of my expected graduation date if I wasn't taking unnecessary English Literature classes thinking I would be an English major before settling for Poli Sci. I wouldn't advocate waiting a year or two between high school and college to everyone, but I think I would have truly benefited from it. That said, I did alright within 4 years' time. I would've graduated on time but a last-minute minor declaration in Economics pushed that date back 1 semester.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

What's the rush?  It's not like there a millions of wonderful jobs waiting.

[anvi]

Fair warning: soapbox alert.  If you don't want to read a dissenting opinion from a fuddy-duddy college teacher, please skip.

I'm going to put in a vote for gen-ed courses here, and not just because I teach them, but because I got a lot out of them in college.  While it's true that European universities don't require much outside of one's major, it's also true that their high schools are in far better shape than ours, so by the time students get to college, their general education backgrounds are far better than ours at the equivalent level.  They also have trade-school tracks that are different from the academic high-school to college track.  But there are more than just structural reasons for gen-ed courses.  My first college teaching job was remedial comp at Temple University, and the number of native-English speakers who could not, after twelve years of schooling, write a complete sentence or a coherent paragraph was astounding.  For jobs you will likely seek after college, good communication skills are important.  On top of that, classes in English lit, if you read the materials assigned, can often reveal a lot about human nature that is both valuable and that you couldn't get from other sorts of classes, even psych classes.  Sociology classes teach not only about the field's own methods, but about fallacies that are rampant in advertisement, media and public discourse.  Psychology classes, when done right, can teach you to be aware of your own motivations and how you've responded in relationships given what kinds of relationships prevailed in the homes people grew up in.  History courses can be really important in separating fact from fiction when it comes to our cultural or national pasts.  The purpose of a liberal arts education is not just to teach people trades.  You have the whole rest of your life to just pursue success and in turn to be treated like a commodity in society.  Liberal arts gen-ed courses are meant to make good citizens and better people out of us.  I know, from many years of teaching, that it's hard to appreciate them when one is young and restless to get out there and make a living wage.  But, fortunately, the world is a lot more interesting than just that, and gen-ed courses are an opportunity to find that out.

End of pitch, stepping off of soapbox and heading back to the search for a good career fair.  Just sayin', JMO.

[Insula Dei]

I must say that, taking everything at face-value, I like the fact that US colleges have something like a Gen Ed requirement. Definitely something worth considering adaptation for our schools.