Italy 2013: The official thread

[Keystone Phil]

What time is the vote expected?

[Senator Cris]

Tomorrow at 9.30 (in Italy) the debate in Senate.
PDL's position is still uncertain.

[jaichind]

There is a PdL rebel faction that wants to defy Berlusconi and vote for Letta.  They are likely to succeed if they think they have the numbers as if they fail then an election will come they will be left neither here nor there.  Not clear if they have the numbers in the Senete to give Letta a majority.  We will see tomorrow.

[RodPresident]

Napolitano nominated more 4 live senators: architect Renzo Piano, conductor Claudio Abbado and scientists Elena Cattaneo and Carlo Rubbia (Nobel Prize of Physics). With Ciampi, Monti and Scelta Civica, Foreign Italians, Valle d'Aosta regionalists, they will need 18 dissidents from PdL, SEL and M5S to save government.

[Hash]

Apparently even Alfano wants the government to survive; it appears that there is a split along moderate vs hard-right lines within the PdL, with Daniela Santanche (ex-AN, ex-La Destra) being the leader of the anti-Letta forces. I think Letta will survive. I think Alfano and other more moderate people are smart enough to realize that a snap election with the current electoral law would be a recipe for disaster for all involved.

[SPQR]

PDL rebelling against Berlusconi.
Goats roaring against the lion.

[Keystone Phil]

PDL rebelling against Berlusconi.
Goats roaring against the lion.

But how many make up this rebel faction?

[SPQR]

PDL rebelling against Berlusconi.
Goats roaring against the lion.

But how many make up this rebel faction?

Between 30 and 50,it seems.

[Keystone Phil]

PDL rebelling against Berlusconi.
Goats roaring against the lion.

But how many make up this rebel faction?

Between 30 and 50,it seems.

And some thought we'd never see the day Silvio would be seriously challenged!

Then again, I don't know what the party members outside of parliament think about this. Any polling?

[SPQR]

PDL rebelling against Berlusconi.
Goats roaring against the lion.

But how many make up this rebel faction?

Between 30 and 50,it seems.

And some thought we'd never see the day Silvio would be seriously challenged!

Then again, I don't know what the party members outside of parliament think about this. Any polling?

There is no such thing as PDL members...voters,at most.

[jaichind]

Berlusconi’s Party to Vote Unanimously Against Letta Govt: Sky

Wait, what about the rebel group ?

[Keystone Phil]

There is no such thing as PDL members...voters,at most.

This is what I was looking for...

An opinion poll by the Ipsos institute conducted on Tuesday showed 61 percent of PDL voters felt the party should back Letta and 51 percent that it should pick a new leader to take over from Berlusconi and renew the party.

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSBRE9910A520131002?irpc=932

A majority wanting a new leader is pretty damn significant. Also, not sure what that Sky report is talking about. Everything I'm seeing points to an increase in PdL members siding with Letta.

[SPQR]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HE CHANGED HIS MIND AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH

[Hash]

A group of 25 PdL senators led by Roberto Formigoni (the mafia tool) defected to join 10 other senators from a small right-wing group to form a dissident/pro-Letta group. Berlusconi likely wanted to do without a humiliating loss.

[Tender Branson]

Berlusconi and the Republicans: Taking a whole country hostage.

[Senator Cris]

Incredible: Berlusconi and PDL has voted the trust at Letta government.

[Keystone Phil]

Is it really surprising? He was already being humiliated and it was only going to get worse.

Berlusconi and the Republicans: Taking a whole country hostage.

Glad you eye-rolled at your own silliness.

[Tender Branson]

Is it really surprising? He was already being humiliated and it was only going to get worse.

Berlusconi and the Republicans: Taking a whole country hostage.

Glad you eye-rolled at your own silliness.

Believe it or not, Berlusconi and the Republicans are the silly ones ...

[Keystone Phil]

Is it really surprising? He was already being humiliated and it was only going to get worse.

Berlusconi and the Republicans: Taking a whole country hostage.

Glad you eye-rolled at your own silliness.

Believe it or not, Berlusconi and the Republicans are the silly ones ...

I don't doubt that one of the two is silly.

[Hash]

At least Berlusconi knows that he's silly I really think Berlusconi fully gave up on serious politics after 2001 and just became a comedian/clown.

[SPQR]

http://video.corriere.it/governo-berlusconi-vota-fiducia-ma-brunetta-non-sa/1016ef8c-2b7a-11e3-93f8-300eb3d838ac

"The decision has been made to vote against the government UNANIMOUSLY (spelled out"

Italian version of "read my lips"....

[ERvND]

After this crushing defeat, your normal political instincts tell you: This man is finished.

It's Berlusconi, however, so expect him to make a big comeback within the next weeks or months.

[RodPresident]

Did Formigoni revenge for losing his feud (Lombardia) to Lega Nord? Berlusconi expel vote will be dramatic, if government tries to whip his members to vote against expel.

[Keystone Phil]

I didn't even know Formigoni was in parliament. I guess running earlier this year was part of the deal for him to step down as Governor.

Happy 2,000th post here, by the way! It's been quite a year.

[Keystone Phil]

Just breaking. Full Senate vote expected within three weeks.