Italy 2013: The official thread

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Oh Christ. I honestly do not care to imagine the sort of Italian who would vote for him again now.

This is worse than Maurice Duplessis. With effort I can think of levels on which Duplessis was perhaps not a flagrantly despicable human being.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Berlusconi set to reclaim the PdL leadership tomorrow.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/silvio-berlusconi/9543588/Silvio-Berlusconi-poised-to-announce-political-comeback.html

Dear Jesus God no.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

If Berlusconi doesn't run it doesn't matter. For some reason the Italian right has never developed a rock-solid ideological base of say, 25-30% of voters like the PD.

I don't mean to cause any offence, but I can't get my head around this post. Is it from some parallel universe or other?

Would this perhaps be true of 'any given party of the post-DC Italian right'?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Just read that there was a leadership debate between Bersani, Renzi and Vendola yesterday. It's being described as a "game show style" format. 

....

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Alfano: Berlusconi is a candidate.

Oh, man...

Jesus Inksing Christ.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

I've been pro-SB for years, now firmly opposed to him because he wants cheap populism rather than economic reform. Therefore I'm supporting PD this time.

Welcome to the side of the righteous.

Silvio Berlusconi used to be funny. [EXPUNGED], 1996, 2001, 2006, and 2008 were all to greater or lesser extents normal elections between parties of varying policies and levels of corruption like countries normally have. 2013 is going to be, as Antonio said, a matter of near-spiritual import for the Italian Republic.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Delete 1994 from that list.

Yeah, the word "normal" certainly doesn't apply to that one.

You're entirely correct.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

It looks like the election is now slated for February 17th or 24th.

Good.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Rage maintenance was Whitlam '75. We can but hope this goes as well for Berlusconi as that went for (the morally and politically night-and-day superior) Gough.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Berlusconi's pitch would've been perfect for PdL... if he or they had any shred of credibility left, which they don't. Right now they're actually behind M5S in certain polls.

No, I'm pretty sure they're behind them in every poll.

Wait until the campaign is underway. Then we'll see who is credible and who isn't. I just have a hard time believing that M5S maintains their advantage.

The problem is we're discussing an event that will include both credibility and Silvio Berlusconi. If Berlusconi gains enough back from M5S to win I'll be extremely surprised (and depressed).

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Are there still any chances that Berlusconi and Monti will form united right-wing coalition?

No.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

I'm getting word that Berlusconi is (again) stepping aside and Alfano will be the center-right's candidate for Prime Minister though it looks like Maroni wants Tremonti as the candidate.

Berlusconi is supposedly the "coalition leader" but Alfano will be the candidate for Prime Minister. What a campaign.

Wow.

Phil, this Alfano character is from the Mezzogiorno, right? How much do you know about him?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Oh, Berlusconi is also looking to become Finance Minister instead of Prime Minister if the center-right wins.

Because that's so much more comforting.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Oh for Christ's sake.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Berlusconi is seventy-six already, Vosem.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Poor Monti. He deserves to the be the face of the Italian center-right, not a washed-up perverted old huckster like Berlusconi.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Poor Monti. He deserves to the be the face of the Italian center-right, not a washed-up perverted old huckster like Berlusconi.

I couldn't disagree more. Being a washed-up old huckster like Berlusconi is exactly what Monti deserves.

One could argue that being the face of the Italian center-right at least halfway accomplishes that in and of itself.

Keep in mind that the face that the Italian center-right deserves to have right now is Berlusconi or someone like him.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Is there any chance, any remote possibility, of somehow inducing the M5S trolls to abstain?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Weren't they planning at one point to make Alfano PM if they won the February election?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

I wasn't aware reelecting (or 'extending the term of') a President was even constitutional in Italy.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Would Bersani be an example of one of the irredeemably evil people, in your opinion, or do you think he's merely selfish and stupid?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Nothing surprises me with the Vatican considering how the Pope supported Hitler during World War Two

That's hardly an uncontroversial analysis of history.

And, yeah, the Vatican's on Team Monti now.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

So...Berlusconi just got actually convicted of something no-take-backsies this time or is there still some other shoe out there somewhere in the Italian judicial system waiting to drop?

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Yeah but the ban from public office hasn't been finalized yet and the statute of limitations will probably run out before they settle on that.

Berlusconi said he isn't quitting and is committed to relaunching Forza Italia.

Oh for crying out loud.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Italian politics in the Second Republic has got to be some sort of sick cosmic joke. There's just no way it's not.