France General Discussion II: Living under Marxism

[You kip if you want to...]

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/07/31/francois-hollande-digs-cameron-empty-olympics-seats-london-2012-games-corporate_n_1722541.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

In a riposte to David Cameron's previous claim that Britain would "roll out the red carpet" to French businesses wanting to escape planned new corporate taxes over the channel, Hollande said : "The British have rolled out a red carpet for French athletes to win medals. I thank them very much for that, but the competition is not over."

LOL, François Hollande is amazing.

[Californian Tony]

You can say what you want about Hollande, but he's got a wonderful wit.

[You kip if you want to...]

You can say what you want about Hollande, but he's got a wonderful wit.

And I'm glad he's willing to stick the knife in after the crap he got from the rightist EU leaders and the international media during the election campaign.

[Hashemite]

Mmmh, maybe I should contribute actual stuff to this thread instead of letting it become the most boring commentary on HOLLANDE MET THE RANDOM GUY WHO'S LABOUR LEADER, HE'S SO KEWLL!111

In interesting summer news, there's the particularly amusing and bizarre "Dallas-sur-Moselle" case between two right-wing Senators from Moselle who really hate each other and are always seeking to destroy one another.

Marianne apparently leaked a really fascinating conversation between one of them, F. Grosdidier (UMP, mayor of Woippy) and some shady guy about how to destroy the other, J-L. Masson (DVD, the guy who hates bloggers). Besides some great juicy details about how Masson is a nymphomaniac fruitcake, Grosdider says that the only way to destroy him is to have him caught in bed with underage girls in Morocco.

http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2012/08/01/a-metz-la-haine-entre-deux-senateurs-de-droite-vire-au-dallas-sur-moselle_1740878_823448.html
http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2012/08/01/francois-grosdidier-et-jean-pierre-masson-des-ennemis-de-trente-ans_1740884_823448.html
http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2012/07/31/un-senateur-suggere-de-pieger-un-adversaire-politique-avec-une-mineure_1740759_823448.html

For reminders, Moselle is also the place where a UMP deputy (Demange or something) in 2008 assassinated his mistress in broad daylight, almost in public, before killing himself afterwards.

In non-underage Arab girls news, Jean-Christophe Lagarde, Morin's enemy, has come around to creating his very own centrist party by splitting off from the NC. It is called the FED - Force europeenne democrate (instead of the Centre humaniste europeen, CHE...). He made a big deal out of it, but the list of those who have signed up for a ride is underwhelming. Besides Michel Mercier, you have only really have Hervé Marseille, Laurent Lafon, François Rochebloine and André Santini. It doesn't appear as if Sauvadet or Leroy, the two other lagardiste NC deputies, have joined him.

Lagarde is the only centrist, with Borloo, who is actually somewhat relevant and a semi-capable politician (in contrast, Morin is a moron), but the creation of like the sixth or seventh centrist party isn't helping their case much.

There's also UMP news, but it takes too long to explain that (and it's too early).

[You kip if you want to...]

Mmmh, maybe I should contribute actual stuff to this thread instead of letting it become the most boring commentary on HOLLANDE MET THE RANDOM GUY WHO'S LABOUR LEADER, HE'S SO KEWLL!111

Aha.

[Hashemite]

Amusing news of the day:

Duflot awarded 30 Legions d'honneurs, including 13 to elected officials (including 6 Greenies) who are all lefties. Lionnel Luca (UMPFN) throws a fit.
http://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2012/08/03/cecile-duflot-a-decerne-la-legion-d-honneur-a-plusieurs-membres-de-son-parti_1741917_823448.html

The UMP mayor of Nogent-sur-Marne has a creepy crush on Carlita: he puts up a statue of her in his town
http://bigbrowser.blog.lemonde.fr/2012/08/02/bella-ciao-carla-bruni-immortalisee-en-simple-ouvriere-italienne/#xtor=RSS-32280322

[Californian Tony]

The Légion d'Honneur has been exploited for political (and personal) purposes since its creation. Seriously, do right-wingers want us look back at Sarkozy's appointments ?

[Hashemite]

The Légion d'Honneur has been exploited for political (and personal) purposes since its creation. Seriously, do right-wingers want us look back at Sarkozy's appointments ?

Lest we forget, Jean Charest is commandant de la Légion d'honneur. If a corrupt twat who has never done anything for France can have it, then I think EELV in its entirety can get it without there being any problem.

(and Luca would probably prefer to name some fascists instead, so...)

[Peter the Lefty]

Well, so much for "Le changement, c'est maintenant!"  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19194639# 
Will someone please fire Valls already?

[Senator MaxQue]

Well, so much for "Le changement, c'est maintenant!"  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19194639# 
Will someone please fire Valls already?

Well, I don't see why PS should close eyes and let people live in illegal and insalubrious camps.
Most kids aren't going to school, nobody pays taxes....
Helping immigrants, yes, letting lawless areas exist, no.

[Hashemite]

Well, so much for "Le changement, c'est maintenant!"  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19194639# 
Will someone please fire Valls already?

Well, I don't see why PS should close eyes and let people live in illegal and insalubrious camps.
Most kids aren't going to school, nobody pays taxes....
Helping immigrants, yes, letting lawless areas exist, no.

Besides, anyone who expected a Hollande presidency to mark a fundamental or even significant change in immigration policy was quite deluded.

Since the 1970s at the least, French public opinion on immigration has been profoundly conservative (if not borderline xenophobic) and I think there's even been a shift further to the right on immigration since 2007 with the economic crisis and all. According to an Ipsos poll right before April 22, 66% agreed with the old statement "there are too many immigrants in France", against 'only' 48% who agreed with the same statement in the CEVIPOF's 2007 post-election Panel. Sure, a majority of left-wingers disagree with that statement, but while you have only 10% or so of Sarko voters who disagree with it, you still have "only" 60% of left-wing voters who disagree.

And while I didn't find similar data on 2012 or 2007, old data for the past elections has shown that on the topic of immigration, those who said that Le Pen had the best solutions was significantly above Le Pen's actual vote share in the election. For a similar point of reference, Sarkozy always scored the best against Flanby on the question of "fighting illegal immigration" or something along those lines. Some 65-70% of respondents answered that they trusted Sarko more than Hollande on immigration.

Given how a small but not insignificant part of the PS/the left's destruction in 2002 was due to the perception - fair or unfair - that Jospin's government had been 'soft on crime' and too liberal/lenient on immigration, the PS has been eager (and made no secret about it) about reconquering the issue of immigration/public safety from the UMP/FN since then. Valls built a lot of his image within the party as one of those 'tougher' guys within the PS who was helping the left reconquer the issue.

(another Hash effortpost which serves no purpose)

[You kip if you want to...]

If Fillion wins, he's running in 2017. Shocking.
http://www.huffingtonpost.fr/2012/08/11/francois-fillon-2017-ump-candidature-presidentielle_n_1766972.html?utm_hp_ref=france

[Senator MaxQue]

If Fillion wins, he's running in 2017. Shocking.
http://www.huffingtonpost.fr/2012/08/11/francois-fillon-2017-ump-candidature-presidentielle_n_1766972.html?utm_hp_ref=france

Fillon, not FillIon.

[Californian Tony]

The correct spelling is Fion, of course.

[You kip if you want to...]

If Fillion wins, he's running in 2017. Shocking.
http://www.huffingtonpost.fr/2012/08/11/francois-fillon-2017-ump-candidature-presidentielle_n_1766972.html?utm_hp_ref=france

Fillon, not FillIon.

Embarrassing typo

[Senator MaxQue]

If Fillion wins, he's running in 2017. Shocking.
http://www.huffingtonpost.fr/2012/08/11/francois-fillon-2017-ump-candidature-presidentielle_n_1766972.html?utm_hp_ref=france

Fillon, not FillIon.

Embarrassing typo

No, because Filion is way more common than Fillon.

[You kip if you want to...]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19261885

There's something about Valls which really reminds me of Sarko, although it's probably just me.

[Peter the Lefty]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19261885

There's something about Valls which really reminds me of Sarko, although it's probably just me.

There's also something about Hollande that really reminds me of Sarko.  At least, the way he's been governing.  Just not as forcefully, but with the same aims and philosophy in mind. 

[Californian Tony]

LOL, I wasn't even aware these riots were going on. Since I came to SF I haven't been following any French news. Well, wow. I think I need some more info to comment on the events, but from what I gather it seems like big stuff.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19261885

There's something about Valls which really reminds me of Sarko, although it's probably just me.

There's also something about Hollande that really reminds me of Sarko.  At least, the way he's been governing.  Just not as forcefully, but with the same aims and philosophy in mind. 

He might not be as left-wing as we'd like him to be (even then, it's early to judge), but this is objectively false. Or at least, indicates that your criteria for "ideological similarity" are very loose.

[Peter the Lefty]

LOL, I wasn't even aware these riots were going on. Since I came to SF I haven't been following any French news. Well, wow. I think I need some more info to comment on the events, but from what I gather it seems like big stuff.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19261885

There's something about Valls which really reminds me of Sarko, although it's probably just me.

There's also something about Hollande that really reminds me of Sarko.  At least, the way he's been governing.  Just not as forcefully, but with the same aims and philosophy in mind. 

He might not be as left-wing as we'd like him to be (even then, it's early to judge), but this is objectively false. Or at least, indicates that your criteria for "ideological similarity" are very loose.

I said that more with anger than analytical depth But he's basically endorsed the austerity that's being imposed upon the Greeks and let Merkel have her way.  No renegotiation of the fiscal compact whatsoever, even though he kept saying he would.  And now they've ratified it.  Not to mention his spending cuts.  And even a really hardcore supporter of his would have to admit that his "raising" of the minimum wage was a total joke.  I mean, 2%, really?  God, if only there were a way to go back in time and hold the PS primary all over again. 

[big bad fab]

The Légion d'Honneur has been exploited for political (and personal) purposes since its creation. Seriously, do right-wingers want us look back at Sarkozy's appointments ?

Lest we forget, Jean Charest is commandant de la Légion d'honneur. If a corrupt twat who has never done anything for France can have it, then I think EELV in its entirety can get it without there being any problem.

(and Luca would probably prefer to name some fascists instead, so...)

commandeur, not commandant

My grand-grand-father sent back his own after WW2, seeing how many had earned it without doing anything. And he didn't know that Johnny Hallyday would earn it too...
Well, he won his own by fighting during WW1 AND WW2...

[You kip if you want to...]

The Légion d'Honneur has been exploited for political (and personal) purposes since its creation. Seriously, do right-wingers want us look back at Sarkozy's appointments ?

Lest we forget, Jean Charest is commandant de la Légion d'honneur. If a corrupt twat who has never done anything for France can have it, then I think EELV in its entirety can get it without there being any problem.

(and Luca would probably prefer to name some fascists instead, so...)

And he didn't know that Johnny Hallyday would earn it too...

Wow... that's nearly as much of a joke as the honours we give out.

[Californian Tony]

BTW, the government's approvals apparently have been plummeting in the past weeks. I'm not entirely sure, but it seems that it has to do with high gas prices and poor economic numbers (and the government's perceived lack of action).

[You kip if you want to...]

BTW, the government's approvals apparently have been plummeting in the past weeks. I'm not entirely sure, but it seems that it has to do with high gas prices and poor economic numbers (and the government's perceived lack of action).

Obviously their fault.

[Marcus Aurelius]

That's it, the government just lowered the price of one liter of gas by 0,06 €. Huge priority for a left-wing government to spend its money on... -___-'

Oh and Montebourg said that nuclear power was a "sector with a future" (un secteur d'avenir), the Greens are pretty pissed but they either resign or shut up. So they shut up. Glad we the FdG didn't negotiate ministers beforehand like those did...