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Author Topic: SCOTUS has made Mitt Romney's candidacy utterly worthless  (Read 3612 times)
Yelnoc
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« Reply #25 on: June 28, 2012, 09:25:07 pm »
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Normally I try not to gloat within a thread, but the quality of this one is already so poor that I feel no shame.

It is absolutely hilarious to see our forum Republican hacks attempting spin control.  Mitt Romney's Hair, why don't you just tell us how much you love your Baby Daddy Mitt while you're at it?
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memphis
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« Reply #26 on: June 28, 2012, 09:27:51 pm »
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We are for fiscal responsibility

LMAO! The GOP is for tax cuts. That is their alpha and omega.
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« Reply #27 on: June 28, 2012, 09:29:42 pm »
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Well, 75% of his justices he appoints will find RomneyCare unconstitutional!

 I was reading Roberts opinion on the decision, and he clearly differentiated between what the state can do in these situations and the federal governments reach of power. In fact he drew so many distinctions between state and federal power,that it gives me the impression Romneycare would be found constitutional, regardless of whether it was stated as a tax or a mandate.

Why would that matter to Alito, Scalia, and Thomas? And there was that recent Montana campaign finance case that had the same 5-4 split that Citizen's United did.
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« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2012, 09:30:55 pm »
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Normally I try not to gloat within a thread, but the quality of this one is already so poor that I feel no shame.

It is absolutely hilarious to see our forum Republican hacks attempting spin control.  Mitt Romney's Hair, why don't you just tell us how much you love your Baby Daddy Mitt while you're at it?

Right, so those saying "butthurt" in other threads coming from liberals is so constructive, right? Please.

At least I try to make arguments and points, no matter how much you disagree with it.

Sigh, I despair sometimes. Unfortunately, today, I have despaired too often. But come November, I will not. Obama is seriously doomed - poor economy, and now a backlash on Obamacare 2.0. LOL
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milhouse24
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« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2012, 09:32:29 pm »
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Americans don't like new forms of taxes, I believe we fought England over taxes.  We're not afraid to fight the Fed over health care taxes.  

It actually might be cheaper to pay the tax (or fine) rather than pay the high monthly premiums.

Congratulations liberals, you are all sucking on the teet of Big HMO, we are now forced customers to corporations without freedom of choice.  We are now slaves to private Corporations, and there isn't much we can do to our new benevolent overlords.

Over 60% of Americans oppose the Health Care Mandate.  This is great news for Mitt Romney.  Now that Obama has embraced the mandate, voters will have a very CLEAR choice.  

Romney says he will repeal the Health Care Tax, and that will simply be enough to get middle class voters.  

Middle class citizens are screwed, their employers will pay the fine rather than pay for their monthly premiums, so the middle class will be forced to pay for Health Care out-of-pocket.  In addition, more employers will outsource rather than pay employee benefits or just go out of business.  Make no mistake about it, the local economies will grind to halt, as businesses freeze hiring and await the new rules, regulations, and taxes.  This will kill the local economy and I feel really bad for small town Americans.
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Purch
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« Reply #30 on: June 28, 2012, 09:34:32 pm »
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We are for fiscal responsibility

LMAO! The GOP is for tax cuts. That is their alpha and omega.

Reagan republicans are for tax cuts without responsible spending cuts in areas like the military(ex.Repubs bowing to Reagan for increasing the military budget and passing on billion dollar deficits to H.W).

The other quarter of the republicans are actually fiscally responsible. The Newts of the party outlasted the Eisenhowers and the Newts unfortunately are more concerned with ideology instead of fiscal responsibility, which was a big reason H.W didn't get reelected. Whiles he was actually governing his base shifted far to the right.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2012, 09:40:08 pm by Purch »Logged

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MorningInAmerica
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« Reply #31 on: June 28, 2012, 09:40:37 pm »
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Couldn't think  of anywhere to put this so figured I'd put it here. First flash poll taken showing reaction to the health care ruling by the Supreme Court was taken in Florida by Survey USA.
Support ruling 39%
Oppose ruling 50%
There are several more questions showing more disappointment than pleasure with the decision http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=3c025172-d766-4ce7-928f-01f11c9c0671&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
« Last Edit: June 28, 2012, 09:58:03 pm by MorningInAmerica »Logged

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"The media is very susceptible to doing what the Obama campaign wants."

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Yelnoc
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« Reply #32 on: June 28, 2012, 09:40:59 pm »
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Normally I try not to gloat within a thread, but the quality of this one is already so poor that I feel no shame.

It is absolutely hilarious to see our forum Republican hacks attempting spin control.  Mitt Romney's Hair, why don't you just tell us how much you love your Baby Daddy Mitt while you're at it?

Right, so those saying "butthurt" in other threads coming from liberals is so constructive, right? Please.

At least I try to make arguments and points, no matter how much you disagree with it.

Sigh, I despair sometimes. Unfortunately, today, I have despaired too often. But come November, I will not. Obama is seriously doomed - poor economy, and now a backlash on Obamacare 2.0. LOL
I sure wish we had real backlash on Obamacare, as opposed to the drivel you and you're comrades have begun spewing.  Whatever happened to discussion of a public option, much less single payer?
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« Reply #33 on: June 28, 2012, 09:47:34 pm »
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Oppose ruling 39%
Support ruling 50%


Actually:

Oppose ruling 50%
Support ruling 39%
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MorningInAmerica
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« Reply #34 on: June 28, 2012, 09:57:29 pm »
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You're right. Fixed it. Thanks for pointing it out.
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- Jake Tapper, Senior White House Correspondent for ABC News

"The media is very susceptible to doing what the Obama campaign wants."

 - Mark Halperin, author of 2008's 'Game Change.'
Chris Christie's Stomach
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« Reply #35 on: June 28, 2012, 10:01:09 pm »
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Oppose ruling 39%
Support ruling 50%


Actually:

Oppose ruling 50%
Support ruling 39%

Yup, you're right. Had me scared for a second, but I knew that the first post citing this couldn't be right.
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Indy Texas
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« Reply #36 on: June 28, 2012, 10:25:30 pm »
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Middle class citizens are screwed, their employers will pay the fine rather than pay for their monthly premiums, so the middle class will be forced to pay for Health Care out-of-pocket.  In addition, more employers will outsource rather than pay employee benefits or just go out of business.  Make no mistake about it, the local economies will grind to halt, as businesses freeze hiring and await the new rules, regulations, and taxes.  This will kill the local economy and I feel really bad for small town Americans.

1. Most people already get health insurance from their employers. Under what logic would a company that provided health insurance when it wasn't obligated to suddenly refuse to now that it is obligated?

2. I get so tired of this notion that people just sit on their hands because they are "uncertain" about taxes and regulation. There is never certainty in business. Businesses don't know what tax rates will be in 5 years or 10 years; they also don't know if some new technology is going to come along that makes their product obsolete or if a spike in the price of some input they use is going to create huge losses. Here in Texas, oil & gas companies are hiring people left and right; clearly they've withstood the "reign of terror" and the "uncertainty" that Obama and the EPA have inflicted.

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They call me PR
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« Reply #37 on: June 28, 2012, 10:40:10 pm »
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Mitt Romney's candidacy has been utterly worthless since 2008.
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Fargobison
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« Reply #38 on: June 28, 2012, 10:56:49 pm »
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I completely disagree it makes Romney's candidacy worthless, I guess people on both sides can argue that it gives them an edge going forward. In the end it is still all about the economy.
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BaldEagle1991
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« Reply #39 on: June 28, 2012, 10:57:53 pm »
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Not necessarily, he can always run on the promise to repeal the healthcare law.
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BigSkyBob
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« Reply #40 on: June 29, 2012, 12:16:58 am »
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The lion's share of the ACA is now considered constitutional, for all intents and purposes (or "for all intensive purposes" for those who attended Texas public schools). That does not imply that it's "good" legislation or "bad" legislation. It simply means the constitutional argument cannot be made in criticism of it.

Let's remember how Mitt Romney justifies opposing the ACA despite crafting a Mini-Me version of it as governor of Massachusetts (though his law was actually the forerunner to the ACA, so maybe that makes the ACA a...Mega-Me?). First, he says that his health reform plan was "completely different" from Obama's - it wasn't. Then, he says he opposes it because it's not something the federal government is allowed to do.

Except that the motley crew of John Roberts, three Old Jews and a Wise Latina have declared that it is something the federal government can do. So what is Mitt's new rationale? If he still opposes the ACA, why did he implement a near-identical plan in Massachusetts? Is he saying he regrets doing that? That his only substantive achievement while in office was actually a bad thing?

Rick Santorum said at one debate that it would be terrible to have Mitt Romney standing on a debate stage next to the President in the fall precisely because he could not serve as an effective critic of the biggest animating force in the Republican Party - the Affordable Care Act. And Santorum was right. Santorum opposed the ACA and the very idea of anything like the ACA from the get go - constitutional or not, it was categorically wrong for reasons of Santorum's moral and economic philosophy. But Romney's only legitimate criticism of Obamacare, because of his words and his actions for the bulk of his political career, was its constitutionality, and that criticism ceased to exist today.

Basically correct. However, the Constitutional issues are not over. Today, it was declared a tax. Another Constitutional issue is immediately raised, "Can a tax be waived from equal application by bureaucratic fiat?" That could be litigated for years.
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milhouse24
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« Reply #41 on: June 29, 2012, 12:35:18 am »
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Middle class citizens are screwed, their employers will pay the fine rather than pay for their monthly premiums, so the middle class will be forced to pay for Health Care out-of-pocket.  In addition, more employers will outsource rather than pay employee benefits or just go out of business.  Make no mistake about it, the local economies will grind to halt, as businesses freeze hiring and await the new rules, regulations, and taxes.  This will kill the local economy and I feel really bad for small town Americans.

1. Most people already get health insurance from their employers. Under what logic would a company that provided health insurance when it wasn't obligated to suddenly refuse to now that it is obligated?

2. I get so tired of this notion that people just sit on their hands because they are "uncertain" about taxes and regulation. There is never certainty in business. Businesses don't know what tax rates will be in 5 years or 10 years; they also don't know if some new technology is going to come along that makes their product obsolete or if a spike in the price of some input they use is going to create huge losses. Here in Texas, oil & gas companies are hiring people left and right; clearly they've withstood the "reign of terror" and the "uncertainty" that Obama and the EPA have inflicted.



Some mom and pop small businesses, like private law practices and other main street stores will prefer to take the cheaper "fine" rather than pay the more expensive premiums.  Some times premiums goes up if an employee gets diabetes or cancer.  So SMB owners will just let their employees pay out-of-pocket into the Govt Premium exchange, since its out there waiting for them.  Its more affordable and budget-friendly for small businesses under 49 people to just pay the lesser fine instead of the higher premiums, and now the govt option is a legitimate alternative for their workers. 

If you hire more people, you will have to pay their higher benefits, instead of taking on temps or freelancers.  There are many businesses that thrive on cheap labor and temps.  They hire illegal aliens because they don't have to pay them real wages and state employment taxes.  The irony is that if illegal immigrants get citizenship, they won't be able to claim cheaper salaries anymore (under that table), and the contractors that hirer illegals will just hirer the next guy who doesn't have citizenship. 
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« Reply #42 on: June 29, 2012, 12:51:40 am »
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I don't see how the absurd legal system in this country would stop an absurd candidacy from moving on as though the ruling was illegitimate. There is no finality in American politics because there is no legitimate truth, fact, or honesty in any of its decisions. Romney and his hoard of delusional fair-weather plebeians could even become more emboldened by this. The more drastic he makes it out to be, the more like a reality TV show it is in its drama. That in itself is the key to gathering votes.
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« Reply #43 on: June 29, 2012, 03:58:38 am »
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The election will be decided by the economy. As long as voters consider Romney more competent or at least as competent as Obama on this issue, his candidacy is far from worthless.
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« Reply #44 on: June 29, 2012, 05:56:38 am »
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This obviously neuters healthcare as an issue Romney can run on. His whole argument was that Rom--er, Obamacare, was perfectly legal on a state level but unconstitutional on a federal level.

Now that that's been disproved, what's he going to say? "Obamacare is a job-killing tax, totally unlike the job-killing tax I passed as Governor of Massachussets and described as the 'ultimate conservatism' as recently as 2007! Vote Romney!"
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« Reply #45 on: June 29, 2012, 07:15:33 am »
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I'm in agreement with the right-wingers in this thread - the Supreme Court decision doesn't help Obama, and probably slightly hurts him in terms of Romney's ability to mobilize the base.  I think the situation of higher levels of Obama 'success' will make the Republican base forget entirely about their distaste for Romney, and they'll be much more motivated by election day.  It could also tend to swing a few more (not many, but a crucial few) of those middle-of-the-road voters (white suburban non-social conservatives).

I don't think this will necessarily lead to a Romney win, but it isn't good news in Ohio, Iowa, and maybe Michigan and Florida.  So on balance the win is not a win electorally.
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« Reply #46 on: June 29, 2012, 08:06:47 am »
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I can only concur.

I always said Rick was more electable than Romney for precisely this reason. Mitt's just so easy to attack.

Ditto, except I've always said that Romney was the easiest GOP opponent for Obama to beat.  That's why the MSM made him the candidate.  (Santorum, because he's so socially conservative and sort of an economic-liberal, would have been the second-easiest for Obama to beat, which is why the MSM left him to last.)
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« Reply #47 on: June 29, 2012, 09:03:00 am »
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I think the situation of higher levels of Obama 'success' will make the Republican base forget entirely about their distaste for Romney, and they'll be much more motivated by election day.

This process is already complete as evidenced by Romney's better polling numbers before the Court upheld the constitionality of ACA. The hardcore anti-Obama voters were always going to forgive Romney and come out and vote for him.
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« Reply #48 on: June 29, 2012, 09:09:44 am »
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The election will be decided by the economy. As long as voters consider Romney more competent or at least as competent as Obama on this issue, his candidacy is far from worthless.

If any of you bothered to watch the news, you'd know it was this. You'll hear nary a peep from Romney about the ACA from here on out, it's going to be "jobs, jobs, jobs".
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Meeker
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« Reply #49 on: June 29, 2012, 09:25:35 am »
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Certain people in this thread seem to be forgetting that roughly 25-30% of the opposition to Obamacare, according to polls, comes from the left (people who want single-payer). Only about 40-45% of the nation opposes Obamacare from the right.

I also suspect you will see a small jump in public opinion for the act now that it has been upheld. Whether or not it makes sense, there are voters out there who unconsciuosly like to be on the "winning" side of an issue and will change their minds now.

Anyways, Mitt won't bring this issue up very often because he knows he looks like a hypocrite on it. Also because the patient protection reforms are very popular and now he's on record wanting to repeal them.
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