Let's discuss Mormonism.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Being sent to Scotland is how my former Mormon friend met his boyfriend

Any reason he's no longer a friend?

[afleitch]

Oh the English language. He's a former Mormon who is a friend

[Zioneer]

See, this is how you tell a liberal Mormon (like myself) from a conservative Mormon. A liberal Mormon is absolutely fine with a situation like that happening.

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

Liberal Mormon? Isn't that an oxymoron?

[Zioneer]

Liberal Mormon? Isn't that an oxymoron?

Not for me; I see my own personal faith as directly connected to my own personal politics. I don't think all Mormons should be liberals, but I believe that my own thoughts on my faith lead me to a leftist political ideology.

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

I thought Mormons were forced to be conservative by the church.

[Simfan34]

This is a very interesting thread, and I'm sorry you're attacked like this. I'd like to gain some insights on Mormon culture.

Now let me pose a scenario that I think hits on the questions that come to mind. (I'm taking cues from Tweed, so bear with me here). How do Mormon missionaries approach people in cities? Now let's say some missionaries end up in my house- what do I serve them? What do Mormons drink? Now, let's say I'm not so taken with the word but rather the messenger. How receptive are Mormons to relationships with non-Mormons? Persons of colour? How quickly do Mormon relationships "move"- say, into marriage.

[Zioneer]

I thought Mormons were forced to be conservative by the church.

Nope! We've actually got a few high-profile liberals. Gladys Knight, Ken Jennings, Harry Reid (though he's a centrist hero, he's also in favor of gay marriage), and a few others I can't remember right now.

This is a very interesting thread, and I'm sorry you're attacked like this. I'd like to gain some insights on Mormon culture.

Now let me pose a scenario that I think hits on the questions that come to mind. (I'm taking cues from Tweed, so bear with me here). How do Mormon missionaries approach people in cities? Now let's say some missionaries end up in my house- what do I serve them? What do Mormons drink? Now, let's say I'm not so taken with the word but rather the messenger. How receptive are Mormons to relationships with non-Mormons? Persons of colour? How quickly do Mormon relationships "move"- say, into marriage.

Thanks for your apologies (even though it wasn't your fault), though I will say that I'm mostly unaffected by the attacks nowadays. It just isn't worth getting worked up over them.

As for missionaries... Well, missionaries used to do door-to-door proselytizing, but that's fallen out of favor these days (for obvious reasons). Now we mostly do referrals from active members, and a few community events (though I don't know the exact situation, as I have not been a missionary yet). You can serve missionaries anything but alcohol, coffee, and tea. Herbal tea is usually fine, though a lot of Mormons can't tell the difference between herbal tea and regular tea (or that they can drink it). Caffeinated drinks like Coca-Cola and Pepsi are fine, at least now.

As for liking the messenger, a lot of missionaries are men (but not all, many are women), so....

Seriously though, missionaries are strictly forbidden to date, or even take part in halfway romantic actions. Those who violate the mission code of conduct are severely punished, and those who sleep with "investigators" (those taught by the missionaries) are usually sent home immediately as it is known.

And most Mormons are not interested in relationships with non-Mormons, as a Mormon married to a non-Mormon can't be married to that person for all of eternity, and cannot enjoy the eternal blessings promised in our theology. Oh, and Mormon women are especially picky, since they can't have the religious benefits of the LDS priesthood without an LDS guy. Members of the LDS Church are big on priesthood/blessings/etc.

Persons of color.... Well, I'm sure you know about the LDS Church's past problems with black people? Yeah, that's left a nasty legacy. Interracial marriage/relationships are still very rare (with most LDS interracial marriages/relationships being White/Hispanic or White/Polynesian). In fact, the LDS Church leadership still recommends for young adults (as of the most recent Young Adult handbook) having a relationship with someone from your own ethnicity and economic class, simply because it's easier to connect with people in your same groups. I mean, they don't condemn it anymore (like in the days of Ezra Taft Benson), but having that "we recommend same-ethnicity relationships" bit in 2013 is a bit... archaic.

As for moving onto marriage, many relationships are very quick to move onto marriage, but others go on for years. Acendotally, my parents dated for 4 years before marrying. On the other hand, Brigham Young University (BYU) has a reputation of having Mormon women coming there for "Mrs. Degrees" or a "degree in marriage". Some Mormons get married after two or three months, though they're usually seen as a bit rash.

Though keep in mind that my own perspective and knowledge is only relevant in Utah. In states where Mormons aren't the majority, things might be different. Though the basic "want to have spouse/non-married significant other be Mormon from the start or end up Mormon eventually" applies to basically all Mormons.

Any other questions on Mormon culture? I'm happy to answer any more questions you might have.

[Torie]

What "priesthood benefit"s do LDS women get if their husband is also LDS, that they don't get if their husband is a gentile?  

[Franzl]

Hope you don't mind the question:

What happens to Mormons who do drink alcohol, coffee or tea? Is it considered a serious sin that would have serious consequences?

[Zioneer]

What "priesthood benefit"s do LDS women get if their husband is also LDS, that they don't get if their husband is a gentile?  

Well, as I said, they don't get to be married for all eternity, which LDS women take very seriously. So do LDS men, and they can't be married for all eternity to a non-LDS woman.

Additionally, LDS folks believe in a form of faith healing; those men who "hold" the priesthood are supposed to be able to literally perform miracles if the sick person and the priesthood holder both are worthy and have faith that the sick person can be healed.

And on a more broad scale, having a priesthood holder in your home brings blessings that an LDS person doesn't even think about. It's not all good things all the time, but having a member of the priesthood (which is every worthy LDS male), in your home is supposed to help your life turn out well overall.

Hope you don't mind the question:

What happens to Mormons who do drink alcohol, coffee or tea? Is it considered a serious sin that would have serious consequences?

Well, it varies, depending on the bishop you talk to about it. Some revoke your temple recommend (which allows you to go to an LDS temple and take part temple rituals like baptism for the dead, sealing of you to your spouse and your kids for all eternity, etc). Others don't care all that much, as long as you're a good person. They're usually harsher on the new converts, to keep those new converts from having alcohol/coffee/tea again.

Usually though in any case, its only really bad if you keep doing it repeatedly. It's like how a Jewish person who had pork once wouldn't be looked down upon, but if they kept doing it and showed no remorse for doing so (while still being part of an Orthodox tradition), there'd be a problem.

And since the Church leadership clarified recently that the previously frowned-upon Coca-Cola and Pepsi (and other very caffeinated drinks) are now okay, I get the feeling that that doctrine will be moderated even more soon.

[Torie]

Well if I hooked up with an LDS partner, the "benefits" you outlined are just not sufficient to induce me to convert. I was hoping for something more tangible.

[ZuWo]

How can drinking alcohol be considered reprehensible or even sinful? After all, Jesus drank wine and nowhere does the Bible condemn moderate consumption of alcohol.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Is it true that close to half of adult Mormons are converts? Something I remember hearing, though I don't know if that's worldwide instead of just the US, or something like the US outside of Utah, or something like that.

[Zioneer]

How can drinking alcohol be considered reprehensible or even sinful? After all, Jesus drank wine and nowhere does the Bible condemn moderate consumption of alcohol.

This is how. Of course, originally it (the Word of Wisdom) was more of a suggestion, and not really enforced, but nowadays, it's become a dietary code (though the "have very little meat" part is ignored completely by most Mormons), and more of a cultural symbol of Mormonism.

Is it true that close to half of adult Mormons are converts? Something I remember hearing, though I don't know if that's worldwide instead of just the US, or something like the US outside of Utah, or something like that.

I have no idea; though it sounds like that would be most accurate outside of the US. The LDS Church is massive in Central and South America. We're even building a new missionary training center in Mexico.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

How can drinking alcohol be considered reprehensible or even sinful? After all, Jesus drank wine and nowhere does the Bible condemn moderate consumption of alcohol.

Can't speak as to Mormon doctrine, but I get a fairly healthy dose of Adventist doctrine on the subject from a radio station I listen to. (I don't always agree with them, but their station often has the most tolerable stuff to listen to while I am in the car.) They point out that the Greek word for wine also encompassed grape juice, much as the word cider in the English language includes both soft cider and hard cider.  So they insist that Jesus drank unfermented grape juice.  Their arguments that he must have rather than he could have seem to be based more on arguments that he would not have had anything to do with destructive alcohol than a specific scriptural basis.

[Zioneer]

How can drinking alcohol be considered reprehensible or even sinful? After all, Jesus drank wine and nowhere does the Bible condemn moderate consumption of alcohol.

Can't speak as to Mormon doctrine, but I get a fairly healthy dose of Adventist doctrine on the subject from a radio station I listen to. (I don't always agree with them, but their station often has the most tolerable stuff to listen to while I am in the car.) They point out that the Greek word for wine also encompassed grape juice, much as the word cider in the English language includes both soft cider and hard cider.  So they insist that Jesus drank unfermented grape juice.  Their arguments that he must have rather than he could have seem to be based more on arguments that he would not have had anything to do with destructive alcohol than a specific scriptural basis.

Mormon doctrine is basically the same, though a few Mormons admit that it's really unlikely that Jesus drank grape juice.

[Torie]

What percentage of Mormons still go to church semi regularly, who are shut out of the Temple because they did not tithe, admit to drinking, or whatever, so they don't get the ticket of good standing from their stake leader. I am just wondering how active Mormons are in their church who are in the twilight zone because they don't hew to all the rules - and either admit it, or are caught. What I am getting at, is if you go to an LDS church service any given Sunday, is basically everyone in attendance "true blue" and obedient - and tithes, or not (putting aside recent recruits of course)?

[Zioneer]

What percentage of Mormons still go to church semi regularly, who are shut out of the Temple because they did not tithe, admit to drinking, or whatever, so they don't get the ticket of good standing from their stake leader. I am just wondering how active Mormons are in their church who are in the twilight zone because they don't hew to all the rules - and either admit it, or are caught. What I am getting at, is if you go to an LDS church service any given Sunday, is basically everyone in attendance "true blue" and obedient - and tithes, or not (putting aside recent recruits of course)?

Well, there's a few on the fringes of the community who still come to a church service who are not "worthy", and even fewer who flaunt their "unworthiness" while still going to church but the LDS Church is one of the most culturally binary faiths ever; most people who aren't "worthy" don't attend church, and those who have serious disagreements with the church tend to cut themselves off forever from the LDS Church and LDS culture.

Most people who go to weekly services are at least trying to follow all the rules. And knowledge of such things is usually obtained through the ward (remember, that's the LDS version of a congregation) rumor vine.

[Oak Hills]

I thought Mormons were forced to be conservative by the church.

Nope! We've actually got a few high-profile liberals. Gladys Knight, Ken Jennings, Harry Reid (though he's a centrist hero, he's also in favor of gay marriage), and a few others I can't remember right now.

The Udalls are Mormon, if I recall correctly.

[Zioneer]

I thought Mormons were forced to be conservative by the church.

Nope! We've actually got a few high-profile liberals. Gladys Knight, Ken Jennings, Harry Reid (though he's a centrist hero, he's also in favor of gay marriage), and a few others I can't remember right now.

The Udalls are Mormon, if I recall correctly.

Tom Udall is, but Mark Udall is not. Tom is the son of Stewart Udall, who remained faithful to the LDS Church. Mark is the son of Mo Udall, who became inactive (never removed his name from the church records though), and did not raise his children in the Mormon tradition. I actually have a biography on Mo Udall, and it's fascinating. He "left" the Church from an early age, but he was always identified as "Mormon", and he neither refuted nor approved the media claiming he was.

[Zioneer]

Anyone still interested? I'm still willing to answer Mormonism-related questions.

[ZuWo]

Anyone still interested? I'm still willing to answer Mormonism-related questions.

I'm afraid that with Mitt Romney falling into oblivion, "mormonmania" is coming to an end.

[Torie]

Anyone still interested? I'm still willing to answer Mormonism-related questions.

My interest in Mormonism had and has nothing to do with Mittens, and never has. I never cared about his religion vis a vis his act in the public square. So I am still here, following this thread with interest.

The last LDS folks who came to my door were there to urge me to vote against gay marriage, least churches have to solemnize wedding ceremonies of f****ts. There were not there to save my soul. Only JW's hit me up regularly now. Has the LDS church decided that ringing doorbells to spread the word is a thing of the past?

[Zioneer]

Anyone still interested? I'm still willing to answer Mormonism-related questions.

My interest in Mormonism had and has nothing to do with Mittens, and never has. I never cared about his religion vis a vis his act in the public square. So I am still here, following this thread with interest.

The last LDS folks who came to my door were there to urge me to vote against gay marriage, least churches have to solemnize wedding ceremonies of f****ts. There were not there to save my soul. Only JW's hit me up regularly now. Has the LDS church decided that ringing doorbells to spread the word is a thing of the past?

Sort of; from what I understand, there's been legal and social kerfuffles with door-to-door-proselytizing, and it isn't as successful as it used to be, but it still continues. The real growth is through referrals, where active members point out people that may be interested (or point out inactive members). We still do a lot of door-to-door preaching in Latin America and Africa though.