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| | |-+  Will Obama win white evangelicals in Utah?
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Question: Will Obama win white evangelicals in Utah?
Yes   -9 (17.6%)
No   -42 (82.4%)
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Total Voters: 51

Author Topic: Will Obama win white evangelicals in Utah?  (Read 1917 times)
old timey villain
cope1989
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« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2012, 03:04:41 pm »
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Only 7% of Utahans are evangelical. It also has a relatively high percentage of non-religious, though I'm guessing most of these are probably ex-Mormons and their descendants.

Also, FWIW Obama got around 19% of the Mormon vote in 2008, though that was probably near the high-water mark for a Democrat in UT, and a feat he's obviously not going to replicate this year. Mormons made up 75% of the electorate in Utah, depsite making up only 60% of the state's population. Working backwards using algebra, that means Obama had to have gotten around 79% of the non-Mormon vote to get him to 34% of the vote.

Of course all this begs another question: why do Mormons have such high turnout?

Good question. Perhaps it's because they're part of a religion that's one of the most politically involved. I know they did a lot to help pass prop 8 in California, with many Mormons from other states canvassing in California for the cause. I think the Mormons have been very successful in shaping Utah's politics and they have had influence in other states as well, so they understand the value of being politically active.
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« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2012, 03:37:02 pm »
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No, he won't win such people anywhere, obviously.

^^^, duh.

What reason would they have for voting for Obama, BRTD?

Well, after all, if they are not rich, they should still vote for Obama, but they don't, being more consumed by hatred and racism than self-interest.

And as many have pointed out, leftism is a better fit for real Christianity than the right.
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The Obamanation
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« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2012, 08:12:53 pm »
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BK's link is spot-on.  This is a ridiculous suggestion.  Maybe if the question were white Protestants

Consider how skewed that could be by the south though. Do you think Obama won white evangelicals in Seattle? (I believe he did, like in Minneapolis. I mean if you have a serious problem with gays, then you probably aren't going to live in Seattle or Minneapolis for one.) That makes at least Salt Lake City pretty realistic.

Are you an evangelical now, BRTD?

I go to and was baptized in an evangelical church, (that is no doubt voting heavily for Obama), yes.

Am I an evangelical? I suppose that depends on the standard used. I mostly certainly am not by the Barna group standard. I might not be by the Pew standard either, which has white evangelicals quite a bit more conservative than the CNN exit poll standard.

I thought you didn't believe in a significant difference between mainline and evangelical, and that the only differences were their positions on gays and abortion.
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Likely Voter
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« Reply #28 on: July 28, 2012, 08:51:28 pm »
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There are more choices than just voting for Romney or Obama. Conservatives who have a problem with Romney will either not vote or vote third party, or vote for him while holding their nose.

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« Reply #29 on: July 28, 2012, 09:39:03 pm »
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If Obama got 29% of white evangelicals statewide, why is a majority in Seattle so far-fetched?

I don't think it's far-fetched, but I know Mars Hill Church is a big evangelical power in Seattle.  I guess I'd like a better sense of how many independent Protestant types identify as evangelicals before I hazarded a guess.  But I'm not sure what the point of the debate is -- we both just have vague intuition and non-representative anecdotal evidence.

Since the Census won't ask religion questions we really don't have any way of knowing, but I doubt that there are too many white evangelicals in rural Utah or BYU-land. But here's the big question: How many of them in Utah are ex-Mormons?

I'm not sure; the "Other Christian" population (Utah's biggest non-Mormon population, who don't identify as "Protestant") is nebulous to me.  Are these generi-Christian Park City types, lapsed Mormons who still identify with the Christian faith, progressive Christians of some type, evangelicals, or what?  When we're talking a 10% population (Protestant + "Other Christian") there don't have to be many.  Is the Utah fundie population really that microscopic?  Shrug.

Then again, I guess we've seen exit polls that say the non-Mormon population is heavily Democratic.  I'm not sure what to think, honestly.  The data we have are fairly terrible.

Well yeah, it's kind of tricky without a clear definition of "evangelical" I suppose. The "Other Christians" in Utah are a mixture of all the types you mentioned. How many are properly defined as "evangelical" becomes pretty tricky.

I thought you didn't believe in a significant difference between mainline and evangelical, and that the only differences were their positions on gays and abortion.

No actually I believe there definitely IS a difference. Just not best to based on those issues, which essentially creates kind of a No True Scotsman. For example is this an evangelical church? It's hard to see in what way it wouldn't fall more into that category than mainline...until you consider it supposedly has a reputation in Austin as a bit of a "gay church". Or for another example what are the Lutheran Congregations in Mission for Christ? ARDA qualifies them as evangelical, but they are an ELCA schism, and are basically ELCA except they don't like gays. See the point?
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« Reply #30 on: July 29, 2012, 01:47:42 am »
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To me an "Evangelical" is just some fancy word for a devout Protestant. I'm probably right.
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« Reply #31 on: July 29, 2012, 02:19:31 am »
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To me an "Evangelical" is just some fancy word for a devout Protestant. I'm probably right.

That definitely doesn't work amongst olds. More accurate amongst youngs, though Nathan is a notable counter-example.
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« Reply #32 on: July 29, 2012, 09:47:45 am »
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To me an "Evangelical" is just some fancy word for a devout Protestant. I'm probably right.

That definitely doesn't work amongst olds. More accurate amongst youngs, though Nathan is a notable counter-example.


Why won't it work for olds? I thought it would work for everyone.
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« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2012, 01:06:06 pm »
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Most Protestant olds here are mainline, even if they are socially conservative. They are often more conservative than their churches, but stay anyway because olds are kind of stubborn. The ELCA officially endorses a no vote on the marriage amendment, but I think it's obvious how Lutherans who can collect Social Security in rural Minnesota will be voting.
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« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2012, 05:29:09 pm »
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I wonder which state has the largest number of liberal white evangelicals (however those are defined, of course. Tongue )
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« Reply #35 on: July 30, 2012, 12:31:23 pm »
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I wonder which state has the largest number of liberal white evangelicals (however those are defined, of course. Tongue )

Somewhere up North, I would wager. Vermont maybe?
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« Reply #36 on: July 30, 2012, 12:40:21 pm »
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The exit polls didn't cover white evangelicals in Vermont, but I haven't found any state where Obama's numbers amongst white evangelicals is higher than 35% as it is here.
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