MA: Mideast Budget 2012 (Debating)

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

AYE

Why did you vote on this?

[Jayhawker]

AYE

Why did you vote on this?

"for the people"

[Diabolical Minds Think Alike]

Aye

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Aye

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

AYE

Why did you vote on this?

"for the people"

OK - I don't mind the public voicing their opinions here, but let's try to differentiate between votes and public opinion.

[Is JCL in mushy sappy love]

Abstain

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

Voting is now closed.  The AYEs are 4, and the NAYs are 0, with 1 ABSTAIN.  The AYEs have it, and the amendment is agreed to.  Debate will now continue.

[Senator Napoleon]

Also is there any data we can get from the GM that shows the optimal marijuana tax where we will make the most revenue without users moving back to a black market and pay no taxes?

0%, considering the federal tax rates on marijuana.

[ZuWo]

So now that we've decided to raise taxes on beer (we still need to figure out how much money this generates), are there more ideas as to how we can balance the budget?

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Maybe make some cuts to administration.  Anybody know a responsible way to do that?

[A-Bob]

Maybe make some cuts to administration.  Anybody know a responsible way to do that?

No, because in many programs, especially more entitlements programs we are on the brink or underfunded as it is. The problem with Atlasian budgets is we don't have control of management really. We only can pass laws of how to make something more efficient. I'm sure we could try some free market ideas like Mitch Daniels did in Indiana. Instead of making a toll road, just set aside a chunk of money and whatever company shows the most efficient and effective plan wins the contract and the road is toll free and in better shape than the government building and taxing it. We might already have that in the region though, I am unsure...

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Maybe make some cuts to administration.  Anybody know a responsible way to do that?

No, because in many programs, especially more entitlements programs we are on the brink or underfunded as it is. The problem with Atlasian budgets is we don't have control of management really. We only can pass laws of how to make something more efficient. I'm sure we could try some free market ideas like Mitch Daniels did in Indiana. Instead of making a toll road, just set aside a chunk of money and whatever company shows the most efficient and effective plan wins the contract and the road is toll free and in better shape than the government building and taxing it. We might already have that in the region though, I am unsure...

If we don't have that yet, then I would support it.

[Jayhawker]

I'm only bringing this up because I saw it mentioned, I know it hasn't been seriously discussed yet, but FTR, I am adamantly opposed to any effort to try and bring more toll roads to the Mideast Region.

[shua]

So now that we've decided to raise taxes on beer (we still need to figure out how much money this generates), are there more ideas as to how we can balance the budget?

You could get rid of some of those tax expenditures.

[Is JCL in mushy sappy love]

Let's cut government as opposed to raising taxes on income or this proposed beer tax increase.

[Diabolical Minds Think Alike]

Let's cut government as opposed to raising taxes on income or this proposed beer tax increase.

Normally I'd agree with you, but there must be some room for short term tax increases in order to keep revenue flowing.

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Let's cut government as opposed to raising taxes on income or this proposed beer tax increase.

Normally I'd agree with you, but there must be some room for short term tax increases in order to keep revenue flowing.

I would probably agree with both of you on this one.

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

Let's cut government as opposed to raising taxes on income or this proposed beer tax increase.

Well the beer tax increase amendment passed

[ZuWo]

I'm leaning towards supporting shua's idea and ask the members of the Assembly: Which specific tax expenditure(s) are you ready to sacrifice in return for a balanced budget?

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

Would a pension tax have to be done in a separate bill?

[Oldiesfreak1854]

Would a pension tax have to be done in a separate bill?

I would be willing to support that, but as long as it only affects future employees.  

[A-Bob]

I'm leaning towards supporting shua's idea and ask the members of the Assembly: Which specific tax expenditure(s) are you ready to sacrifice in return for a balanced budget?

Guys I'm telling as the conservative author of this bill we really can't afford to cut much from this budget at all. It already is as libertarian as you can get when compared to all the states in the region combined RL. It's easy to say "cut government" but this budget is already at that stage of enough to survive on, but enormously less expenditures than RL budgets. If you want to make this game like RL, then you have to look at the budget from the standpoint that we can't magically cut everything and expect great benefits due to incredible management and super people in every department. If you want to see the full fight, just go to the old thread where GM Badger and I endlessly debated this.

[Jayhawker]

I second A-Bob's statements. A balanced budget is ideal, but we can't gut our government.

[shua]

Would a pension tax have to be done in a separate bill?

I'm assuming you have a significant pension tax. I beleive that's what most of that "social insurance tax" revenue represents, and that Badger based the number for that on Ohio's RL programs.

I'm leaning towards supporting shua's idea and ask the members of the Assembly: Which specific tax expenditure(s) are you ready to sacrifice in return for a balanced budget?

Guys I'm telling as the conservative author of this bill we really can't afford to cut much from this budget at all. It already is as libertarian as you can get when compared to all the states in the region combined RL. It's easy to say "cut government" but this budget is already at that stage of enough to survive on, but enormously less expenditures than RL budgets. If you want to make this game like RL, then you have to look at the budget from the standpoint that we can't magically cut everything and expect great benefits due to incredible management and super people in every department. If you want to see the full fight, just go to the old thread where GM Badger and I endlessly debated this.

Your direct spending (i.e. government programs) is enormously less than RL budgets. Your tax expenditures are not. 

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

I'm leaning towards supporting shua's idea and ask the members of the Assembly: Which specific tax expenditure(s) are you ready to sacrifice in return for a balanced budget?

Guys I'm telling as the conservative author of this bill we really can't afford to cut much from this budget at all. It already is as libertarian as you can get when compared to all the states in the region combined RL. It's easy to say "cut government" but this budget is already at that stage of enough to survive on, but enormously less expenditures than RL budgets. If you want to make this game like RL, then you have to look at the budget from the standpoint that we can't magically cut everything and expect great benefits due to incredible management and super people in every department. If you want to see the full fight, just go to the old thread where GM Badger and I endlessly debated this.

He's talking about cutting tax expenditures (i.e. tax cuts, etc.), not cutting government programs.