Bryan, Wilson and Roosevelt? (user search)
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  Bryan, Wilson and Roosevelt? (search mode)
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Author Topic: Bryan, Wilson and Roosevelt?  (Read 3671 times)
Mechaman
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« on: August 19, 2012, 01:41:08 AM »

Oldie, I think it depends on the President. I mean, from what I remember, Grant upheld gold even in the face of the 1873 Panic. But Eight years after his re-election, a vehemently pro-silver Republican, James Garfield, was elected. Harrison as well counts as pro-silver while McKinley was a moderate on the issue. As for socially conservative, that comes down to defining the term, though I'd define McKinley as "socially liberal", but in '20's, I think it's safe to say the GOP was socially conservative, especially when they were up against Al Smith.

This.

Regions also had a part to play in the whole dynamic as well.  Referring to 19th Century-early 20th Century:  While Southern Democrats were obvious authoritarians Northern Democrats were quite "liberal" on issues like alcohol (with the exception of Bryan), immigration (with the exception of Bryan), morality (with the exception of Bryan), and trade (yes, even Bryan).  Republicans, in general, were more likely to support Prohibition, limits on immigration, criminalization of prostitution, and a Protectionist trade policy.  Pretty illiberal views at that.

New Deal onward Republicans were more of a "moderate" party compared to the big tent populism of the Democrats.  Hate elitists?  Vote Democratic!  Don't like anti-Civil Rights Southern politicians but also don't like pretentious intellectual drug users?  Vote Republican!

1980 onward is probably the only era in which the major parties could really be summarized as having set ideologies.  Before then parties were usually a collection of groups who could stand each other more than (insert group a here and group b here).  For example:  Blacks and Northern WASPs vs. Catholic Immigrants and Southern WASPs, white collars vs. blue collars and intellectuals, etc. etc. etc.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2012, 01:24:52 PM »

It's possible that many things now viewed as socially conservative would have been "progressive" during that time.

Yes, "progressive" but not "liberal".

There is a reason why historians rarely refer to politicians like Theodore Roosevelt and Bob LaFollette as "liberals".
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Mechaman
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« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2012, 01:40:33 PM »
« Edited: August 19, 2012, 01:42:05 PM by James Badass Monroe »

Oldie, I think it depends on the President. I mean, from what I remember, Grant upheld gold even in the face of the 1873 Panic. But Eight years after his re-election, a vehemently pro-silver Republican, James Garfield, was elected. Harrison as well counts as pro-silver while McKinley was a moderate on the issue. As for socially conservative, that comes down to defining the term, though I'd define McKinley as "socially liberal", but in '20's, I think it's safe to say the GOP was socially conservative, especially when they were up against Al Smith.

This.

Regions also had a part to play in the whole dynamic as well.  Referring to 19th Century-early 20th Century:  While Southern Democrats were obvious authoritarians Northern Democrats were quite "liberal" on issues like alcohol (with the exception of Bryan), immigration (with the exception of Bryan), morality (with the exception of Bryan), and trade (yes, even Bryan).  Republicans, in general, were more likely to support Prohibition, limits on immigration, criminalization of prostitution, and a Protectionist trade policy.  Pretty illiberal views at that.

New Deal onward Republicans were more of a "moderate" party compared to the big tent populism of the Democrats.  Hate elitists?  Vote Democratic!  Don't like anti-Civil Rights Southern politicians but also don't like pretentious intellectual drug users?  Vote Republican!

1980 onward is probably the only era in which the major parties could really be summarized as having set ideologies.  Before then parties were usually a collection of groups who could stand each other more than (insert group a here and group b here).  For example:  Blacks and Northern WASPs vs. Catholic Immigrants and Southern WASPs, white collars vs. blue collars and intellectuals, etc. etc. etc.
Maybe not now, but they were liberal for that time.

No they were not.

Protectionism was considered basic conservative economic theory at the time.  "Free Trade" was considered a very radical economic idea that was put down by industrialists who were afraid it would empower foreign businesses.  Protectionism was not back then a liberal mentality in anyway you could possibly think of it.  While Unions do support higher tariffs on a number of products now days, those tariff rarely on average go over 20%.  Republicans in the old day supported 40% or more tariffs, what we would call a "heavy tariff".  Tariffs that high exist only to protect domestic businesses from competition, in other words Economic Nationalism (which is right up the alley of most Hamiltonians).  There is a reason why people say they support "trade liberalization" when they refer to lowering tariffs and/or supporting free trade.
Immigration control was definitely not thought of as liberal.  There is a reason why relaxing immigration controls was/and still is referred to as "immigration liberalization".  A number of "Progressives" (emphasis) might've had some support for immigration control but by and large it was supported mostly by those on the traditional economically nationalist wing of American politics (which was thought of as "right wing").  This is quite evident by a number of nativist groups (the American Protection League, former Know Nothings, and large numbers of the 1920's KKK) who wont to support Republican politicians.  The liberal position at the time was, like it still is now, freer immigration.
Prohibition might've been "Progressive", but I wouldn't argue that banning a substance that individuals used to only harm themselves would've been a "liberal" position.  Again, "liberalism" at the time had a strong emphasis on personal freedoms but not a lot of focus on government activism (at least relative to the New Deal).  "Progressivism" and "liberalism" of the time were a lot more at odds back then they are today.  There are some exceptions to this, like William Bryan and his crew who were considered to be both "liberal" and "progressive".  Otherwise, they wouldn'tve bothered calling it the "Progressive Era".
Ditto for Prostitution.
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Mechaman
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« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2012, 11:26:40 PM »
« Edited: August 19, 2012, 11:29:44 PM by James Badass Monroe »

Also, everybody was racist until about August 28th, 1944 at 2:55 PM and 3 seconds Eastern Standard Time.

Everyone.

No exceptions.
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