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| | |-+  In Kansas, Conservatives Vilify Fellow Republicans
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Author Topic: In Kansas, Conservatives Vilify Fellow Republicans  (Read 1633 times)
greenforest32
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« on: August 07, 2012, 03:59:39 am »
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TOPEKA, Kan. — In eight years in the Kansas Legislature, State Senator Dick Kelsey said, he never voted for a tax increase and frequently supported spending cuts. As an evangelical pastor, a staunch opponent of abortion and an acknowledged leader in the fight to elect conservative lawmakers, he has been endorsed by Kansans for Life and the National Rifle Association.

But after publicly criticizing elements of Gov. Sam Brownback’s tax plan this year, Mr. Kelsey found himself among a cluster of conservative Republican state senators that a more conservative coalition here is working to defeat in Tuesday’s primary elections.

Read more at http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/06/us/in-kansas-primaries-conservatives-attack-fellow-republicans.html

What do you think about this? 1%ers primarying theocratic Republicans for not being fiscally conservative enough or something else?
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greenforest32
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« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2012, 04:41:32 am »
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I think this is related to the major tax cuts Oklahoma and Kansas conservatives were aiming for. It looks like some of the more moderate/less conservative Republicans in these states prevented that from happening.

Maybe it was the most regressive passed, but it's not the most regressive on the books (no income tax) which is what they were aiming for:

http://www.pewstates.org/projects/stateline/headlines/kansas-and-oklahoma-income-tax-cuts-wont-reach-zero-85899389000

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May 18, 2012
Heading into this year’s legislative sessions, conservative lawmakers in Kansas and Oklahoma hoped to enact big income tax cuts. Some even aspired to make Kansas or Oklahoma the first state to eliminate personal income taxes since Alaska did it in 1980. 

As the sessions wind down in both Topeka and Oklahoma City, it’s clear that neither state will go that far. But by aiming so high, income tax foes in Kansas likely will be able to claim a significant victory. In Oklahoma, lawmakers are expected to approve a notable income cut as well, though one that falls short of Governor Mary Fallin's initial hopes.

As their budget situations have improved in recent months, more states—especially those with Republicans in charge—have started to consider tax cuts again. Tax cut supporters aimed highest in Kansas and Oklahoma. The fact that they achieved only partial success illustrates the difficulty of making wholesale changes to the tax code. Such changes require trade-offs that give pause to even some of the most dedicated supporters of lower taxes and smaller government.

In both Kansas and Oklahoma, lawmakers feared that eliminating state income taxes would jeopardize funding for schools and other vital services, and might throw budgets out of balance for years to come. Both states considered paying for the lower rates by ending various tax breaks, but found it politically difficult to do so.  Even in conservative states such as Kansas and Oklahoma, a change as bold as eliminating the state income tax entirely now seems possible only over many years.
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« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2012, 06:52:42 am »
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TOPEKA, Kan. — In eight years in the Kansas Legislature, State Senator Dick Kelsey said, he never voted for a tax increase and frequently supported spending cuts. As an evangelical pastor, a staunch opponent of abortion and an acknowledged leader in the fight to elect conservative lawmakers, he has been endorsed by Kansans for Life and the National Rifle Association.

But after publicly criticizing elements of Gov. Sam Brownback’s tax plan this year, Mr. Kelsey found himself among a cluster of conservative Republican state senators that a more conservative coalition here is working to defeat in Tuesday’s primary elections.

Read more at http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/06/us/in-kansas-primaries-conservatives-attack-fellow-republicans.html

What do you think about this? 1%ers primarying theocratic Republicans for not being fiscally conservative enough or something else?

You act as though this is something new.
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greenforest32
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« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2012, 07:39:04 am »
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I guess I was just surprised at the matter of degree and that a state like Kansas still had any semblance of a moderate branch for its Republican party.
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« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2012, 08:27:43 am »
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It's funny how I could tell this was going to be a New York Times story by the fact that it starts with the phrase "In [place name],"
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« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2012, 11:22:03 am »
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Somehow, I suspect that if the story were about primaries to the Democratic State Senators in New York whom refused to support the Leader candidate chosen by the caucus in favor of a coalition with the GOP I doubt the headline would be, "In New York, Liberals Vilify Fellow Democrats." I suspect the title would revolve around ideas of righteous indignation.
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« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2012, 01:05:45 pm »
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Somehow, I suspect that if the story were about primaries to the Democratic State Senators in New York whom refused to support the Leader candidate chosen by the caucus in favor of a coalition with the GOP I doubt the headline would be, "In New York, Liberals Vilify Fellow Democrats." I suspect the title would revolve around ideas of righteous indignation.

The difference is that your side is full of wackjobs who say crazy things and demand their right to "reload" and not to retreat. Liberals don't threaten to kill people...
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« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2012, 05:04:40 pm »
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I guess I was just surprised at the matter of degree and that a state like Kansas still had any semblance of a moderate branch for its Republican party.

The Kansas GOP has always been at way between its more business oriented section and its more church going section. With former claiming the title of "moderate" in this struggle. Now with issues of finance dominating and abortion/evolution knocked down a peg or two, they can shuffle the labeling deck in the media.

I would strongly advise against using the term moderate to describe any of these people. They are probably similar on 95% of all the issues.
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greenforest32
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« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2012, 08:50:57 pm »
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Looks like they were successful in the primaries: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/conservative-takeover-in-kansas-just-the-beginning/2012/08/08/bd27ddd8-e163-11e1-98e7-89d659f9c106_blog.html

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Conservatives defeated seven moderate Republican lawmakers in party primaries with an eighth incumbent trailing his opponent as votes continue to be counted.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2012, 09:08:19 pm by greenforest32 »Logged
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« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2012, 11:02:09 pm »
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Looks like they were successful in the primaries: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/conservative-takeover-in-kansas-just-the-beginning/2012/08/08/bd27ddd8-e163-11e1-98e7-89d659f9c106_blog.html

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Conservatives defeated seven moderate Republican lawmakers in party primaries with an eighth incumbent trailing his opponent as votes continue to be counted.

Generally - yes. They won about 80% of all races. But with Bwownback's support and financial assistance they had from numerous conservative PACs - that could be expected. In addition - the Republican primary electorate in most states (except some North-Eastern, but even there - somewhat more conservative then in the past) is not even conservative, but outright very right wing. So - it's more surprising that some moderates still managed to win and some new were elected. But generally - yes. May be that will lead to election of somewhat more Democrats..
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« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2012, 06:58:12 am »
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I guess I was just surprised at the matter of degree and that a state like Kansas still had any semblance of a moderate branch for its Republican party.

The Kansas GOP has always been at way between its more business oriented section and its more church going section. With former claiming the title of "moderate" in this struggle. Now with issues of finance dominating and abortion/evolution knocked down a peg or two, they can shuffle the labeling deck in the media.

I would strongly advise against using the term moderate to describe any of these people. They are probably similar on 95% of all the issues.

They are very similar in their desired goals. The moderate tag more often refers to their desire to reach those goals in a more cautious and sustainable manner.
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« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2012, 04:10:25 pm »
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I guess I was just surprised at the matter of degree and that a state like Kansas still had any semblance of a moderate branch for its Republican party.

The Kansas GOP has always been at way between its more business oriented section and its more church going section. With former claiming the title of "moderate" in this struggle. Now with issues of finance dominating and abortion/evolution knocked down a peg or two, they can shuffle the labeling deck in the media.

I would strongly advise against using the term moderate to describe any of these people. They are probably similar on 95% of all the issues.

So, all the talk about how the Democrats are going to win seats because the "conservative" won the primary is so much poppycock? If in the last analysis the "conservative" and the "moderate" candidate are 95% alike, then they ought to poll amazingly similarly. Unless, of course, that 5% is weighted differently among various voters. The decision of the "moderates" to throw in with the Democrats, whom certainly aren't anywhere near 95% alike with "moderate Republicans," seems to suggest the real differences are either much greater, or they subjectively weigh their differences much more than 5%.

In any case, I am entirely comfortable preferring a nominee that is 100% in agreement with me over a candidate that is 95% in agreement with me.
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greenforest32
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« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2012, 08:10:36 pm »
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Something similar is happening in Alaska: http://www.pewstates.org/projects/stateline/headlines/in-alaska-bipartisanship-on-the-ballot-85899413283

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August 24, 2012

Alaska’s 20-member Senate is governed by a coalition known as the Bipartisan Working Group. It includes a supermajority of six Republicans and all ten Democrats—only four Republicans serve in the minority. Bipartisan coalitions in legislatures usually lose their hold on power quickly, but Alaska’s Working Group has lasted for six years worth of legislative sessions. Supporters tout it as a moderating force in Alaska politics.

Yet not everyone in Alaska is happily singing “Kumbaya.” GOP Governor Sean Parnell and the Republicans who hold the majority in the Alaska House complain that the Senate’s Working Group has obstructed vital legislation. For the last two years, Parnell’s top priority has been an oil tax cut intended to reverse declining oil production on the North Slope, but the Senate has resisted the cut. With 19 of Alaska’s 20 Senate seats on the ballot this year, Parnell and conservative activists see an opportunity to elect a new Senate majority made up of Republicans who are less interested in cooperating with Democrats.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2012, 08:13:18 pm by greenforest32 »Logged
BigSkyBob
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« Reply #13 on: August 30, 2012, 05:55:26 pm »
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Something similar is happening in Alaska: http://www.pewstates.org/projects/stateline/headlines/in-alaska-bipartisanship-on-the-ballot-85899413283

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August 24, 2012

Alaska’s 20-member Senate is governed by a coalition known as the Bipartisan Working Group. It includes a supermajority of six Republicans and all ten Democrats—only four Republicans serve in the minority. Bipartisan coalitions in legislatures usually lose their hold on power quickly, but Alaska’s Working Group has lasted for six years worth of legislative sessions. Supporters tout it as a moderating force in Alaska politics.

Yet not everyone in Alaska is happily singing “Kumbaya.” GOP Governor Sean Parnell and the Republicans who hold the majority in the Alaska House complain that the Senate’s Working Group has obstructed vital legislation. For the last two years, Parnell’s top priority has been an oil tax cut intended to reverse declining oil production on the North Slope, but the Senate has resisted the cut. With 19 of Alaska’s 20 Senate seats on the ballot this year, Parnell and conservative activists see an opportunity to elect a new Senate majority made up of Republicans who are less interested in cooperating with Democrats.

Two of the turncoats voted out in Republican primary:

http://newsminer.com/bookmark/19960567-Menard-Wagoner-upset-in-GOP-primaries

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greenforest32
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« Reply #14 on: August 30, 2012, 09:50:43 pm »
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I wonder if two will be enough to end the coalition? The Kansas primaries were more definitive.

There's also redistricting to consider. I'm not sure if the new maps have shifted the field around much in Alaska. It's kind of hard to find redistricting info on state maps.
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koenkai
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« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2012, 03:45:41 am »
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We have no income taxes and no sales tax. And every election, the Democrat and the Republican candidates essentially pledge to keep it as such.

If Kansas Republicans think that's the way to go, all the power to them.
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