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| | |-+  Hollande's proposed tax hikes may drive businesspeople from France.
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Author Topic: Hollande's proposed tax hikes may drive businesspeople from France.  (Read 2908 times)
Justice Jbrase
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« on: August 08, 2012, 11:07:58 am »
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PARIS — The call to Vincent Grandil’s Paris law firm began like many others that have rolled in recently. On the line was the well-paid chief executive of one of France’s most profitable companies, and he was feeling nervous.

 President François Hollande is vowing to impose a 75 percent tax on the portion of anyone’s income above a million euros ($1.24 million) a year. “Should I be preparing to leave the country?” the executive asked Mr. Grandil.

The lawyer’s counsel: Wait and see. For now, at least.

“We’re getting a lot of calls from high earners who are asking whether they should get out of France,” said Mr. Grandil, a partner at Altexis, which specializes in tax matters for corporations and the wealthy. “Even young, dynamic people pulling in 200,000 euros are wondering whether to remain in a country where making money is not considered a good thing.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/08/business/global/frances-les-riches-vow-to-leave-if-75-tax-rate-is-passed.html?_r=2&adxnnl=1&hpw&adxnnlx=1344438033-SD7YkmMT4TTd3KFVDWBoqw

lol French...

« Last Edit: August 08, 2012, 02:46:15 pm by Speaker Jbrase »Logged
Rhodie
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« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2012, 11:16:20 am »
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Good on 'em.
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Toxic Grumps
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« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2012, 11:25:40 am »
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Remind me to be surprised.
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Grumps isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer, and shouldn't be taken seriously

I'm just a nice fellow in a cardigan...

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« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2012, 12:34:36 pm »
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This looks like economic suicide, but I'm not really surprised. If this comes true, I expect more wealthy French citizens to move to countries with a lower tax burden (e.g. Switzerland).
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #4 on: August 08, 2012, 12:43:12 pm »
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'may'
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Solitude Without a Window
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« Reply #5 on: August 08, 2012, 01:12:12 pm »
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When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.
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Our numbers are dwindling. Our words are confused.
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until they can no longer be recognized.

Now what is wrong, or false, in what we have said?
Just some parts, or everything?
On whom can we still rely? Are we survivors, cast
away by the current? Will we be left behind,
no longer understanding anyone and being understood by no one?
Must we rely on luck?

This is what you ask. Expect
no answer but your own.


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Rhodie
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« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2012, 01:15:21 pm »
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When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

Or maybe the government is deploying ridiculously outdated socialist ideologies. These people are not assholes. Would you be happy if a 75% tax were levied on your earnings?
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Dereich
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« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2012, 01:44:28 pm »
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When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

From what you're saying if both the decisions of the government and the citizens are wrong, we should attribute more blame to the citizens.  Are you saying we should automatically give the government the benefit of the doubt instead of the citizens?
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dfwlibertylover   oh God Dereich you are in for a rude awakening on November 8th lol

00:09   Wulfric   Trump has seemed to have a lot of compassion for the poor at times

smilo           Atlas is not a place for opinions
smilo           Atlas is a place for satire
Solitude Without a Window
Antonio V
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« Reply #8 on: August 08, 2012, 02:05:11 pm »
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When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

Or maybe the government is deploying ridiculously outdated socialist ideologies. These people are not assholes. Would you be happy if a 75% tax were levied on your earnings?

If one earns one f**king million and bitches about how much taxes he pays despite the fact that even after paying them he still lives better than 95% of the population, yes, such person is a despicable asshole.


When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

From what you're saying if both the decisions of the government and the citizens are wrong, we should attribute more blame to the citizens.  Are you saying we should automatically give the government the benefit of the doubt instead of the citizens?

Since people voted for Hollande, whose program included said tax proposal, just three months ago, it can be said that it's the citizens who took the decision already. What's happening is that a small part of the citizens doesn't like it and strives to circumvent the decision.
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Our numbers are dwindling. Our words are confused.
Some of them have been twisted by the enemy
until they can no longer be recognized.

Now what is wrong, or false, in what we have said?
Just some parts, or everything?
On whom can we still rely? Are we survivors, cast
away by the current? Will we be left behind,
no longer understanding anyone and being understood by no one?
Must we rely on luck?

This is what you ask. Expect
no answer but your own.


Bertolt Brecht
Rhodie
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« Reply #9 on: August 08, 2012, 02:10:10 pm »
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When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

Or maybe the government is deploying ridiculously outdated socialist ideologies. These people are not assholes. Would you be happy if a 75% tax were levied on your earnings?

If one earns one f**king million and bitches about how much taxes he pays despite the fact that even after paying them he still lives better than 95% of the population, yes, such person is a despicable asshole.


When a sovereign government takes a policy decision, good or bad, and the concerned citizens find a morally dubious way to circumvent decision, what is the reaction of the media and commentators ? They express contempt toward the assholes ? No way ! They poke fun at said government.

World is a sad place.

From what you're saying if both the decisions of the government and the citizens are wrong, we should attribute more blame to the citizens.  Are you saying we should automatically give the government the benefit of the doubt instead of the citizens?

Since people voted for Hollande, whose program included said tax proposal, just three months ago, it can be said that it's the citizens who took the decision already. What's happening is that a small part of the citizens doesn't like it and strives to circumvent the decision.

All 51% of them. Well the economies stuffed anyway so its all immaterial really whether they stay or go. But good for the countries they emigrate to.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #10 on: August 08, 2012, 02:11:30 pm »
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'may'

Let's highlight this point again. Articles like this have been appearing all over the place for quite a while now. In any case, the impact of this kind of thing tends to be grossly exaggerated, generally for reasons that are hilariously transparent.
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« Reply #11 on: August 08, 2012, 02:17:11 pm »
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Here's hoping Hollande's the first of several to implement such a tax, with future incoming left-leaning governments eventually doing so.
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Rhodie
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« Reply #12 on: August 08, 2012, 02:21:19 pm »
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Here's hoping Hollande's the first of several to implement such a tax, with future incoming left-leaning governments eventually doing so.


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Leftbehind
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« Reply #13 on: August 08, 2012, 02:30:38 pm »
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Hope it hurt.
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RogueBeaver
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« Reply #14 on: August 08, 2012, 02:33:02 pm »
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Somehow I'm not surprised.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #15 on: August 08, 2012, 02:34:34 pm »
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I don't normally do this but the tone of the thread is so low that... er... the 'r' in 'proposed' is not where you think it is. Every time I see this thread I think of porpoises.
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Rhodie
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« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2012, 02:45:17 pm »
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Hope it hurt.

It's in not as bad a state in as the French economy will be in a years time.
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"Freedom. And Justice. If you have those two, it covers everything. You must stick to those principles and have the courage of your convictions"

Foucaulf
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« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2012, 02:46:02 pm »
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From the article:

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But because there are relatively few people in France whose income would incur such a tax — an estimated 7,000 to 30,000 in a country of 65 million — the gains might contribute but a small fraction of the 33 billion euros in new revenue the government wants to raise next year to help balance the budget.

Quantitatively it is not that big of a deal, like most tax hikes these days bar the VAT, so the effect is psychological. I would rather have the average French hate 20000 bankers than 3 million Muslims.

Something that isn't immediately obvious is the bias caused by interviewing tax lawyers - of course they benefit from any tax code revision. And they're smart enough to know there's a pool of indebted MBAs who will take any new vacancy.
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Justice Jbrase
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« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2012, 02:48:21 pm »
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I don't normally do this but the tone of the thread is so low that... er... the 'r' in 'proposed' is not where you think it is. Every time I see this thread I think of porpoises.

Thanks, was in a rush when I posted it.
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Lief 🐋
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« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2012, 02:59:42 pm »
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Take away their citizenship, prevent them from returning to the country ever again until they pay the taxes they owe with interest. Problem solved.
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fuck nazis
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« Reply #20 on: August 08, 2012, 03:08:08 pm »
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Take away their citizenship, prevent them from returning to the country ever again until they pay the taxes they owe with interest. Problem solved.
You don't even need to do that. It's all a bunch of bull a la if Bush wins re-election, I'm moving to Canada.
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TheDeadFlagBlues
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« Reply #21 on: August 08, 2012, 04:21:32 pm »
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I feel like these articles are written anytime a government that's anywhere to the left of center tries to raise taxes. The emigration rare materialises because people aren't "rational" and chose to live where they live based off of non-monetary reasons, especially once they reach a certain luxurious living standard.
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Tetro Kornbluth
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« Reply #22 on: August 08, 2012, 04:38:27 pm »
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Haven't they been threatening this for months now?

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« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2012, 05:07:20 pm »
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Most of them will have been avoiding tax to begin with anyway.

Governments should govern for the people who elect them and not the markets who try and rig things in their own favour at the expense of the electorate. Hollande deserves ever commendation for this - it's gutsy and I'd love to see Labour and the German SDP take up the policy.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #24 on: August 08, 2012, 08:29:16 pm »
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Haven't they been threatening this for months now?

Oh yes.
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