Sun Myung Moon dead at 92

[Kaine for Senate '18]

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http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/rev-sun-myung-moon-self-proclaimed-messiah-who-founded-unification-church-dies-at-age-92/2012/09/02/bc40e2f4-f52f-11e1-863c-fe85c95ce4ed_story.html?hpid=z1

[2952-0-0]

Here's the reaction by his followers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSWN6Qj98Iw

[afleitch]

I love how sanitised with Wiki entry for this cult leader is.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

ok

[後援会]

...why is this in U.S. General Discussion?

[The Mikado]

Should probably be in Religion and Philosophy, but whatever.

Interesting to see who gets Moon's business empire.

Also, http://www.amazon.com/Bad-Moon-Rising-Washington-Religious/dp/0979482232 by investigative journalist John Gorenfeld is pretty fantastic.

[Beet]

The financier for the Washington Times.

[Zioneer]

I have the image of Moon appearing in some kind of afterlife where L. Ron Hubbard is also hanging out, and Hubbard greeting Moon with a "You died peacefully in your bed after creating a religion basically based around you too?"

[The Mikado]

[Free Palestine]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

[John Dibble]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

Part of it is that they are supposedly based on Christianity, but their interpretations of the Bible are quite strange. This is enough to get labeled as a cult by Christian groups.

Another part of it is that they supposedly have typical 'cult' type recruiting tactics (can't find the details right now) and they dupe followers out of their money.

They also have political ambitions and were a bit more successful at it than Scientology, likely due to the fact that Moon grew a business empire that wasn't blatantly tied to the group's religious teachings. One of Moon's top aides was reported to have said "We are going to make it so that no one can run for office in the United States without our permission". They also owned the Washington Times until 2010 among other media outlets.

I can't find any info that indicates that they harass people who leave to the degree that Scientology does, so if people are more free to leave that might explain why they aren't as infamous and why any abuse isn't as well documented.

[memphis]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

Part of it is that they are supposedly based on Christianity, but their interpretations of the Bible are quite strange. This is enough to get labeled as a cult by Christian groups.

Another part of it is that they supposedly have typical 'cult' type recruiting tactics (can't find the details right now) and they dupe followers out of their money.

How is any of that different than supposedly legitimate religions? They're all a bunch of snake oil salesmen.

[The Mikado]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f08clPMODw8

Watch the first ten minutes of this video (or indeed all of it, though the second half is not nearly as interesting).

[John Dibble]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

Part of it is that they are supposedly based on Christianity, but their interpretations of the Bible are quite strange. This is enough to get labeled as a cult by Christian groups.

Another part of it is that they supposedly have typical 'cult' type recruiting tactics (can't find the details right now) and they dupe followers out of their money.

How is any of that different than supposedly legitimate religions? They're all a bunch of snake oil salesmen.

You do realize you're talking to one of the most vocally anti-religion posters on the forum, right?

Anywho, I find it useful to distinguish between a mainstream religious group and a cult based on specific behaviors of the group. It comes down to what degree they do these things - for instance your average church might ask you to put some money in the collection plate and ask for an additional donation every now and then, but a cult will be more likely to go after every penny you have not only to fund their schemes but also to remove your means of supporting yourself without the cult. Also a regular church might expect you to come on Sundays and occasionally participate in an additional activity, whereas a cult will try to make it so every last aspect of your life revolves around the cult.

[memphis]

Could someone enlighten me as to the reasons for the Unification Church being labelled a cult, other than the fact that it's a fairly new religious movement?

Part of it is that they are supposedly based on Christianity, but their interpretations of the Bible are quite strange. This is enough to get labeled as a cult by Christian groups.

Another part of it is that they supposedly have typical 'cult' type recruiting tactics (can't find the details right now) and they dupe followers out of their money.

How is any of that different than supposedly legitimate religions? They're all a bunch of snake oil salesmen.

You do realize you're talking to one of the most vocally anti-religion posters on the forum, right?

Anywho, I find it useful to distinguish between a mainstream religious group and a cult based on specific behaviors of the group. It comes down to what degree they do these things - for instance your average church might ask you to put some money in the collection plate and ask for an additional donation every now and then, but a cult will be more likely to go after every penny you have not only to fund their schemes but also to remove your means of supporting yourself without the cult. Also a regular church might expect you to come on Sundays and occasionally participate in an additional activity, whereas a cult will try to make it so every last aspect of your life revolves around the cult.

Churches ask a lot more than an ocassional donation. They fully expect you to give 10% of your income, and then they are constantly begging for additional funds for various side projects. They are all too happy to suck you dry if you let them. And they want to control your life much more than just on Sundays. You have to live the life to be a "true" believer. Jesus knows what you do behind closed doors and he does not approve. Better go confess before you get hit by a bus and end up in eternal damnation. And don't forget the church in your will.

[Joe Republic]

Careful, memphis.  Some folks around here get mighty sensitive when you imply that Christianity (or really any religion) is little more than a cult itself.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

His Grauniad obit is worth a read for all kinds of reasons:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/02/rev-sun-myung-moon

[afleitch]

His Grauniad obit is worth a read for all kinds of reasons:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/02/rev-sun-myung-moon

Oh now that is good.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

RIP

[they don't love you like i love you]

LOL and people say I belong to a cult when the pastors wear jeans. LOL!

Churches ask a lot more than an occasional donation. They fully expect you to give 10% of your income

Erm no. That's largely limited to just prosperity theology type churches.

and then they are constantly begging for additional funds for various side projects.

Depends on how you define "constantly" and not really much different from most organizations in that sense, political parties do send out fundraising emails for example.

They are all too happy to suck you dry if you let them. And they want to control your life much more than just on Sundays. You have to live the life to be a "true" believer.

...I've seen people from church at shows before where everyone is getting drunk and passing around weed at parties.

Jesus knows what you do behind closed doors and he does not approve. Better go confess before you get hit by a bus and end up in eternal damnation.

That type of theology could only be described as Catholic, which is kind of weird since most of the post prior to this was clearly based on some types of evangelical theology, so a bit of an odd twist here.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

His Grauniad obit is worth a read for all kinds of reasons:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/sep/02/rev-sun-myung-moon

I have to consider myself somewhat more enlightened now. Or in other words, da fuq?

[John Dibble]

Churches ask a lot more than an ocassional donation. They fully expect you to give 10% of your income, and then they are constantly begging for additional funds for various side projects.

I'm aware some churches still do require that for membership, but I don't think it's really as common today as it used to be. According to this article the average amount parishioners gave their churches in 2009 was 2.38% of their income.

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Sure, but they generally lack both the means and the will to actually enforce it. They don't actively intrude on you in most cases. Worst case for you is they find out about your bad behavior and kick you out of the church if you refuse to do what they say. On the other hand, Scientology will try to guilt trip you into going to a labor camp by blackmailing you with all the things you've confessed during auditing.