SENATE BILL: The Duke-Marokai Postal Service Act of 2013 (Law'd)

[Barnes]

I offer the following amendments:

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[Barnes]

Barnes, I'm on board with everything in your amendment other than retaining Saturday delivery. What is the case for saving it?

I simply think its a very convenient service that has already been cut back in times past (I assume we do have shorter service hours on Saturday?).  My amendment would simply allow the Postal Service a way to create an alternative to the idea of shutting the service down completely.

[Barnes]

As your amendment authorizes the APS to phase out Saturday delivery based on the results of the CIO's report, I deem it friendly.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Sponsor Feedback: Friendly
Status: The Vice President can call 24 hours on passage of this above amendment.

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

Twenty-four hours to object.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

I think it's fair.

[Oakvale]

I'm not exactly convinced that the postal service isn't something that couldn't be done more efficiently by the private sector, but if we're to have a public postal service we should at least make sure it's somewhat cost efficient. I'm not particularly sure that ending Saturday post would be such a big deal that it needs an in-depth study, though.

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

Passed.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Any other thoughts on this matter? This isn't quite as much of a big Fing deal, but it is important regardless, don't you know.

[Frodo]

Passed.

If it has, the updated version of it at the beginning of this thread isn't showing it. 

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Passed.

If it has, the updated version of it at the beginning of this thread isn't showing it. 

Thats good, because there is no updated version at the beginning of the thread.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Just a few last points of inquiry, for Barnes or whoever, how was 70% determined to be an appropriate level?

Also, can we get a response to oakie's question here?

I'm not exactly convinced that the postal service isn't something that couldn't be done more efficiently by the private sector, but if we're to have a public postal service we should at least make sure it's somewhat cost efficient. I'm not particularly sure that ending Saturday post would be such a big deal that it needs an in-depth study, though.

[Frodo]

Just a few last points of inquiry, for Barnes or whoever, how was 70% determined to be an appropriate level?

The original bill called for labor and pension costs to remain below 60% of the APS's expenses. This exchange between GM Shua and then-Senator Marokai convinced me that a slightly higher ceiling would be a more feasible goal.

As for Oakvale's question, I think that a public postal service offers some important advantages (e.g. regular and affordable rural delivery that the private sector probably wouldn't provide), but I agree that the inconvenience of ending Saturday delivery is probably worth the savings. Barnes or Frodo could probably best explain the disadvantages involved in making this change.

Simply put -eliminating Saturday delivery would severely impact the speed and delivery of mail service in Atlasia, and undermine a key growth sector: parcel delivery.  Some of the Postal Service's biggest customers like Netflix and various newspaper publishers would be adversely affected by this change.  That in turn reduces revenue that the Atlasian Postal Service takes in by $5.3 billion, more than outweighing any savings gained by eliminating Saturday delivery.

It isn't worth it.  I would know since I work in RL for a union that represents USPS letter carriers.  

[Oakvale]

Speaking as someone who in real life lives in a country without Saturday post I can categorically say you're vastly overstating the impact of removing it.

[Frodo]

Speaking as someone who in real life lives in a country without Saturday post I can categorically say you're vastly overstating the impact of removing it.

Am I?  Wasn't a lawsuit filed last year against An Post (the Irish equivalent of the USPS) by the Communications Regulator over the quality of its postal service?  

[Oakvale]

Speaking as someone who in real life lives in a country without Saturday post I can categorically say you're vastly overstating the impact of removing it.

Am I?  Wasn't a lawsuit filed last year against An Post (the Irish equivalent of the USPS) by the Communications Regulator over the quality of its postal service? 

Not exactly sure how it helps your point that an unwieldy government bureaucracy is performing poorly. An Post has been a mess for years, I'm vaguely surprised we haven't sold it yet. It's possible no one would buy it.

Anyway, that has nothing to do with Saturday deliveries. I have no idea when that was abolished (or if it ever existed), but I can't remember there ever being regular Saturday post - they make exceptions at Christmas and elections if I recall correctly - and it maybe inconvenience one or two people on very rare occasions.

Bear in mind that the vast majority of post is advertising these days - parcels are commonly sent by courier service, and, well, who writes letters anymore ?  

[Marokai Backbeat]

Just a few last points of inquiry, for Barnes or whoever, how was 70% determined to be an appropriate level?

I determined it, jerk.

[Frodo]

Speaking as someone who in real life lives in a country without Saturday post I can categorically say you're vastly overstating the impact of removing it.

Am I?  Wasn't a lawsuit filed last year against An Post (the Irish equivalent of the USPS) by the Communications Regulator over the quality of its postal service?  

Not exactly sure how it helps your point that an unwieldy government bureaucracy is performing poorly. An Post has been a mess for years, I'm vaguely surprised we haven't sold it yet. It's possible no one would buy it.

Anyway, that has nothing to do with Saturday deliveries. I have no idea when that was abolished (or if it ever existed), but I can't remember there ever being regular Saturday post - they make exceptions at Christmas and elections if I recall correctly - and it maybe inconvenience one or two people on very rare occasions.

Bear in mind that the vast majority of post is advertising these days - parcels are commonly sent by courier service, and, well, who writes letters anymore ?  

If An Post is an as sh**tty a state as you suggest, why on earth would you advocate apeing it by eliminating Saturday delivery?  And how are you so certain that Saturday delivery (or lack thereof) has nothing to do with its financial troubles, which seems to have been there since its birth?  

The financial problems at the USPS, by contrast, only have become chronic after 2006.

The elimination of Saturday delivery -either here in Atlasia or in the RL United States- will do nothing to solve our problems.  An Post -by your own admission- is a perfect example of that.

[Franzl]

I tend to doubt that the issue of Saturday delivery (or lack thereof) is extremely relevant, particularly in 2013 with modern technology and private package delivery services.

[Oakvale]

I'm more suggesting aping Deutsche Post, which, come to think of it, provides Saturday delivery!

My view on this is very simple - I believe the government should provide necessary services to the public to improve their quality of life - universal healthcare, public education, transport, etc, etc. I don't think Saturday post falls under that category.

Your argument that eliminating Saturday postal delivery is some kind of crucial milestone that effectively destroys a national postal service is absurd - An Post doesn't deliver on Saturdays, thus the company is doomed? I just don't see how this is supposedly such a major issue - post on working days should suffice for the vast majority of businesses and citizens, and if it's really necessary people can always avail of a private delivery service on weekends.

The fact is if we're to have a national postal service in this country that we should at least make sure it's not massively loss-making. Eliminating what's effectively a luxury service achieves this.

[Napoleon]

Just a few last points of inquiry, for Barnes or whoever, how was 70% determined to be an appropriate level?

I determined it, jerk.

Enough with the incendiary language, Senator.

I see nothing wrong with eliminating Saturday post.

[Franzl]

I'm more suggesting aping Deutsche Post, which, come to think of it, provides Saturday delivery!

My view on this is very simple - I believe the government should provide necessary services to the public to improve their quality of life - universal healthcare, public education, transport, etc, etc. I don't think Saturday post falls under that category.

Your argument that eliminating Saturday postal delivery is some kind of crucial milestone that effectively destroys a national postal service is absurd - An Post doesn't deliver on Saturdays, thus the company is doomed? I just don't see how this is supposedly such a major issue - post on working days should suffice for the vast majority of businesses and citizens, and if it's really necessary people can always avail of a private delivery service on weekends.

The fact is if we're to have a national postal service in this country that we should at least make sure it's not massively loss-making. Eliminating what's effectively a luxury service achieves this.

I support post privatization, like Deutsche Post, under certain circumstances. One of them is that the area and population density of a country is reasonable. I think it works in Germany and would work in Ireland.

I do have concerns about how it would work in a country the size of Atlasia.

[Frodo]

I'm more suggesting aping Deutsche Post, which, come to think of it, provides Saturday delivery!

My view on this is very simple - I believe the government should provide necessary services to the public to improve their quality of life - universal healthcare, public education, transport, etc, etc. I don't think Saturday post falls under that category.

Your argument that eliminating Saturday postal delivery is some kind of crucial milestone that effectively destroys a national postal service is absurd - An Post doesn't deliver on Saturdays, thus the company is doomed?

I just don't see how this is supposedly such a major issue - post on working days should suffice for the vast majority of businesses and citizens, and if it's really necessary people can always avail of a private delivery service on weekends.

The fact is if we're to have a national postal service in this country that we should at least make sure it's not massively loss-making. Eliminating what's effectively a luxury service achieves this.

Allow me to reiterate what I said earlier -the elimination of Saturday delivery is a penny-wise, pound-foolish option.  You will lose more revenue in the long-run than you will gain in the short-term, while letting private companies step into the void, thus contributing further to the downward spiral of the public postal service as it makes do with less revenue and a smaller workforce working fewer days, and earning less.  What benefits will we gain that will not be offset by lost revenue?  

By your own admission, the elimination of Saturday delivery has not helped An Post at all, apparently.  In fact, it is still suffering chronic financial problems.  

Why on earth would we want to follow the Irish example?  The elimination of Saturday delivery hasn't helped An Post, and it is definitely not going to help the Atlasian Postal Service either.  

[Marokai Backbeat]

fwiw, when I wrote the original bill, I had absolutely no problem eliminating Saturday delivery. I really don't think it would have as much of a negative impact as people say. Sure, I suppose having it is a nice ideal, but, I really think we could do without and not suffer.

Also, you all better not privatize our postal service!