Republicans still talking about rape, for some reason

[Lief 🗽]

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/phil-gingrey-todd-akin-was-right.php

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[ingemann]

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/phil-gingrey-todd-akin-was-right.php

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Wow, so when a 13 year old get pregnant with her uncles child, she's not a victim, but just a slut?

[King]

Silly, Lief, all us men have to do is keep repeating it and the submissive female race will start to believe.  Don't back down!  Say it stronger!

[Antonio the Sixth]

"the horse has already left the barn"...


*___*

[You kip if you want to...]

http://www.dayswithoutagoprapemention.com/

[memphis]

Rape is probably more popular than tax cuts for rich people and they fought for that tooth and nail too. When your game is obstruction at any cost, you don't have to win elections.

[Keystone Phil]

Phil Gingrey, a doctor (or does he count as like a "self loathing doctor" or something? You know, like the black Republicans/Tea Partiers?), should not be allowed to speak on this. He should be ashamed of himself. Doesn't he know the narrative is already set?

Wow, so when a 13 year old get pregnant with her uncles child, she's not a victim, but just a slut?

...what?

[Marokai Backbeat]

Well clearly, since he's a doctor, nothing he says here could possibly be ignorant or wrong.

[Smash255]

Phil Gingrey, a doctor (or does he count as like a "self loathing doctor" or something? You know, like the black Republicans/Tea Partiers?), should not be allowed to speak on this. He should be ashamed of himself. Doesn't he know the narrative is already set?

If by narrative you mean actual medical facts then yes its already set......

How can you defend this??

[RogueBeaver]

Tammy Bruce said it best on Twitter: Note to all politicians, STFU about rape.

Or to use a Lois line from MITM: "WTH is wrong with you! Have you gone completely insane!" (All caps)

[Keystone Phil]

Tammy Bruce said it best on Twitter: Note to all politicians, STFU about rape.

Or to use a Lois line from MITM: "WTH is wrong with you! Have you gone completely insane!" (All caps)

Correct. If you believe something is wrong, just shut up. LEADERSHIP.

[Smash255]

Well clearly, since he's a doctor, nothing he says here could possibly be ignorant or wrong.

Just like how because he's a Republican/Pro Life, he hates women, thinks they should be submissive, doesn't understand the female body, etc.

Whew. Glad we got your response out of the way early.

Phil Gingrey, a doctor (or does he count as like a "self loathing doctor" or something? You know, like the black Republicans/Tea Partiers?), should not be allowed to speak on this. He should be ashamed of himself. Doesn't he know the narrative is already set?

If by narrative you mean actual medical facts then yes its already set......

Ah, good. Dope Number Two rings in with an early response as well. Excellent.

And I like how the narrative that the GOP hates women and is in favor of rape is now "fact."

By actual medical fats I was taking about the batish crazy comments that he made that flies into the face of actual medical data.  A woman being tense during a rape is not going to stop her from getting pregnant.  Its absurd.  Not to mention he doubled down on the 'legitimate rape' crap by bringing up a 15 year old girl impregnated by her boyfriend and then claiming rape.  

Do you think his comments were acceptable?  

[Smash255]

Tammy Bruce said it best on Twitter: Note to all politicians, STFU about rape.

Or to use a Lois line from MITM: "WTH is wrong with you! Have you gone completely insane!" (All caps)

Correct. If you believe something is wrong, just shut up. LEADERSHIP.

No one is telling them to shut up about being pro-life.  They are pro-life, fine they have a right to express that.  However, to go on about "legitimate rape" and strange conspiracy theories about how a Pregnancy from rape can't happen is absurd,  PERIOD.

[Keystone Phil]

I'd suggest going back and read Gingrey's comments again if I was talking to a reasonable person. Here's the issue: a) I'm not talking to one b) re-reading means you had to have read it already. I'm willing to bet the Smash level hacks didn't even read it.

[Keystone Phil]

Smash, please spare me the "respect for being Pro Life" line. All of these rape comments have had your side licking their chops, using this to label any position contrary to your side's on women's issues as "hateful towards women." There aren't real, respectful debates on these issues anymore. It's "agree with us on women's issues or you're a Neanderthal. This isn't up for debate anymore."

[Smash255]

I'd suggest going back and read Gingrey's comments again if I was talking to a reasonable person. Here's the issue: a) I'm not talking to one b) re-reading means you had to have read it already. I'm willing to bet the Smash level hacks didn't even read it.

First off I did read his comments.  His comments were absurd period.

He brought up the legitimate rape issue again.  Rape is rape, the end.  What the hell does a 15 year old saying to her parents she was raped after getting Pregnant from consensual sex with her boyfriend have to do with this?

Secondly, he started talking about when the ovulation occurs, saying that if it happened prior to the rape then the process was already underway.  So that part wasn't too far off the track.  However, then he suggests Akin was partly right again by using the tense thing and comparing it to how he use to tell women to be a bit calmer who were having trouble getting pregnant.  The medical community (you know those that actually deal in facts) have called it utterly absurd, and they would never suggest a woman who is having trouble getting pregnant is too tense and should calm down.

So are you defending these comments?  Yes or no?

[Keystone Phil]

Ok, I'll explain this since you have a very difficult time understanding many things: the "legitimate rape" thing was a reference to forcible rape. Here's something I think you actually understand but you want to be disingenuous. If a girl is a victim of statutory rape, yes, she was raped. Stop trying to make it seem like Republicans don't believe it to be rape. Because her boyfriend didn't force himself on her, there isn't the same level of trauma. But you want to keep playing this game where there's no difference with statutory rape. Whatever. I assume this was brought up so Gingrey could say, "Forcible rape didn't cause the pregnancy. The girl lied. She got pregnant as a result of statutory rape so there wasn't the same level of trauma."

If you seriously believe people in the medical community haven't argued that extreme sudden stress can affect ovulation then you're a bigger moron than I previously thought. In no way did Gingrey or I argue that that necessarily prevents all pregnancy. Period.

[Smash255]

Ok, I'll explain this since you have a very difficult time understanding many things: the "legitimate rape" thing was a reference to forcible rape. Here's something I think you actually understand but you want to be disingenuous. If a girl is a victim of statutory rape, yes, she was raped. Stop trying to make it seem like Republicans don't believe it to be rape. Because her boyfriend didn't force himself on her, there isn't the same level of trauma. But you want to keep playing this game where there's no difference with statutory rape. Whatever. I assume this was brought up so Gingrey could say, "Forcible rape didn't cause the pregnancy. The girl lied. She got pregnant as a result of statutory rape so there wasn't the same level of trauma."

If you seriously believe people in the medical community haven't argued that extreme sudden stress can affect ovulation then you're a bigger moron than I previously thought. In no way did Gingrey or I argue that that necessarily prevents all pregnancy. Period.

The medical community is ripping the ever living hell out of him fornd not be too sense.

Do you think his comments were correct?  Do you think the body can somehow shut down and prevent a Pregnancy as a result of rape?

[Keystone Phil]

Smash, I'll say this one final time because I'm not interested in engaging in this stupid game; the game where I say something and it's twisted in the most heinous of ways to suggest Statement X is "Pro Rape." It's sad that it's come to that these days but whatever. Anyway, here's my final comment: you're out of your mind if you don't think medical research has shown that extreme sudden trauma can affect ovulation. You're cherry picking what the medical community is condemning and applying it to mine and Gingrey's comments. Totally disingenuous but not surprising coming from a nimrod like yourself.

[DrScholl]

Not sure why he felt the need to rehash this, but the more that Republicans engage in this sort of talk, the more it helps Democrats.

[Zioneer]

Not sure why he felt the need to rehash this, but the more that Republicans engage in this sort of talk, the more it helps Democrats.

Basically this comment right here. Progressives and moderates can keep winning if Republicans keep saying things like this.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/phil-gingrey-todd-akin-was-right.php

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Someone can be "partly right" and still be wrong where it counts.
Gingrey's clearly not claiming anything near to what  Akin did. He flat out contradicted it. What is the problem?

And all this hoopla about how crazy Republicans are for answering questions by audiences and news media about rape is ridiculous.

[bedstuy]

Republicans are clearly not making the smart political move here. You don't win in politics by explaining or defending.  Strategically, Republicans need to lay low on abortion for a while because they can't make any headway arguing this point. 

But, it's not totally fair to take Republican to task for discussing this.  If you take the following positions, you have to talk about rape to be honest in your position.
1. Pro-life with an exception for rape
2. Pro-life with an exception for only forcible rape
3. Pro-life, no exceptions.

Those positions necessarily require a working definition of rape, a frank discussion of the morals and consequences of your position.  That discussion is uncomfortable for most people and it's easy to paint these out of touch 60 year old conservative men as clueless and sexist.  But, Republicans are in no way pro-rape or across the board "anti-woman" because they discuss uncomfortable topics.

To put a finer point on it, we ought to discuss these tough moral questions and hypothetical scenarios about rape.  If we don't dig into these debates we just end up with this static conversation between the pro-lifers and pro-choicers as if they were football teams.  To me, the whole rape discussion demonstrates that sex and reproduction are very individually contextual moral issues.  Because the issues are so personal and contextual, the insight may be that legislatures are the wrong decision-makers; women are the right decision makers.

[ingemann]

Phil Gingrey, a doctor (or does he count as like a "self loathing doctor" or something? You know, like the black Republicans/Tea Partiers?), should not be allowed to speak on this. He should be ashamed of himself. Doesn't he know the narrative is already set?

Wow, so when a 13 year old get pregnant with her uncles child, she's not a victim, but just a slut?

...what?

It's the logical conclusion of the argument, that if she become pregnant she was a willing partipant, and that could have some interesting consequence, as she could be tried as a adult for breaking the law against incest and as such even if she avoided imprisonment she would be registered as sex offender.

This may sound insane, but as minors have been prosecuted (for child pornography)) for taking naked pictures of themselves and giving them to their boyfriends (which later spread them), I would say it's a likely risk.

[TNF]

Not sure why he felt the need to rehash this, but the more that Republicans engage in this sort of talk, the more it helps Democrats.

Basically this comment right here. Progressives and moderates can keep winning if Republicans keep saying things like this.

Which is why we should allow them to keep saying this stupid sh**t. You'd think they'd have learned after they lost a race they totally should have won (Missouri)