Gore a crazy liberal? Or just plain CRAZY?!

[Demrepdan]

Is it just me, or has Al Gore gone crazy? I mean, not just because he endorsed Dean, but when I was watching the news as Gore gave his speech about how "wonderful" Dean is, Gore just seemed a little....cooky. Just the way he moved his arms about, and the way he stood, and the way his eyes were glazed over, and his hair was sort of messed up in front. Is Gore slowly losing his touch on reality? Or is he drunk? Whichever it may be, I bet that is the reason that strongly affected his decision to endorse Dean.

And if Gore IS crazy, it won't help Dean's chances to win when Gore starts dancing around in a pink dress with a raw steak on his head saying, "I'm a teapot, I'm a teapot!" Because people will say to themselves, “Hey, Dean was endorsed by that nut ball, I don’t wanna vote for Dean now.”

I'm actually being serious here! If you look at it, you can see the slow insane fall of Gore over the past three years. I think after he lost the election which he came SO close to winning, he just SNAPPED. He grew a beard, he got fat, he shaved the beard, he lost weight, he acted more open and humorous, he moved more left, then he moved even MORE left. And all of this happened in less than THREE YEARS.

I didn't make this thread as a joke, I made it so people can discuss one simple thing: What the F**K happened to Gore?! Does anyone know why he changed so much?

[jravnsbo]

Why did he change?  Well half the country thought he was nuts in 2000 and out of touch.

Yes he has abandoned a lot of his positions in 2000 and run hard to the left.  Who knows what he is thinking, byt then again who ever did.

[TomAtPitt]

I think Gore might be Crazy like a fox here. Endorsing an unelectable candidate in 2004 means he gets to run in 2008.

[agcatter]

Thanks for the endorsement Al.  Best gift you've given Republicans since your performance in the first 2000 debate.  Go Dean.

[jravnsbo]

Thanks Al gore for trying to continue to move the Dem party to the far left extreme.  Plus if this is the plan for the future good!

First you replace moderate Gephardt with Liberal SF Rep. Pelosi and swing left.  Then you essentially have Ted Kennedy and Chuck Schumer running the Senate for the Dems ont he issues; ie memos on judges (sshhh Estrada is a Latino we can't confirm him  shhh) to prescrip drugs who the Dems have said for years they wanted.  But ohh oh not whent he GOP gets credit for it.  Plus the DEm plan was $900 BILLION, $500 Billion more than the GOP plan--so hard to say Dems are deficit Hawks.

If the Dems want a fight of Liberal v Conservative, bring it on!  The Southern Dems are conservative and are going to be running like H*ll from Pelosi and Dean in Congressional races.

Thanks Al.

[Wakie]

Well, here's the reality ... Al Gore's political career is over.  In 2000 he put all of his chips on the table and gambled on one hand (with the recall).  And let's be honest here .... the guy had no choice.  If he hadn't pushed the recall issue then he'd be called a weak sister (someone who backs down in the face of a challenge).

If Bush is reelected in 2004 then in 2008 Hillary will run and frankly she is more likely to win the nomination than Gore.

I think Gore realizes that his political career is basically over.  He also realizes that Bush's campaign fund raising is breaking records and that with the Democrat campaign donations being split amongst 9 people it makes it more difficult to compete (financially speaking).

[Wakie]

Pardon me ... I should have said recount instead of recall.  Ah well ... you know how it is when you're trying to keep all this craziness straight.

[jravnsbo]

Plus Gore just burnt the brideg with Lieberman.  So much for treating your friends and potential allies respectfully.  I didn't see Gore endorseing Lieberman but a 2 min phone call before hand would have been nice.  Many on both sides think that was a poor choice.

Next with CFR being upheld today Dems will not get the soft money they were hoping for and will be further hampered.

Well, here's the reality ... Al Gore's political career is over.  In 2000 he put all of his chips on the table and gambled on one hand (with the recall).  And let's be honest here .... the guy had no choice.  If he hadn't pushed the recall issue then he'd be called a weak sister (someone who backs down in the face of a challenge).

If Bush is reelected in 2004 then in 2008 Hillary will run and frankly she is more likely to win the nomination than Gore.

I think Gore realizes that his political career is basically over.  He also realizes that Bush's campaign fund raising is breaking records and that with the Democrat campaign donations being split amongst 9 people it makes it more difficult to compete (financially speaking).

[migrendel]

I applaud Al Gore's courageous act of dissent, and hope he continues to be a voice of reason. When, anyone, regardless of persuasion, criticizes the extremes of our national society, they are branded to be extreme leftists by people like jransvbo. If anyone dares speak the truth, that all that has happened in Iraq is the unjustified slaughter of the unnamed masses of innocents, they are a traitor, not a person of humanity and goodwill. If someone takes the iniative to say massive curtailments of traditional legal concepts like a fair trial and warranted search and seizure are appalling to the spirit of the Constitution, and that policies grounded in nothing but racist attitudes towards those of Arabic extraction are against the grain of two ideas that are near and dear to me and I hope you, equality and fairness, you are made out to be a humbug of political correctness Nazis, not a person who has a conscience, and a duty to be a witness to the world. Perhaps the day will come when the writing on the wall will be illuminated, and will reveal the simple truth that conservatives have been denying for centuries: liberty is the truth, and arbitrary order is madness.

[12th Doctor]

WORKERS OF THE WORLD UNITE!!!!!!!!!!  lol Just kidding migrendel

[migrendel]

Not that long ago, I truly felt that way. I suppose I've grown older and more capitalistic.

[M]

Demrepdan, I'm surprised and interested to see you had some of the same thoughts I did. When I first heard Gore endorsed Dean, I thought simply, "It's all over- the Clinton Gore behemoth is behind Dean, and the primaries are finished before they started."

But that does not explain it. Why were Gore and Dean having private conversations about Iraq while most Dem leaders, including Kerry and, to some degree, Daschle, still supported it? Why has Gore ignored completely the candidates widely thought to be the Clinton's men, like Wes? And Gore has been moving farther and farther left...

Suddenly, it all fell into place like a jisaw puzzle. The Clinton-Gore behemoth is a myth, and always was. Gore was riding Clinton's presidency since 1992 so he could run in 2000, like most of us thought, but he never did accept any of the centrist portions of Clintonism. He is still the same Mad Lib who briefly broke through every now and then, as when he called global warning a greater threat to the country than any foreign nation. He can be moderate when he has to, but he has a better idea now.

I'd been assuming the dems would lose 2004, and in '08 either Hillary or Gore, not both, would run for and easily win the nomination. But now, I think something completely different has emerged. Gore will run AGAINST Hillary. Hillary will represent Bill's glory days, though a bit to his left, while Al will be the standard bearer of the far left. If Dean picks up the nomination, he could have time to make radical changes in the party (ie, expelling McAuliffe) so that a new, lefty establishment will favor him.

It's the argument of Dean as Goldwater, who invigorates the party ideologically, but is smashed at the polls, and Gore as Nixon, who picks up the benefits. But unlike Tricky Dick, whom neither moderates nor conservatives quite trusted since Nixon played both of them like a fiddle and was really part of neither, Gore will be like Barry returned, sticking to his lefty guns. Also, Gore has reached the level of nearly a Christ figure in parts of the democratic party, and his Second Coming will be greeted with Rapture.

The problem is, I think the situation is different. In '68, weird things were happening in the South that changed the map of American politics. Vietnam and the culture wars had changed the face politics naionwide. The favorite dem was assassinated. And the election could still almost have gone either way. If Dean loses bad next year and takes several senators down with him, and Gore does the same in 2008 (depending on the GOP nominee), American politics could start to get really, really weird. The nation won't stand for a GOP that's as dominant as THAT. But the dems will no longer be a viable opposition. Could a new 1860 be approaching?

Of course, there are other possibilities. Hillary could win the nomination, and maybe win the election (depending on the GOP nomination- they need a moderate, like Giuliani, but they might get cocky and stupid.) A true moderate, like Evan Bayh, might win the nomination and start to make the dems a powerful party once more (though given Joe's dismal failure, that may be tough.) or something I haven't thought of yet might happen.

Thoughts?

[NorthernDog]

Gore said it's time to take back the Democratic party. My question is who "has" the party  now?  I wish someone would have asked him.  Is he referring to the Clintons?  Why do they have to take it back?  Did Gore once have the party and lost it?   His little tirade in Iowa was bizarre - waving his arms, jabbing his finger, and yelling in that stacotto voice.  I bet Hillary tore-up all her Al Gore photographs last night.

[Demrepdan]

Gore is not mad or crazy…to say so is to sink to the level the Drudge report or Russ Limburg…                  

Ouch! That hurt. You just compared me to a Republican! How DARE you!

[Demrepdan]

Demrepdan, I'm surprised and interested to see you had some of the same thoughts I did.

And now a Republican tells me that I have the same thoughts as him?!! LOL Whats happening to me?! I'm turing into a f**king Republican!

[jravnsbo]

Well glad to see you are seeing the light

[Ryan]

Well glad to see you are seeing the light

btw J why dont U have ur state and part tag??

[Demrepdan]

Well glad to see you are seeing the light

btw J why dont U have ur state and part tag??

I asked him in another thread, and he said that he lives on the state line of another state, and may be moving there soon. So he doesn't want to put up his avatar until the move is complete, as to not create confusion as to which state he is from.

Sorry, I guess that really wasn't my place to answer his question. But I'm just letting you know he explained this in another thread.

well I'm ona  border state and probably will be moving soon, so thought I'd wait till I moved or then people would ask why did your state switch.

But now we wonder, what state is he in now, and where will he be moving? lol

[CHRISTOPHER MICHAE]

Demrepdan, I'm surprised and interested to see you had some of the same thoughts I did. When I first heard Gore endorsed Dean, I thought simply, "It's all over- the Clinton Gore behemoth is behind Dean, and the primaries are finished before they started."

But that does not explain it. Why were Gore and Dean having private conversations about Iraq while most Dem leaders, including Kerry and, to some degree, Daschle, still supported it? Why has Gore ignored completely the candidates widely thought to be the Clinton's men, like Wes? And Gore has been moving farther and farther left...

Suddenly, it all fell into place like a jisaw puzzle. The Clinton-Gore behemoth is a myth, and always was. Gore was riding Clinton's presidency since 1992 so he could run in 2000, like most of us thought, but he never did accept any of the centrist portions of Clintonism. He is still the same Mad Lib who briefly broke through every now and then, as when he called global warning a greater threat to the country than any foreign nation. He can be moderate when he has to, but he has a better idea now.

I'd been assuming the dems would lose 2004, and in '08 either Hillary or Gore, not both, would run for and easily win the nomination. But now, I think something completely different has emerged. Gore will run AGAINST Hillary. Hillary will represent Bill's glory days, though a bit to his left, while Al will be the standard bearer of the far left. If Dean picks up the nomination, he could have time to make radical changes in the party (ie, expelling McAuliffe) so that a new, lefty establishment will favor him.

It's the argument of Dean as Goldwater, who invigorates the party ideologically, but is smashed at the polls, and Gore as Nixon, who picks up the benefits. But unlike Tricky Dick, whom neither moderates nor conservatives quite trusted since Nixon played both of them like a fiddle and was really part of neither, Gore will be like Barry returned, sticking to his lefty guns. Also, Gore has reached the level of nearly a Christ figure in parts of the democratic party, and his Second Coming will be greeted with Rapture.

The problem is, I think the situation is different. In '68, weird things were happening in the South that changed the map of American politics. Vietnam and the culture wars had changed the face politics naionwide. The favorite dem was assassinated. And the election could still almost have gone either way. If Dean loses bad next year and takes several senators down with him, and Gore does the same in 2008 (depending on the GOP nominee), American politics could start to get really, really weird. The nation won't stand for a GOP that's as dominant as THAT. But the dems will no longer be a viable opposition. Could a new 1860 be approaching?

Of course, there are other possibilities. Hillary could win the nomination, and maybe win the election (depending on the GOP nomination- they need a moderate, like Giuliani, but they might get cocky and stupid.) A true moderate, like Evan Bayh, might win the nomination and start to make the dems a powerful party once more (though given Joe's dismal failure, that may be tough.) or something I haven't thought of yet might happen.

Thoughts?

The Gore as Nixon thing wouldn't work. People will be aghast that Gore's radicalism has come out of the closet again. Voters already look at Gore as a Benedict Arnold. Al Gore has turned his back on the Glory Days of the Clinton Presidency. It was a huge blunder for him to not have President Clinton campaigning for him in 2000.  Al screwed up his own chances. He could have ridden the coat tails of the Clinton Presidency, despite the Lewinsky ordeal, and the bizarre impeachment [for Clinton's lies about SEX].

[Nym90]

Uh oh, I sense an impeachment thread starting. Actually, it might be kind of fun to get one going, since we didn't have this forum back in 1998, if we had I'm sure we would've had some rip-roaring debates about it.

[CHRISTOPHER MICHAE]

Just the point, he lied to the nation.

about sex. What is an impeachable offense again? Treason, High Crimes and Misdemeanors! Since when are blow jobs an impeachable offense? The Founding Fathers didn't include it in the Constitution. Oh, but I forgot, Republicans have their own version!

[dazzleman]

I think that Gore's endorsement of Dean is related to his ongoing feud with the Clintons.  He deeply resents that Bill Clinton placed Hillary's election to the Senate over his election to the presidency, and he is doing this to get even, and to try to wrest control of the party from the Clintons.  I don't think he even cares whether Dean wins, or even whether he can get the nomination in 2008, as long as it somehow hurts the Clintons.

I have thought for some time that Gore came unhinged after the 2000 election.  I watched a speech he made about a year ago, when he was flailing around, had a wild look in his eyes, and was saying outlandish things, and I thought, this guy's gone nuts.  Nothing he has said or done since then has convinced me otherwise.

At one point, I used to like Al Gore, but how many times can a man re-invent himself?  Most people don't change their basic political views after a certain age, but Gore has gone from a conservative pro-defense and pro-life southern Democrat to a rabid left-winger.  He seems to be all form and no substance, and it seems he just came unhinged when he wasn't able to realize the ambition that his whole life was driving toward, something to which he apparently has a keen sense of entitlement.

It should be an interesting soap opera to watch what he does next.

[jravnsbo]

Well i could as I am in MN but moving to SD soon so instead of answering 40 questions then I'm waiting.

Well glad to see you are seeing the light

btw J why dont U have ur state and part tag??

[jravnsbo]

I do think it is good for Dems though to at least question Hilliary as the nominee.  Some seem it is a foregone conclusion.  Gore could challenge her or at least keep door open for others.

Demrepdan, I'm surprised and interested to see you had some of the same thoughts I did. When I first heard Gore endorsed Dean, I thought simply, "It's all over- the Clinton Gore behemoth is behind Dean, and the primaries are finished before they started."

But that does not explain it. Why were Gore and Dean having private conversations about Iraq while most Dem leaders, including Kerry and, to some degree, Daschle, still supported it? Why has Gore ignored completely the candidates widely thought to be the Clinton's men, like Wes? And Gore has been moving farther and farther left...

Suddenly, it all fell into place like a jisaw puzzle. The Clinton-Gore behemoth is a myth, and always was. Gore was riding Clinton's presidency since 1992 so he could run in 2000, like most of us thought, but he never did accept any of the centrist portions of Clintonism. He is still the same Mad Lib who briefly broke through every now and then, as when he called global warning a greater threat to the country than any foreign nation. He can be moderate when he has to, but he has a better idea now.

I'd been assuming the dems would lose 2004, and in '08 either Hillary or Gore, not both, would run for and easily win the nomination. But now, I think something completely different has emerged. Gore will run AGAINST Hillary. Hillary will represent Bill's glory days, though a bit to his left, while Al will be the standard bearer of the far left. If Dean picks up the nomination, he could have time to make radical changes in the party (ie, expelling McAuliffe) so that a new, lefty establishment will favor him.

It's the argument of Dean as Goldwater, who invigorates the party ideologically, but is smashed at the polls, and Gore as Nixon, who picks up the benefits. But unlike Tricky Dick, whom neither moderates nor conservatives quite trusted since Nixon played both of them like a fiddle and was really part of neither, Gore will be like Barry returned, sticking to his lefty guns. Also, Gore has reached the level of nearly a Christ figure in parts of the democratic party, and his Second Coming will be greeted with Rapture.

The problem is, I think the situation is different. In '68, weird things were happening in the South that changed the map of American politics. Vietnam and the culture wars had changed the face politics naionwide. The favorite dem was assassinated. And the election could still almost have gone either way. If Dean loses bad next year and takes several senators down with him, and Gore does the same in 2008 (depending on the GOP nominee), American politics could start to get really, really weird. The nation won't stand for a GOP that's as dominant as THAT. But the dems will no longer be a viable opposition. Could a new 1860 be approaching?

Of course, there are other possibilities. Hillary could win the nomination, and maybe win the election (depending on the GOP nomination- they need a moderate, like Giuliani, but they might get cocky and stupid.) A true moderate, like Evan Bayh, might win the nomination and start to make the dems a powerful party once more (though given Joe's dismal failure, that may be tough.) or something I haven't thought of yet might happen.

Thoughts?

The Gore as Nixon thing wouldn't work. People will be aghast that Gore's radicalism has come out of the closet again. Voters already look at Gore as a Benedict Arnold. Al Gore has turned his back on the Glory Days of the Clinton Presidency. It was a huge blunder for him to not have President Clinton campaigning for him in 2000.  Al screwed up his own chances. He could have ridden the coat tails of the Clinton Presidency, despite the Lewinsky ordeal, and the bizarre impeachment [for Clinton's lies about SEX].

[jravnsbo]

oh yeah rather have my Presidential vote be in MN, as SD will overwheleming vote for Bush, but at least in SD I get to vote against Daschle and hopefully for Thune.  Love Thune, good friend!  Man I'd love to see him as  a Senator, should have been in 2002.