Progressive Caucus Convention

[Peter]

Due to the fact that the Caucus forum has had so little discussion on the matter of our platform, seemingly because people don't know its going on, I've decided in my position as Chairman to bring the Convention onto the main forums in the hope of actually getting some discussion.

The present membership is as follows:

Lewis Trondheim
ILikeVerin
Peter Bell
blerpiez
Defarge
IrishDemocrat
Alcon
Akno21
Wildcard
Al
True Democrat
Siege40
MAS117
Nym90
Harry
The Bulldog
Immy
Ian

My draft for a platform follows.

[Peter]

Gay Marriage

The Progressive Caucus is happy with the status quo of Atlasia that has granted to gay couples the joys and benefits of marriage. We regard this as a great victory for equality in society and will oppose all attempts to damage the consensus that has been achieved on this issue.

Death Penalty

The Progressive Caucus condemns the practice of executing juvenile criminals as regressive. We oppose the practice of the death penalty in the majority of cases and would only support in cases of terrorism, treason and serial murder. We call for reform of the system that will require stricter standards of evidence and more capacity for Appeals courts to conduct actual innocence review in addition to the procedural reviews.

School Prayer

The Progressive Caucus supports the right of individual children to choose to pray in school and we support schools being able to provide facilities to allow students their free exercise rights during their free time. We do not think it is correct that classroom or organised time is used for school prayer.

Sex Education and Contraception in Schools

The Progressive Caucus believes that sex education in schools should be taught according to guidelines drawn by local communities, specifically including education on STDs and methods of contraception. We think that local communities should be able to include education on matters of homosexuality and abstinence at their own discretion, but we encourage it in both cases. Contraception should be made available to teenagers over the age of 16 confidentially in schools if the local community approves, but once again we encourage it.

Media Regulation

The Progressive Caucus opposes regulation of the media in all its forms as it is an attack on free speech and the free press. We will work to ensure that all media outlets are able to transmit without regard to state censorship, but with regard to what they feel their viewers and readers want.

Taxation

The Progressive Caucus supports the continuation of a fair, progressive system of taxation at the federal level of government.

Education

The Progressive Caucus supports the doctrine of educational funding and control expounded by Mideast Governor Bell: We support a system that places control over funding at the community level. We support ever increasing funding of education so that we can have truly the best educated citizens in the world for the benefit of the the future economy.

The Pledge of Allegiance

The Progressive Caucus feels that any citizen being required to invoke the existence of a God in order to pledge allegiance to the nation is a clear establishment of religion. We support the removal of the words "under God" from the Pledge.

Environment

The Progressive Caucus supports all measures to reduce the amount that industry pollutes the environment; We embrace the Clean Energy Act pioneered by District 2 Senator Siege40 as a good step forward. We urge all Regions to initiate programmes to protect the environment, develop clean technologies and to place higher environmental standards onto industry.

Pornography

The Progressive Caucus supports the right of teenagers of 16 years and over to buy and view pornography.

I have not written planks for either abortion or affirmitive action since I feel I would be out of step with the majority of members if I articulated my own feelings on the matter.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Do we vote on this now?

[Peter]

Sorry, I should have been more specific.

We'll have a few days debate that will end Tuesday night; Any proposed additions or changes can be submitted in this time.

I will then open a vote where each member must vote on each individual policy proposal; A majority being necessary for a proposal to pass.

[Jake]

I'd like to join the Caucus

[MAS117]

Like I said on the progressive forum, I'm for it all besides the Pledge & School prayer.

[Peter]

I'd like to join the Caucus

You might think its funny or "smart" to join the caucus for the sole purpose of skewing the votes, but I don't.

[Jake]

I'd like to join the Caucus

You might think its funny or "smart" to join the caucus for the sole purpose of skewing the votes, but I don't.

Um, I agree with most of your platform. Sections 1, 2, 3, 7, and 9.  Are you going to kick out all members who don't agree with all of it?

[Peter]

I'd like to join the Caucus

You might think its funny or "smart" to join the caucus for the sole purpose of skewing the votes, but I don't.

Um, I agree with most of your platform. Sections 1, 2, 3, 7, and 9.  Are you going to kick out all members who don't agree with all of it?

Actually I'm not bestowed with that authority; Technically there is nothing that I can do to stop you joining, though if I want to I can propose a vote to throw you out (I'm not thinking of doing it before you ask).

Its not exactly something one expects that Republicans start joining the caucus. If you are genuine, then I welcome you, but if this is just a joke then I urge you to please not waste my time and energy.

I'm also rather shocked at your supporting the death penalty plank when you strongly questioned my decision to commute the death penalty of a guy convicted when he was a kid.

[Jake]

I'd like to join the Caucus

You might think its funny or "smart" to join the caucus for the sole purpose of skewing the votes, but I don't.

Um, I agree with most of your platform. Sections 1, 2, 3, 7, and 9.  Are you going to kick out all members who don't agree with all of it?

Actually I'm not bestowed with that authority; Technically there is nothing that I can do to stop you joining, though if I want to I can propose a vote to throw you out (I'm not thinking of doing it before you ask).

Its not exactly something one expects that Republicans start joining the caucus. If you are genuine, then I welcome you, but if this is just a joke then I urge you to please not waste my time and energy.

I'm also rather shocked at your supporting the death penalty plank when you strongly questioned my decision to commute the death penalty of a guy convicted when he was a kid.

I oppose the death penalty when it is not 100% sure that the crime was committed.  I can and will compromise if that is achieved and I promise not to impede or hold up anything. 

[Akno21]

I posted my thoughts on the contrapcetion issue on progressive forums, the rest I agree with.

[Peter]

To save some time, I've copied across what limited debate was had on the forum:

Akno

We shouldn't leave sex ed up to the local communities. If we let them decide, then many will not teach any sex ed of meaning and we'll get homophobic graduates. We need to change the cultural atmosphere in the south and rural areas, not settle for what is currently in place.

Blerpiez

[replying to sex ed plank]
I agree we should set some guidelines, but still try to not seem too restrictive. How about if communities either had to promote tolerance of homosexuality or nothing at all about homosexuality?

Lewis

I certainly don't support the death penalty in cases of terrorism, treason and serial murder.

[responding to sex ed plank]
14...I certainly could have used such a service when I was 15.
Also, girls specifically need pretty detailed sex ed linking the scientific with the practical, and pretty early on too - like, about the time the first girls in the class are starting to get their periods. It can't hurt boys to hear all that, either. (I'm not sure what sex ed is like in the US, thence I don't know if this is needed...I knwo it can be very different in Germany...I got it, in biology classes, about three times in my school career, and only the last time was such info given, by which time it was a little late...)

[responding to Pledge plank]
Can anyone explain to me why ordinary citizens should have to "pledge" their "allegiance" to their country anyways?
Because if we all agree that the pledge is just an empty stupid joke, then I don't think I can get sufficiently worked up on the issue to actually include it in my platform and risk turning anybody off.

[Jake]

Responding the Akno's point on sex-ed, he is just showing again that he wants central control. Set basic guidelines, but don't force a curruculum on the local school boards.

Responding the Lewis's point on the death penalty. That is insane. The people caught in connection to the Madrid train bombings can only get 40 years in prison because of crazy anti-death penalty laws.

And to the pledge point, citizens don't have to pledge, it is voluntary and never has been mandatory.

[Akno21]

Now that I think about it, perhaps we should not have schools say the pledge until 6th grade. Why teach little kindergartners it, they have no clue what it means, but it might make them blind patriots.

[Akno21]

Jake, if central control will prevent children in certain areas from being taught anti-homosexuality things, then so be it.

[Peter]

And to the pledge point, citizens don't have to pledge, it is voluntary and never has been mandatory.

Obviously not. However if you want to pledge allegiance to your country, it is a legal requirement for fulfilling the pledge to invoke the existence of a God. To me, that is a clear establishment prohibted under whatever our version of the first is.

[Jake]

Jake, if central control will prevent children in certain areas from being taught anti-homosexuality things, then so be it.

How will it result in that.  I live in a rural, conservative area, and we're not taught anything about homosexuality. We're told to make up our own minds and not be brainwashed either way. You're worried about students being brainwashed into hating gays, what about them being brainwashed into supporting gay rights. Who is to say what is right in that situation?

[Akno21]

Jake, if central control will prevent children in certain areas from being taught anti-homosexuality things, then so be it.

How will it result in that.  I live in a rural, conservative area, and we're not taught anything about homosexuality. We're told to make up our own minds and not be brainwashed either way. You're worried about students being brainwashed into hating gays, what about them being brainwashed into supporting gay rights. Who is to say what is right in that situation?

Ignoring controversial issues is not the answer. I want it taught that homosexuality is different than heterosexuality, and I don't want kids to learn that it is worse. I am a liberal, and that is what I stand for. Of course, I would not want a question like that to be on a test, where a kid has to answer something is true even if they personally think it's false. We have to strike the right balance. Right now, many rural schools are taught more like private christian ones. Tjat needs to stop, and this is a big issue in that fight.

[Gustaf]

I could join this, as long as I don't have to agree on every single part of the platform. This seems pretty good though.

[Akno21]

I could join this, as long as I don't have to agree on every single part of the platform. This seems pretty good though.

Plenty of members have slight disagreements.

[ian]

Responding the Akno's point on sex-ed, he is just showing again that he wants central control. Set basic guidelines, but don't force a curruculum on the local school boards.

Responding the Lewis's point on the death penalty. That is insane. The people caught in connection to the Madrid train bombings can only get 40 years in prison because of crazy anti-death penalty laws.

And to the pledge point, citizens don't have to pledge, it is voluntary and never has been mandatory.

In Arkansas, it IS mandatory to say the pledge in public schools, unless my teachers were lying to me.  And even if it wasn't, it's still a case of intolerance.  It's the same situation as school prayer; people don't HAVE to do it, but it is incredibly uncomfortable when everyone around you IS.  Upholding the separation of church and state in Atlasia is something that is imperative to me and progressives everywhere.

[Peter]

This is a last call for any comments and/or submissions for a vote.

[Nym90]

This is a last call for any comments and/or submissions for a vote.

I fully agree with the platform; I can't see anything that needs addition. Good job.

[MAS117]

I dont agree with the Pledge & School prayer.

[Jake]

Responding the Akno's point on sex-ed, he is just showing again that he wants central control. Set basic guidelines, but don't force a curruculum on the local school boards.

Responding the Lewis's point on the death penalty. That is insane. The people caught in connection to the Madrid train bombings can only get 40 years in prison because of crazy anti-death penalty laws.

And to the pledge point, citizens don't have to pledge, it is voluntary and never has been mandatory.

In Arkansas, it IS mandatory to say the pledge in public schools, unless my teachers were lying to me.  And even if it wasn't, it's still a case of intolerance.  It's the same situation as school prayer; people don't HAVE to do it, but it is incredibly uncomfortable when everyone around you IS.  Upholding the separation of church and state in Atlasia is something that is imperative to me and progressives everywhere.

Maybe that's a state law, you do live in the bible belt.  In PA, you don't have to say the pledge.