The demise of the Pacific: an explanation

[Хahar 🤔]

We have come not to bury Atlasia, but to save it.

Atlasia has always gone through cycles of boom and bust in terms of participation and activity. At this point it is clear that Atlasia is at a low ebb in those terms. However, the last time Atlasia was at a peak, people took it upon themselves to create myriad extra offices (all regional offices, it should be noted), and now that the game has entered this rut, those positions are unfillable. The most obvious example was in the Pacific, which is why it was chosen for this operation (the seven officeholders in the region prior to the commencement of the operation were NVGonzalez, IBDD, Superique, solopop, wan, Marnetmar, and freefair, and of those only Superique and solopop were remotely active), but it has never been merely confined to that region: for an example, you need only look at the current elections in the Northeast, where there are four candidates for five positions. It goes without saying that this is a problem.

No matter what happens in the Pacific in the future, Operation Pacific Rimjob will have been successful, because it has clearly demonstrated the fundamental failings of the regional system in existence today. Nobody now would argue that the regional setup that exists now is healthy; while some of our opponents might wish to revert the regional situation to the status quo ante, doing that would do nothing to fix the fundamental problem of there being nowhere near the level of participation in the game that would be necessary to support the amount of regional government that presently exists. Reasonable people will recognize this now that it has been forcibly brought to their attention.

The response of some people will then be to say that the process of addressing the problem of the regions should have been done the normal way, through constitutional amendment. That is an admirable attitude, but it is entirely naïve. I have been a citizen of Atlasia for most of the game's history, and in that tie I have seen countless attempts at reform, including reform of the regions. These attempts invariably fail because Atlasia has a sizable population of reactionaries who will never agree to any change, no matter how distasteful the status quo might be. The last time that reform was a politically viable option was during the Wixted administration in 2007. It should come as no surprise that there have been no substantial changes to the governmental structure of Atlasia in the time since then.

I know that I have spent enough time futilely trying to attempt to bring about change to fix Atlasia within the context of the system, and I am sure that others feel the same way; this is why we plotters have opted instead to take direct action. There has been enough idle sloganeering on the part of those who wish to do something to fix the game; it is high time for propaganda of the deed, and that is what has happened here. Disagree with the actions in the Pacific if you will, but know that they were not aimless terrorism; the purpose of our endeavors has always been to improve the game.

If you have questions, feel free to ask here and I or one of my compatriots will attempt to answer them. If you wish to make personal attacks, this is also a good place for that.

[ilikeverin]

Hear, hear!

[TNF]

Hear, hear!

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

That's right. Every attempt at reforming Atlasia, trying something new, going out of the box, even a little step, utterly failed. I can't even remember all worthy initiatives that were DoA, because "this is never going to pass" or "this is too radical" or, naturally, "this is against our sacred traditions".

Those who are now screaming about "Xahar & Co." destroying the game should rather look at their miserable records.

[Velasco]

That's right. Every attempt at reforming Atlasia, trying something new, going out of the box, even a little step, utterly failed. I can't even remember all worthy initiatives that were DoA, because "this is never going to pass" or "this is too radical" or, naturally, "this is against our sacred traditions".

If that's true, and I don't have reasons to doubt it, the reactions unleashed by this initiative in the Pacific region only induce to pessimism. It doesn't seem that nobody is addressing the failings exposed; people is simply talking about restoring the "order". You should call John Engle or someone else, apparently what people needs is food and words.

[Sbane]

Going back to a citizen initiative legislative process with an elected governor did not need the destruction of the region itself. Just my two cents.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Going back to a citizen initiative legislative process with an elected governor did not need the destruction of the region itself. Just my two cents.

+1

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

That's right. Every attempt at reforming Atlasia, trying something new, going out of the box, even a little step, utterly failed. I can't even remember all worthy initiatives that were DoA, because "this is never going to pass" or "this is too radical" or, naturally, "this is against our sacred traditions".

If that's true, and I don't have reasons to doubt it, the reactions unleashed by this initiative in the Pacific region only induce to pessimism. It doesn't seem that nobody is addressing the failings exposed; people is simply talking about restoring the "order". You should call John Engle or someone else, apparently what people needs is food and words.

The system has failed. Therefore, instead of restoring status quo antabellum, a broken status quo, we ought to take this lesson and honestly think what to do.

It seems Atlasia is divided between a bunch of "this is serious business, why change anything? bores and so-called "loonies". And I tend to agree much more with the "loonies". I've been long proposing we try something new, go off the box to make Atlasia more interesting and each time I heard the same bulls**t. Well, at least the "loonies" actually something.

[Velasco]

Going back to a citizen initiative legislative process with an elected governor did not need the destruction of the region itself. Just my two cents.

Maybe. They might have chosen another type of action. Nevertheless, it's true that the region was virtually dead. To be scandalized ado and not addressing to the question of law is a reaction that personally seems to me to be disheartening.

[Sbane]

Going back to a citizen initiative legislative process with an elected governor did not need the destruction of the region itself. Just my two cents.

Maybe. They might have chosen another type of action. Nevertheless, it's true that the region was virtually dead. To be scandalized ado and not addressing to the question of law is a reaction that personally seems to me to be disheartening.

What? Yes, the Pacific region was dead which is why Xahar was appointed administrator and why there was a Constitutional Convention. They could have created a citizen initiative process if they thought legislatures wouldn't work. I don't see what destroying the region accomplished. And I certainly don't see how that is supposed to save the game.

[Velasco]

Going back to a citizen initiative legislative process with an elected governor did not need the destruction of the region itself. Just my two cents.

Maybe. They might have chosen another type of action. Nevertheless, it's true that the region was virtually dead. To be scandalized ado and not addressing to the question of law is a reaction that personally seems to me to be disheartening.

What? Yes, the Pacific region was dead which is why Xahar was appointed administrator and why there was a Constitutional Convention. They could have created a citizen initiative process if they thought legislatures wouldn't work. I don't see what destroying the region accomplished. And I certainly don't see how that is supposed to save the game.

You should asked them, because I wasn't involved and I really don't know. However, in the OP Xahar states that there's not enough level of participation to maintain the current regional offices. Do you disagree? They chose a course of legal action that translates into facts what was the real situation. Also, it's possible to argue that the Pacific region was a legal fiction; it was actually dead. In any case, checking some reactions and the general environment, my opinion is that there's no easy solution for the whole game. Likely, I will be unseated in the current regional elections and soon I'll be another member of the wide group of inactive citizens. I think I'll move to the unorganized territories then.

[Maxwell]

Likely, I will be unseated in the current regional elections and soon I'll be another member of the wide group of inactive citizens.

You're the only one above quota though , It looks like Jerry is getting unseated.

[Velasco]

If I'm finally elected, I'll maintain my compromise with the region and I'll try to contribute to make a Constitutional reform, a debate that I believe that it's suspended due to the inertia and the resistance to the change. For sure, it's my fault too.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

That's right. Every attempt at reforming Atlasia, trying something new, going out of the box, even a little step, utterly failed. I can't even remember all worthy initiatives that were DoA, because "this is never going to pass" or "this is too radical" or, naturally, "this is against our sacred traditions".

Those who are now screaming about "Xahar & Co." destroying the game should rather look at their miserable records.

Take it easy Kawejt. I have authored numerous attempts to reform the game, I brought a proposal to consolidate the Regions as desired by Antonio before the Senate when there was a big push for that a year or two ago. I authored part of an amendment aimed at boasting participation in the regional elections by tying them to the Regional Senate elections. They all failed, not because I or regioanlists opposed them, but largely because anti-Regionalist obrstructed them because they didn't destroy the Regions. Also in the former there were a lot of concerns regarding the shifting of states around and how to run that process, which is a legitimate one to have and should have been explored but that takes careful analysis and reasoned debate and when half the Senate has to be draged in chains to vote, that is hard to do. I have also worked on numerous efforts on the Game Moderator and have pushed for greater accountability and activity in all branches and at all levels of gov't for years. In many ways I am just as frustrated at the lack of success as Xahar. However it is ridculous to assert that all those who have advocated for Regions have miserable reform records and shouldn't critique Rimjob thus. I have worked tirelessly to reform this game and just because it isn't in the way that Xahar wants, doesn't give you the right to call it miserable.

I said they are destroying the game, becuase that is what the impact of what they are doing will be, even if it is not there intent. Obstruction is a two way street and when you block or assist in blocking all reforms that don't destroy the regions you hold just as much responsbible as those who insist on there preservation and proctection for nothing getting done. Regions have not destroyed this game, inactivity has. Regional legislatures were advocated because at the time, we had a very vivid example of their success. One of the great beauties of regional rights is the ability to select the system of their choice and if the initiative system is best for the PAcific, they reserve the right to so do it. They had complete control of the council, they could have made any changes they wanted, instead they bombed a region as a childish tantrum to try and scare people into moving in their direction. A direction that is as misguided as it is dangerous for game.

One of the things that did destroy the Pacific was inactivity and lack of competition. Actions like this will only serve to drive people away and out of the game. And I don't see how replicating the activity levels of the Pacific, as well as its partisan leanings (since those who leave will skew heavilly towards the right) will do anything but to put the nation into the same state as the Pacific was in. Consolidation is one thing and we'll try to work out a deal in the Senate to do just that and see if this "teachable moment" will lead to some people being more open to the idea. Regional Abolition is something quite different and will turn this into a game of a 50 with a Federal Gov't run by an exclusive leftwing clique. (Which is where it was heading just about in 2008). Maybe that is what some of you want, you can pass a legislative restart and then have fun renacting the agenda without opposition. But it won't take long and once that is over, the game will be even worse, it will be dead.

We are better off bringing people in, encouraging activity and working to restore competition of ideas and beliefs. But that is kind of hard to do on a site dominated by a single viewpoint of whom a great number of people  spends a good part of the day working to drive those on the other side off the site. It will be especially hard to do when the Gov't structure is so designed to reflect that approach and attitude. This is the internet, there are a lot of "special people" here and there are many that degrade the site I am not talking about them. We should have things to weed out socks and trolls and so forth. (You know people bitch about the length of my posts, but I would rather cover my bases now then have to explain myself a million times later on subpoints and minor issues. See my petition for a case in point of the one time I was brief and had to clarify what should have been clear to begin with. I have also had to use PMs to explain it as well to people. This last sentence or two is an example of what makes them so long.)

[Adam Griffin]

At the end of the day, it looks like we all got what we wanted!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

At the end of the day, it looks like we all got what we wanted!

Cannot imagine that having anything to do with the success achieved now compared to the failure last time against a backdrop of hostage taking.

Also my lengthy post above, should be required reading for anyone desiring the truth not peddled by radcalist propaganda machine.

[Adam Griffin]

At the end of the day, it looks like we all got what we wanted!

Cannot imagine that having anything to do with the success achieved now compared to the failure last time against a backdrop of hostage taking.

Also my lengthy post above, should be required reading for anyone desiring the truth not peddled by radcalist propaganda machine.

History is written by those who are concise, Yankee!