Impact of ACA on Healthcare Costs at Various Income Levels

[cheesepizza]

http://taxfoundation.org/blog/obamacare-premiums-california-lower-expected-still-twice-cost-current-premiums 

Here's an interesting article on the healthcare law.  I've noticed that liberals on various sites are trumpeting the premium reduction, but there's a significant element they leave out.  For those at 300% of the poverty line (~50,000-60,000 a year), Obamacare causes their premiums to double.

This healthcare law truly appears to be a rich-poor divide.  The poor get practically free healthcare under this system at the expense of the middle class.

Opinions?

[King]

It probably has something to do with the fact those pre-ACA rates are made up based on bogus searches for advertised premiums of cheap plans on eHealthInsurance.com by a Forbes editorial that are not legitimate representations of the true cost of healthcare.

The law introduces a 9.5% of income cap on premiums for the 300% level.  There is a reason for this.  There are people who pay more than this already existing.  6% average with a 9.5% cap will be a huge  reduction for most people.  It's a reduction of variance in the average rate which brings people closer to actually paying the average.

There's also a fundamental misunderstanding of health insurance in these kind of arguments.  Premiums are generated within risk pools and, while there is some rich-poor subsidy, the majority of subsidy is healthy-sick.  Poorer Americans can lower richer Americans' premiums, or at least offset increases, simply by being young and healthy.  With the elderly and destitute removed from the equation under Medicare/caid, that pretty much makes them the number one source of new care under the law.  Of course, with some 21 states refusing to expand Medicaid, you could see premiums go up there.

Thanks for playing.

[cheesepizza]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.   It sounds like you're more of a Democrat to me.

http://energycommerce.house.gov/rate-shock
http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2013/06/23/even-in-over-regulated-washington-state-obamacare-will-increase-individual-market-premiums-by-34-80-percent/

Anyways, it appears that there are solid studies showing huge rate increases and potential for even more.  What I was pointing out is that the gains for the poor are paid for at the expense of the middle class.

[opebo]

This healthcare law truly appears to be a rich-poor divide.  The poor get practically free healthcare under this system at the expense of the middle class.

Opinions?

Its great to see non-poors get their comeuppance, CP.

[Lief 🗽]

Yeah, even if it were true that the middle-class were subsidizing the health coverage of the poor, what's wrong with that? Pretty sure that's how it works in most civilized countries where the poor aren't expected to just quickly die in the streets if they get sick.

[King]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.

They're misguided.  It's the best private industry-centric solution for rising healthcare costs and universal care.  If you don't believe Obamacare can work, you don't believe in private health insurance.

[Warren 4 Secretary of Everything]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.

Because he's the hero Republicans need, but not the one the deserve right now. So they'll hate him, because he can take it. He's not just the forum's hero. He's our silent Republican protector. Our watchful, moderate guardian. A Blue Knight.

[t_host1]

Nothing there... the impact of the ACA. Know one will have to keep up with what and whatever of their health and it's responsibilities. Obama has upped his mark on his American transformation. His simple implant will take care of you, your money and health.

  http://news.msn.com/rumors/rumor-obamacare-requires-microchip-implants
The story says it is not true, yet, the rule is titled and sectioned.
[ Subtitle C-11 Sec. 2521— National Medical Device Registry ]

[cheesepizza]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.

They're misguided.  It's the best private industry-centric solution for rising healthcare costs and universal care.  If you don't believe Obamacare can work, you don't believe in private health insurance.

All I was saying is, aren't you closer to the Democrats on the basic economic issues?  Wouldn't that make you more of a Democrat?

[barfbag]

This healthcare law truly appears to be a rich-poor divide.  The poor get practically free healthcare under this system at the expense of the middle class.

Opinions?

Its great to see non-poors get their comeuppance, CP.

It's too bad Obama's policies always result in class envy.

[King]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.

They're misguided.  It's the best private industry-centric solution for rising healthcare costs and universal care.  If you don't believe Obamacare can work, you don't believe in private health insurance.

All I was saying is, aren't you closer to the Democrats on the basic economic issues?  Wouldn't that make you more of a Democrat?

If not sucking the party line cock to lube it up for a firm place up my ass on every issue means closer to the Democrats, then yeah.

[anvi]

I was tempted to put that point in a bit milder way yesterday, but I'm glad I waited and let King say it.

[opebo]

Its great to see non-poors get their comeuppance, CP.

It's too bad Obama's policies always result in class envy.

I prefer 'rage' or 'hatred'.  When one is enslaved one should feel something stronger than envy - one should want to kill one's owners.

[barfbag]

Its great to see non-poors get their comeuppance, CP.

It's too bad Obama's policies always result in class envy.

I prefer 'rage' or 'hatred'.  When one is enslaved one should feel something stronger than envy - one should want to kill one's owners.

We have all become slaves to Obama. If only Obama knew what it was like for those of us who have to work to make a living instead of playing gold without the press and sending our wives on $180,000 cruises to Europe.

[opebo]

Its great to see non-poors get their comeuppance, CP.

It's too bad Obama's policies always result in class envy.

I prefer 'rage' or 'hatred'.  When one is enslaved one should feel something stronger than envy - one should want to kill one's owners.

We have all become slaves to Obama. If only Obama knew what it was like for those of us who have to work to make a living instead of playing gold without the press and sending our wives on $180,000 cruises to Europe.

'playing gold without the press'?  Are you drunk-typing?

[Maxwell]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.   It sounds like you're more of a Democrat to me.

King is merely voicing healthcare ideas endorsed by Richard Nixon and Bob Dole, and they're Republicans. He's a modern day liberal Republican. Simple as that. He has also said something to the effect of chronically lowering corporate tax rates (if I am quoting you wrong, please tell me), so I think he fits in with a Republican Party of yesteryear.

[cheesepizza]

King, if you support the healthcare law, why do you have an R avatar?  I don't know any Republicans who support it.   It sounds like you're more of a Democrat to me.

King is merely voicing healthcare ideas endorsed by Richard Nixon and Bob Dole, and they're Republicans. He's a modern day liberal Republican. Simple as that. He has also said something to the effect of chronically lowering corporate tax rates (if I am quoting you wrong, please tell me), so I think he fits in with a Republican Party of yesteryear.

Thanks, Maxwell.  I get it.  I was thinking very much in terms of modern-day Republicans, but I see the historical references.

[bullmoose88]

I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if a Scotsman was told he wasn't Scottish. I fear something terrible has happened.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

Nothing there... the impact of the ACA. Know one will have to keep up with what and whatever of their health and it's responsibilities. Obama has upped his mark on his American transformation. His simple implant will take care of you, your money and health.

  http://news.msn.com/rumors/rumor-obamacare-requires-microchip-implants
The story says it is not true, yet, the rule is titled and sectioned.
[ Subtitle C-11 Sec. 2521— National Medical Device Registry ]

Why don'tcha try to find that in the actual bill (warning, massive file)?

There's no such thing, bru. No "National Medical Device Registry", not even a "Section 2521". Perhaps you should stop getting your information from poorly-designed conspiracy-theorist websites.

[jaichind]

This has been talked about, including myself. several times.  There is a Obamacare cliff at 400% FPL where below it insurance premiums are capped at 9.5% of MAGI, and those even $1 above it will have to pay, depending on the situation, several to over ten thousand dollars extra than those right below that threshold.  Given how contractors and retirees can control how much they work and get paid, it is clear that the subsidy cost of Obamacare will higher than what the Obama regime claim.  Of course they know this so within Obamacare has a escape clause where if Obamacare subsidies ends up above threshold as a % of GDP, the subsidies shrink and the 400% of FPL might then end up at 300% FPL which in turn just mean the number of people Obamacare claims will be covered on the long run will end up being incorrect.  In the end, what Obama promised will be unfulfilled either in terms of cost or number of people covered or most likely both.    

[t_host1]

Nothing there... the impact of the ACA. Know one will have to keep up with what and whatever of their health and it's responsibilities. Obama has upped his mark on his American transformation. His simple implant will take care of you, your money and health.

  http://news.msn.com/rumors/rumor-obamacare-requires-microchip-implants
The story says it is not true, yet, the rule is titled and sectioned.
[ Subtitle C-11 Sec. 2521— National Medical Device Registry ]

Why don'tcha try to find that in the actual bill (warning, massive file)?

There's no such thing, bru. No "National Medical Device Registry", not even a "Section 2521". Perhaps you should stop getting your information from poorly-designed conspiracy-theorist websites.

 Thank you for the advisory and I did not click your link. If you’re not aware that your outcome is en ‘predetermined mode’, you will and learn that human genetics are not compatible with progressive governance, hence, why, the USA has the all-important 2 year governing renewal format.