PJ Polling: Constitutional Convention

[PJ]

Averroes and Spamage have both campaigned on this. What do you think?

[Maxwell]

I'm undecided, but if its what we have left, I could see myself in support of it.

[Napoleon]

Did Nix come out in support or does my new avatar confuse people?

[Spamage]

Did Nix come out in support or does my new avatar confuse people?

He promised it during the last campaign.

[Napoleon]

Did Nix come out in support or does my new avatar confuse people?

He promised it during the last campaign.

ah...well I mean it when I say it! I will explain to everyone why over the next couple weeks.

[PJ]

Did Nix come out in support or does my new avatar confuse people?

He promised it during the last campaign.

ah...well I mean it when I say it! I will explain to everyone why over the next couple weeks.

I was referring to Nix in the last campaign.

[TNF]

Totally supportive

[ZuWo]

No. The constitution we have is fine and can always be amended if necessary.

Also, the ideas that are being discussed, most notably the proposal to abolish the regional governments and establish a bicameral legislature, have major drawbacks. Our current system guarantees diversity since each Atlasian region has a unique history and political culture. With the proposed changes we would force everyone who wants to go anywhere in this game to run for a federal office, while the system we have now offers every player a choice; I can decide on my own whether I want to be active on the regional or the federal level. Believe it or not, there are people who are not interested in holding a federal office!

I can assure you, abolishing the regional governments will kill the fun for many.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

The fundamentals of our constitution are fine. And that's all a constitution is supposed to be: the fundamentals of Atlasian law. What would be worth changing? It's all there. If something comes up, we can amend it. I fail to see why the constitution is suddenly our most pressing issue. Changing the constitution will not get more people to play the game. It'll create superfluous work that only a couple people will carry out, just because of the nature of the task at hand. Everyone will sign on because it's just such a huge document to deal with, and, in the end, we'll just be back at square one with a document that now has new flaws.

I have a feeling the only reason Nix first introduced the idea was because Marokai last won on a wave of "game reform." Nix has been okay, but his strengths are elsewhere. Game reform is just a couple buzzwords that people like the sound of. I'm not keen to replace the constitution just because it sounds like the thing to do.

[DemPGH]

Edit: I'm not against it, I'm just skeptical that it's practical. I expect people to show up with a litany of demands that must be met, and back down that road we go. But I'm not against it - after all, the only way you're going to hit the ol' knuckleball is by swinging at it, so swing away.

I see the current Constitution as only needing to have its clutter reduced. Like, we had an amendment with the full process to correct typos in a previous amendment. Really. But if people are willing to work together on this rather than just show up with demands, I'm all for it.

Related, if we're to contract regions, I prefer to reduce regions to four or three, but am torn on the realignment that would follow. I want the smaller regions to maintain their identities. I'm also curious to hear more about what Napoleon has proposed.

[Fritz]

And why is this being called for?  I'm not necessarily opposed to the idea, but I would like to know the reasons for this, and what is hoped to be accomplished.

[Supersonic]

No, as there's no major pressing reason to hold on.

Although I'm open to the idea if there is a reason.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

And why is this being called for?  I'm not necessarily opposed to the idea, but I would like to know the reasons for this, and what is hoped to be accomplished.

A good point. Nix mentioned that the previous convention, "The previous convention failed to achieve much substantive change beyond improving the structure of the document.", but that statement fails to acknowledge that the intent of that convention was limited thusly at the start by Purple State and company.

I wouldn't call the last successful conventione (in that it composed and got ratified its product along the lines of those who called for it) a failure, considering that it achieved the purpose of those who pushed for it. On the other hand the year before that was a miserable failure that didn't even produce a final product at all. That convention didn't have a clear set of parameters or purpose and thus began to split all across the board on a variety of subjects before collapsing (not to disimilar from the education bill for a more recent example of a similar result).

If history is any guide, leaving what is desired up in the air/tbd, isn't a good path to success for these.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Also, I have tried three times and cannot get the petition thread to open.

[Marokai Backbeat]

Like Yankee said, I think it would be better to have a clear idea of what we need to accomplish before a ConCon is opened. If history is any guide, the steam behind big reform efforts like that tends to trail off fairly quickly, and failing to have a specific goal in mind beforehand would lead to a 2009 ConCon situation of everyone ing over various ideas that didn't have a chance in hell of passing and ultimately getting nowhere because it got too big for people to pay close attention to.

I'm not inherently opposed, though. I'm just not sure a ConCon for a ConCon's sake is going to help anyone. There's also the matter of how it would be structured, etc.

[tmthforu94]

If there is a real interest from folks to bring some pretty big changes to the game, then yes, I would like to see one occur.

[HagridOfTheDeep]

And what time of big changes could we pass that wouldn't completely change what it is to be an active member if Atlasia.

Half the people who've signed on have done it with the sole intention of eliminating the regions and strengthening the Labor Party position. The other half has done it with individual, nobler intentions but ultimately are letting themselves be used by the anti-regionalists.

[Associate Justice PiT]

     I'm opposed to a Constitutional Convention. Seems like a waste of time more than anything.

[Goldwater]

I am not opposed to a Constitutional Convention per se, but I don't like any of the changes that the people pushing for one have proposed.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

And what time of big changes could we pass that wouldn't completely change what it is to be an active member if Atlasia.

Half the people who've signed on have done it with the sole intention of eliminating the regions and strengthening the Labor Party position. The other half has done it with individual, nobler intentions but ultimately are letting themselves be used by the anti-regionalists.

Restructuring the federal government is a higher priority for me than any changes to the regions that have been proposed (other than reducing their number). I think that the Senate, the Presidency, and the Court should each be re-thought completely. I've already outlined some of my ideas (e.g. switching to a semi-presidential system in which the President designates Senators to manage Cabinet portfolios), and I'll speak about others in the near future (e.g. shorter terms for Senators, a lower house with limited powers composed of members from each of the regional assemblies).

I am sorry Nix, but the first of those just strikes me as Penn Central all over. We have struggled to keep the cabinet positions filled with active people and the Senate with enough people to get the job done. We saw what happened with the committees drawing twelve people from just six or seven Senators and if we weigh the top five or six active Senators down, it won't end well. The only difference is this time the stakes are higher.

[Napoleon]

Its a great idea Yankee just get rid of the stupid sim crap and let the Cabinet roles replace the idea behind committees.

[Sopranos Republican]

I, like many, wonder what the merit of a Constitutional Convention would be at this juncture. So undecided...

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Its a great idea Yankee just get rid of the stupid sim crap and let the Cabinet roles replace the idea behind committees.

What do you mean by "stupid sim crap"?