Which individual is responsible for more death and suffering?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

A:


B:

[Incipimus iterum]

A

[Oswald Acted Alone, You Kook]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[H. Ross Peron]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[Lambsbread]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[Sol]

It's kind of difficult to say- anyone in the past is generally more responsible for more suffering. So I say Columbus, although they probably were about equal in awfulness and evil.

[GMantis]

Columbus had the higher death toll, but it could be argued that he wasn't in control of Hispaniola most of the time. Also, Pol Pot achieved his death toll in a much shorter period. So A.

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

Meaningless. Not all the victims in Cambodia were executed, either.

Edit: If you mean that Columbus should also be blamed for what happened due to him discovering America, the answer is also no. One can't be held responsible for unforeseen effects of one's actions.

[Redalgo]

A, overwhelmingly.

[MATTROSE94]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[opebo]

B, overwhelmingly.  What A did was mostly just revenge anyway.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

[Link]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

I have to go with this.  People back then were generally awful.  If it wasn't Columbus it would have been some other prick.

The beatification of Chris is way over done but to claim he was any worse than the rest of his blood thirsty brethren is a bit much.

[opebo]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

Same thing with revolutions, n'est-ce pas?  The people would have wanted to kill off all their betters eventually, regardless of who lead them.

I don't think the question implies that Columbus directly caused the genocide.  The point is that Europeans, European culture, and so forth were far worse than anything moderns like to critique.

[dead0man]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

This.

[ElectionsGuy]

Definitely A.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

A

[Goldwater]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

This.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Direct or Indirect?

A for Direct, B for Indirect.

[AlternateSteve90]

Columbus.....was far from perfect. But Mao? Goddamn, Mao was, IMO, worse by a factor of a hundred, at least: the vast criminal incompetence of the Great Leap Forward, the silencing and vicious maltreatment and quite often MURDER of dissidents, etc......as many as 30-40 million deaths can be attributed, directly or indirectly to Mao's regime.

[Sol]

Columbus.....was far from perfect. But Mao? Goddamn, Mao was, IMO, worse by a factor of a hundred, at least: the vast criminal incompetence of the Great Leap Forward, the silencing and vicious maltreatment and quite often MURDER of dissidents, etc......as many as 30-40 million deaths can be attributed, directly or indirectly to Mao's regime.

That's not actually Mao.

[H. Ross Peron]

Columbus.....was far from perfect. But Mao? Goddamn, Mao was, IMO, worse by a factor of a hundred, at least: the vast criminal incompetence of the Great Leap Forward, the silencing and vicious maltreatment and quite often MURDER of dissidents, etc......as many as 30-40 million deaths can be attributed, directly or indirectly to Mao's regime.

Its Pol Pot.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

This.

That's not what I'm blaming him for. I am blaming him for his tenure as Governor of Hispanola which was comparable to the Khmer Rouge and its death camps. Actually the closest historical equivalent was Leopold II's rule of the Congo.

[dead0man]

A.

Sooner or later Europeans were going to discover the Americas and exploit them.  At most Columbus caused it all to happen a couple of decades early.  So blaming him personally for deaths he or his men weren't directly responsible for is ludicrous.

This.

That's not what I'm blaming him for. I am blaming him for his tenure as Governor of Hispanola which was comparable to the Khmer Rouge and its death camps. Actually the closest historical equivalent was Leopold II's rule of the Congo.

Sure, I blame him for that too, certainly not for "spreading disease" as that was sadly inevitable.  Using wiki it tells me that because of their actions they both were involved in 3millionish murders.  Pol Pot did it in a much more enlightened time, so I blame him more.  They were both monsters of course, on a scale only bettered by Stalin, Hitler and Mao.