@dead0man:
1. The lack of a basic income or comprehensive, universalistic welfare regime requiring a very significant amount of tax implies a livable income is a privilege each individual must successfully seek out and compete for, or otherwise do without - not a right each person has regardless of their diverse abilities or productive outputs. The economic primacy of property rights for classical liberals does not allow for such redistributive "theft" or "confiscation" from the individual.
I'm not 100% sure what you're going on about here, but I'll admit we/they are going to have to change this kind of attitude over the next half century or so.
Yeah, and like I said, most libertarians aren't against public schools, I'm certainly not.
Right, this isn't (just) a libertarian issue.
You're going to need to use smaller words for me
Yes, and they should. You can't dump your extra mercury into the stream that runs through your property, it negatively affects your neighbor when that stream runs into his property. You can't pump arsenic into the air, it hurts everybody. You can't hurt people without cause is a staple for all libertarians. Yeah, some forget this for their own reasons, but certainly not all.
Isn't that how it is now?
Again, not all libertarians hate the environment.
libertarians don't have to be at loggerheads with unions. I'm not anti-union. Sure, I don't like what they do 90% of the time, but I certainly think they should exist, especially in skill based trades, much less so in the unskilled trades.
Right, this isn't (just) a libertarian issue.
Fair point and one I think that will become a bigger issue in the future as we need fewer and fewer workers.
yeah, that's how it is now and libertians had zilch to do with it.
Having a job isn't a right nor should it be.
Yep and funk 'em. Did you see The Daily Show piece the other day where two actors playing gay dudes got engaged in a Waffle House in MS and then AL? Everybody clapped. I don't think the US is as racist/bigoted as some on your side of the aisle would like to believe. Will some businesses exist in some hypothetical place where you can bar black dudes? Sure. Will they thrive, funk no. Will people that go/work there be shamed, yeah, probably. Even in the deep south.
I don't like the term libertarian much myself...for one, it's too long and threads like these are challenging enough, add in typing that word over and over again and it just becomes brutal
. But it's all the baggage and stereotypes that follow the word that really get in my craw. It's wrong to stereotype, everybody says that all the time, but when it comes to libertarians the left assumes everyone is exactly like the worst possible one. It stifles debate. I've mentioned it, nobody cares. They just keep on using the same giant brush. (not saying you are)
certainly not
probably not
I don't even know what that is.
probably
thank you and thank you for the calm debate on the subjects. I'm not the best at this, I think PiT and Dibble do a much better job representing "my side" than I do, but they don't post enough. I'm probably too aggressive and too quick to mock, but it's hard not to when what you usually get from the other side is "lol get back in the basement libertarian" as debate.
(and that's the first post I've ever tried to post that reached the character limit...I blame you
)
