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Author Topic: Cold Climates  (Read 12035 times)
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« on: December 12, 2003, 08:37:31 am »
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I have a theory that the colder the place, the more liberal & benign the people, and it seems to hold true! Canada, Norway, Iceland, Sweden & Finland are all very cold, all very liberal. As opposed to places like Saudi Arabia, Iran and Pakistan which are stinking hot and very unliberal. It holds true for the US and UK. The South East of the UK is the warmest part and the most heavily Tory, whereas Scotland is the coldest part and the most liberal. In the US, the North East/Great Lakes are liberal, whereas the South is not. Anyone hazard a guess as to why? I think it may be because in cold countries people traditionally depend more upon the state and eachother to survive the winters. People simply have to get on when faced with freezing climates.
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I live in the UK and regard myself as a socially liberal, economic centrist. I vote for the British Labour party and support the Canadian NDP and US Democratic parties.


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« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2003, 08:38:58 am »
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I have to admit though that this argument falls to pieces in the case of Russia, however that's only because it was ruled by Communist tyrants for years!
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I live in the UK and regard myself as a socially liberal, economic centrist. I vote for the British Labour party and support the Canadian NDP and US Democratic parties.


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« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2003, 09:38:18 am »
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Hmm, interesting theory, and you are right that it does seem to hold true. I really can't hazard a guess as to why it would be true though.
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Michael Z
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« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2003, 10:35:17 am »
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Not quite. Tuscany in Italy is one of the hottest places in Europe. It is also the hotbed of Italian communism.

The further you go south in Germany, the colder and more conservative it gets. Hamburg, the farthest city up north is recknowned for its liberalism wheras Bavaria, especially the southern part, makes Texas look like San Francisco. (Bavaria, after all, is the place that gave birth to Nazism.)

Similarly in France, the further you go south the warmer and more socialist it gets (with the exception of Marseille, a city infamous for its association with Le Pen's Front Nacionale).
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« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2003, 10:46:29 am »
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Ah touche'! Emilia Romagna and Tuscany have the coldest winters in Italy, apart from the Alps. I went to Bologna in January and it was @*&%ing freezing! :-) You're right, they're very left-wing, which is also odd as they're also very rich.
Sicily & Campania are the most conservative bits and also the warmest!
Also I thought Britanny and Normandie were the bastions of the left in France? Certainly Toulon in the far south is ruled by the FN (Le Penn).
As for Germany, I wouldn't say Bavaria was as conservative as Texas. It's more conservative than Hamburg, but then that's not saying much! So is 99% of the world! Also the Bavarian Alps are cold, but Berlin is the coldest part, that and the Nth Est.
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« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2003, 11:20:30 am »
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France is more than a little complicated.

Nord-Pas-de-Calais is also left wing(especially Pas-de-Calais) :
Number of seats:

Nord(24)

PS      11
UMP   09
PCF    02
UDF    01
D Ind  01
Ind     01
Total Left: 13
Total Right: 11
Other: 01

Pas-de-Calais(14)

PS      10
UMP    02
PRG    01
G-Ind  01
Total Left:   12
Total Right: 02
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« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2003, 11:28:28 am »
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Pas-de-Calais is on the old Franco-Belgian coalfield.
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Michael Z
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« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2003, 11:28:50 am »
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Ah touche'! Emilia Romagna and Tuscany have the coldest winters in Italy, apart from the Alps. I went to Bologna in January and it was @*&%ing freezing! :-) You're right, they're very left-wing, which is also odd as they're also very rich.
Sicily & Campania are the most conservative bits and also the warmest!

I went to Tuscany in August and it was boiling. The strangest thing is as you drive in from the Alps, where the temperature was roughly 15 degrees Celcius, you're an hour into Italy and once you reach Modena the heat really hits you. I went from 15 to 35 degrees in roughly sixty minutes and I was shaking from the sudden temperature change.

Wonderful place though. You can't beat Italy for sheer natural beauty.
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« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2003, 11:54:27 am »
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Current Party control of regional governments(new elections 2004) :

UMP: Alsace, Auvergne, Basse-Normandie, Bourgogne, Bretagne, Champagne-Ardenne, Corse, Franche-Comte, Languedoc-Roussillon, Lorraine, Pays de la Loire, Picardie, Poitou-Charentes
PS: Aquitaine, Centre, Haute-Normandie, Ile-de-France, Limousin, Midi-Pyrenees, Nord-Pas-de-Calais, Provence-Alpes-Cote d'Azur
UDF: Rhone-Alpes

The UMP is expected to suffer heavy losses, forcing Rafferin's resignation(at least, that's what the Independent's excellent French correspondent thinks)
The FN is thought to have a good chance at picking up Provence-Alpes-Cote d'Azur.
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« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2003, 12:42:13 pm »
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Bavaria is VERY right wing.
The CSU was recently re-elected with over 60% of the vote, it gave birth to the NSDAP and people in the rest of Germany think that Bavarians are a pack of beer swilling, arrogant, racist, rednecks.
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« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2003, 05:16:03 pm »
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Interesting theory but not conclusive Smiley as Fresh mentioned the mountain west in the US is very conservative. Much more so than the upper midwest states of Minnesota and Michigan (similar latitude) are liberal.

In India I wouldnt be able to identify this trend. Generally I would say it doesnt apply. Some very warm southern states are quite liberal and socialist while many of the large northen states are at least very socially conservative. I dont think ANY Indian state is economically conservative in the US definition of the term Sad Sad
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« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2003, 07:57:24 pm »
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I like your theory. It seems to be accurate with most things. However, you have the EXACT opposite with the states of Hawaii and Alaska. According to your theory, Alaska should be liberal, but no, they traditionally vote Republican. Also, Hawaii should be Republican, but as we all know Hawaii usually swings more left.

I have a theory of my own, that people who live on the coast, or near large bodies of water are very liberal. But I'm sure you can all point out instances where my theory does not hold to truth as well.
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« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2003, 08:08:52 pm »
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the NE Coastal states are the hottest places b/c of humidity in the summer, same holds with Cali, Oregon and Washington.  And here in Idaho, it gets FREEZING!! cold.  

I beg to differ. During all my vacations out west, it is very cool in the summer in Washington and Oregon. NEAR THE COAST of course. I know that the eastern part of both Washington and Oregon tend to be a little dry and hot, due to the mountains near the coast that block air from the Pacific Ocean. But when I'm in WESTERN Washington or Oregon, the humidity may be a bit high, but the temperatures are very nice around 60 to 70 degrees  F.  To me, that is a fine temperature, because in the Midwest temperatures range from 80 to 100 degrees F, and the humidity is HORRIBLE. And of course the Midwest winters can be just as extreme, ranging from -10 to 20 degrees F. I know places are colder, but still.

I won't argue with you that Idaho is freezing cold. Wink

I feel like the damn weather man now.

We are going to have a cold front come in from the west out of this general region, having dropped down from Canada, and we are expecting snow here anywhere from 5 to 7 inches tomorrow night, so make sure you wear your coat! Back to you Tom.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2003, 04:10:09 am by Demrepdan »Logged

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« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2003, 12:10:40 am »
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It was 5 (F) below zero this morning in MN and I don't feel any more liberal.  Maybe there was a tendency for left-leaning northern europeans to settle in similar climates when they migrated to other countries?  
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« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2003, 03:58:47 am »
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I have a theory of my own, that people who live on the coast, or near large bodies of water are very liberal. But I'm sure you can all point out instances where my theory does not hold to truth as well.

But of course Wink
In the U.K, most of the South East is coastal(and right wing), while South Yorkshire is landlocked(and very left wing)

Also in the Carolina's, the coastal parts of both states seem to lean more GOP than much of the interior(although that could just be the gerrymandering)

In Poland, the industrial areas on the southern border are far more left wing than the coastal areas.
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« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2003, 04:00:40 am »
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My theory is that areas where mining happens/used to happen are almost always to the left of areas with no history of mining.

But that's kind of obvious Smiley
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« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2003, 07:19:58 am »
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I have a theory of my own, that people who live on the coast, or near large bodies of water are very liberal. But I'm sure you can all point out instances where my theory does not hold to truth as well.

Large cities are almost always found near the coast or larger rivers, those large cities tend to have higher concentrations of African-American voters who vote overwhelmingly Democratic.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2003, 09:01:07 am by htmldon »Logged
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« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2003, 08:52:38 am »
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I went to Tuscany in August and it was boiling. The strangest thing is as you drive in from the Alps, where the temperature was roughly 15 degrees Celcius, you're an hour into Italy and once you reach Modena the heat really hits you. I went from 15 to 35 degrees in roughly sixty minutes and I was shaking from the sudden temperature change.

Wonderful place though. You can't beat Italy for sheer natural beauty.

Italy is incredible! Florence, Bologna, Venice and Rome are my favourites! Actually Milan is the only place in Italy I didn't endear to. Emilia Romagna is very hot in summer, about 36C, however the winters are bitterly cold 3C, so it sort of fits in with my theory! :-)
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I live in the UK and regard myself as a socially liberal, economic centrist. I vote for the British Labour party and support the Canadian NDP and US Democratic parties.


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« Reply #18 on: December 13, 2003, 10:44:34 am »
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I have a theory of my own, that people who live on the coast, or near large bodies of water are very liberal. But I'm sure you can all point out instances where my theory does not hold to truth as well.

Large cities are almost always found near the coast or larger rivers, those large cities tend to have higher concentrations of African-American voters who vote overwhelmingly Democratic.

In the U.K most large cities are near coal/mineral deposits, often quite away from the coast(though often a few miles upstream), and usually on relatively high ground.
And usually in a defensive position, but that's for another reason...
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« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2003, 05:03:26 pm »
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I know this is way off topic, but I notice that Realpolitik recently got 500 posts, thus giving him a new status at the forums. He went from Full Member, Jr. Member, Sr. Member, to YaBB God???

LOL. What the hell? What comes next?
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« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2003, 09:07:29 am »
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I know this is way off topic, but I notice that Realpolitik recently got 500 posts, thus giving him a new status at the forums. He went from Full Member, Jr. Member, Sr. Member, to YaBB God???

LOL. What the hell? What comes next?

LOL its a source of great confort to me. Every time I wonder if I'm spending too much time posting on this site.....I think of Al Grin
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« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2003, 09:18:05 am »
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Okay while we are pushing theories here are a couple

The more urban an area, the more liberal. (This actually works in the US but is not applicable in most other places-then again the US definition of liberalism/conservatism that I'm using is not applicable in most places)

Let me know major exceptions in the US.
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« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2003, 09:20:52 am »
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Another one is religiousity or strength of religious belief. Its not a widely applicable rule. African Americans are exceptions to this rule but then they would be exceptions to almost every rule, voting democrat no matter who they are or what they do Sad
Otherwise its one of the best indicators of voting behaviour in the US>

Okay while we are pushing theories here are a couple

The more urban an area, the more liberal. (This actually works in the US but is not applicable in most other places-then again the US definition of liberalism/conservatism that I'm using is not applicable in most places)

Let me know major exceptions in the US.
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« Reply #23 on: December 15, 2003, 12:12:44 pm »
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In the U.K it's often the case that the most and least religious people tend to vote Labour(75-80% of Sikhs for example and 60+ for Methodists)
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« Reply #24 on: December 15, 2003, 12:13:07 pm »
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Let me know major exceptions in the US.

Suburbs are usually worse than rural areas (especially on economic issues).
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Try this wonderful POPULIST BLOG...

http://onlinelunchpail.blogspot.com
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