The Sage Garden

[tik 🪀✨]

King's deconstruction of that made me laugh.

[All Along The Watchtower]

The US and American posters ought to stop speaking from a moral high ground given our aggressive post-Cold War wars against Panama, Iraq, Sudan, etc.

[IceSpear]

The US and American posters ought to stop speaking from a moral high ground given our aggressive post-Cold War wars against Panama, Iraq, Sudan, etc.

Edit: Oops, beat me to it.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

It's amazing how many logical fallacies are at use in such a short post.

[Oakvale]

I think that was actually failed sage since Snowstalker inexplicably excluded the evil neoliberal crusade against Milosevic from that list.

[RogueBeaver]

Basically everything Snow's written in the Ukraine thread.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Want to get China on our side? Promise them all of Siberia if they would side with us against Russia if it were to actually come to anything. If it was the US/Europe/China/Japan agianst Russia they would probably be more likely to back down.

This isn't the 18th century; military conquest isn't actually a legitimate diplomatic instrument anymore.

Tell that to Putin.

Or Obama, or Bush, Clinton, etc.

[Paul Kemp]

Emphasis on sage my own:

Yes because of the rise of neoliberalism, the power of the corporatist oligarchy, the dismantling of the New Deal-Great Society consensus etc. etc.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

[Oakvale]

The Sage of Lancaster goes full Paultard:

Though it is amusing that Obama is more concerned about the Ukrainian constitution than America's.

[Paul Kemp]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

Those terms are sage red-flags and have been since the infancy of adopting the word. It makes no difference whether it makes sense or not...

[Antonio the Sixth]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

Those terms are sage red-flags and have been since the infancy of adopting the word. It makes no difference whether it makes sense or not...

I don't think any term is inherently sage, unless it's really some pompous and obscure word nobody actually ever uses. The general phrasing and the issue addressed should be taken into account.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

Those terms are sage red-flags and have been since the infancy of adopting the word. It makes no difference whether it makes sense or not...

I don't think any term is inherently sage, unless it's really some pompous and obscure word nobody actually ever uses. The general phrasing and the issue addressed should be taken into account.

The mere phrase "Neo-Liberalism" sends off alerts on the 12 Sage-detecting servers across the globe.

[Paul Kemp]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

Those terms are sage red-flags and have been since the infancy of adopting the word. It makes no difference whether it makes sense or not...

I don't think any term is inherently sage, unless it's really some pompous and obscure word nobody actually ever uses. The general phrasing and the issue addressed should be taken into account.

Actual humans don't sincerely use the terms "neoliberalism" and "corporatist oligarchy" unless trying to appear wise or philosophical therefore sage by definition. Agreeing with it doesn't make it any less so. Hell, I somewhat agree with the post itself.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Nah, this one isn't sage. These terms actually make perfect sense in context.

Those terms are sage red-flags and have been since the infancy of adopting the word. It makes no difference whether it makes sense or not...

I don't think any term is inherently sage, unless it's really some pompous and obscure word nobody actually ever uses. The general phrasing and the issue addressed should be taken into account.

Actual humans don't sincerely use the terms "neoliberalism" and "corporatist oligarchy" unless trying to appear wise or philosophical therefore sage by definition. Agreeing with it doesn't make it any less so. Hell, I somewhat agree with the post itself.

Sorry, but no. Neoliberalism is a widely acknowledged ideology, which it makes perfect sense to talk about and actually can hardly not be mentioned when discussing certain topics. If using the word "neoliberalism" is sage, then it's the word sage that is completely meaningless.

I sort of understand the issue with "corporatist oligarchy", and I'd also probably have used a different term, but I don't think that's enough to make this post belong in here.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Of course, it's very easy to use the term neoliberal in a sage way (since Snowstalker does it all the time). But that doesn't make the term itself sage.

[Paul Kemp]

If using the word "neoliberalism" is sage, then it's the word sage that is completely meaningless.

Well yes but only because some here have some bastardized idea of what the silly term is. There's a reason why "neoliberalism" was on the banned words list on IRC (which obviously existed for purely humorous reasons). It actually was one of the first terms to be dubbed "sage" back when the whole "Snowstalker being sage" thing started.

I'm not sure why you're being so sensitive about this. It's not some damning indictment. It's just a bit of fun, which is what using the term "sage" really is.

[Antonio the Sixth]

I just think there's little point in using a word if it encompasses Snowstalker's worst rants alongside with posts that are relevant, factually correct and not pompous. This focus on a word as being "sage" is pretty misleading IMO. If I get it right, the word neoliberalism was banned from IRC because of Snowstalker's abuse of it, not because it was a word that should never be used - indeed, the words "socialism" and "fascism" were banned too, does that mean anyone who every uses them is being sage?

[Paul Kemp]

I just think there's little point in using a word if it encompasses Snowstalker's worst rants alongside with posts that are relevant, factually correct and not pompous. This focus on a word as being "sage" is pretty misleading IMO. If I get it right, the word neoliberalism was banned from IRC because of Snowstalker's abuse of it, not because it was a word that should never be used - indeed, the words "socialism" and "fascism" were banned too, does that mean anyone who every uses them is being sage?

I think the issue here is you're trying to put some serious substance to a term that was pretty much coined as something that's just "taking a piss" as some of our friends would say. You're putting too much thought into it.

By the way in which we (maybe not you) use the term, stating that America is in decline because of "neoliberalism" and a "corporatist oligarchy" IS "sage", even if you agree with it and find it valid (which, as I've already stated, I mostly do). There's a definite element of attempting to convey a sort of profundity and wisdom when it could've come been put into terms that were more common-sense and doesn't come off so much as a "look how many important articles I read" statement. You're more than welcome to disagree with it but it's pretty much the definition as far as I'm concerned.

Don't be upset; we've all been offenders of a little sage abuse every now and then.

[Oakvale]

Guys, guys. Remember the important principle of this thread - sage is not defined by whether a statement is arguably true, but by the size of said Truth.

(Kemp's explanation is also correct)

[Antonio the Sixth]

I've always assumed "sage" was used to describe a writing style that associated ridiculously overblown pseudo-intellectual affectations with a vacuity of actual substance, not (as I guess you mean it) the use of hyperboles and/or of too serious-sounding words. But anyway, you guys coined the term so you get the final say.

[CatoMinor]

The West and Russia both seem to support self-determination when it's convenient and oppose it when it isn't.

[Napoleon]

I just think there's little point in using a word if it encompasses Snowstalker's worst rants alongside with posts that are relevant, factually correct and not pompous. This focus on a word as being "sage" is pretty misleading IMO. If I get it right, the word neoliberalism was banned from IRC because of Snowstalker's abuse of it, not because it was a word that should never be used - indeed, the words "socialism" and "fascism" were banned too, does that mean anyone who every uses them is being sage?

Lol wow, they ban words now?

[Potatoe]

I just think there's little point in using a word if it encompasses Snowstalker's worst rants alongside with posts that are relevant, factually correct and not pompous. This focus on a word as being "sage" is pretty misleading IMO. If I get it right, the word neoliberalism was banned from IRC because of Snowstalker's abuse of it, not because it was a word that should never be used - indeed, the words "socialism" and "fascism" were banned too, does that mean anyone who every uses them is being sage?

Lol wow, they ban words now?

Well Snowstalker is staunchly in favour of Socialism

Does it appear?

EDIT:Yeah, it appears.

[Paul Kemp]

I just think there's little point in using a word if it encompasses Snowstalker's worst rants alongside with posts that are relevant, factually correct and not pompous. This focus on a word as being "sage" is pretty misleading IMO. If I get it right, the word neoliberalism was banned from IRC because of Snowstalker's abuse of it, not because it was a word that should never be used - indeed, the words "socialism" and "fascism" were banned too, does that mean anyone who every uses them is being sage?

Lol wow, they ban words now?

No words are banned. Some were at one point for a gag.