Gay marriage Ban Struck Down in Utah.
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  Gay marriage Ban Struck Down in Utah.
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Author Topic: Gay marriage Ban Struck Down in Utah.  (Read 14667 times)
TheDeadFlagBlues
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« Reply #50 on: December 20, 2013, 07:54:43 PM »

Mary Landrieu better start praying frantically that this same thing doesn't happen in Louisiana.

Why do you care so much about an election in a country where you aren't a citizen?
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Landslide Lyndon
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« Reply #51 on: December 20, 2013, 07:55:57 PM »

Has anyone checked on JCL? The poor guy must be experiencing a world of pain.
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anvi
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« Reply #52 on: December 20, 2013, 07:56:43 PM »

Ok, then; so much for what some dude who stars on a tv show says in a magazine interview. 
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Deus Naturae
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« Reply #53 on: December 20, 2013, 08:05:23 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?
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Bandit3 the Worker
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« Reply #54 on: December 20, 2013, 08:06:36 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

Now that some folks in Utah have actually gotten married today following this ruling, it can't be.
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World politics is up Schmitt creek
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« Reply #55 on: December 20, 2013, 08:08:27 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

It goes to the Ninth Circuit and then the post-Windsor Supreme Court, so probably not, really. Even a stay is going to be hard to pull off since it went into effect immediately.
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Holmes
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« Reply #56 on: December 20, 2013, 08:09:21 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

It goes to the Ninth Circuit and then the post-Windsor Supreme Court, so probably not, really. Even a stay is going to be hard to pull off since it went into effect immediately.

Tenth Circuit.
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Consciously Unconscious
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« Reply #57 on: December 20, 2013, 08:19:44 PM »

What's next, West Virginia?  All I can say is wow!  I never would have seen this coming.  SSM could be legal in all states by 2014 if the SCOTUS makes a ruling. 
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they don't love you like i love you
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« Reply #58 on: December 20, 2013, 08:22:16 PM »

The best part of this is the hifly freakout.

Won't matter to Utah Senate Democrats anyway because they're all in liberal SLC districts.
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World politics is up Schmitt creek
Nathan
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« Reply #59 on: December 20, 2013, 08:24:25 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

It goes to the Ninth Circuit and then the post-Windsor Supreme Court, so probably not, really. Even a stay is going to be hard to pull off since it went into effect immediately.

Tenth Circuit.

Oh. Never mind, then. I was getting Utah's and Montana's Circuits mixed up.
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The world will shine with light in our nightmare
Just Passion Through
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« Reply #60 on: December 20, 2013, 08:25:10 PM »

Mary Landrieu better start praying frantically that this same thing doesn't happen in Louisiana.

Yeah, I can hear the voters now.

"Hey, did you hear about that unelected judge who overturned our gay marriage ban yesterday?"
"Yeah, that's what happens when you got a woman in the Senate and a n***** in the White House!  Cassidy 2014!"
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Sol
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« Reply #61 on: December 20, 2013, 08:29:14 PM »

Mary Landrieu better start praying frantically that this same thing doesn't happen in Louisiana.
If I had to choose, I would pick nationwide SSM and non-discrimination laws over a Democratic senate majority (provided the newly empowered Pubbies wouldn't reverse those, mind).
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Zioneer
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« Reply #62 on: December 20, 2013, 08:42:35 PM »

The best part of this is the hifly freakout.

Won't matter to Utah Senate Democrats anyway because they're all in liberal SLC districts.

Well, not all of them, but yeah, most are. While I'm glad for the ruling, this is going to be painful...

Also, LGBT Utahns are getting marriage licenses before Illinois's law takes effect next year. Suck it, Illinois.
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Sol
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« Reply #63 on: December 20, 2013, 08:44:39 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

It goes to the Ninth Circuit and then the post-Windsor Supreme Court, so probably not, really. Even a stay is going to be hard to pull off since it went into effect immediately.

Tenth Circuit.
Is the 10th circuit particularly conservative?
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RedSLC
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« Reply #64 on: December 20, 2013, 08:49:23 PM »

Between this and the program to end homelessness, who would have thought that Utah would have two awesome political developments this week?Smiley

As for hurting the Utah dems, even the ones not representing parts of SLC probably won't have too much to worry about - all of them represent part of Salt Lake County, which is one of the most "moderate" counties on the issue (when the ban was first passed in 2004, it did vote in favor, but was one of the amendment's worst counties (Passed with 54 percent of the vote, whereas in the Presidential election at the same time, Bush got 59 percent of the vote). That, and the ones outside SLC represent parts of the inner-ring suburbs, which are more "moderate" (the outer ring suburbs, on the other hand...)
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IceSpear
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« Reply #65 on: December 20, 2013, 08:56:22 PM »

It can't hurt Dems in Utah since there are no Dems in Utah.
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PJ
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« Reply #66 on: December 20, 2013, 08:58:56 PM »

Between this and the program to end homelessness, who would have thought that Utah would have two awesome political developments this week?Smiley

As for hurting the Utah dems, even the ones not representing parts of SLC probably won't have too much to worry about - all of them represent part of Salt Lake County, which is one of the most "moderate" counties on the issue (when the ban was first passed in 2004, it did vote in favor, but was one of the amendment's worst counties (Passed with 54 percent of the vote, whereas in the Presidential election at the same time, Bush got 59 percent of the vote). That, and the ones outside SLC represent parts of the inner-ring suburbs, which are more "moderate" (the outer ring suburbs, on the other hand...)
Your state also struck down the cohabitation ban. Awesome week for Utah!
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RedSLC
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« Reply #67 on: December 20, 2013, 09:05:13 PM »

Between this and the program to end homelessness, who would have thought that Utah would have two awesome political developments this week?Smiley

As for hurting the Utah dems, even the ones not representing parts of SLC probably won't have too much to worry about - all of them represent part of Salt Lake County, which is one of the most "moderate" counties on the issue (when the ban was first passed in 2004, it did vote in favor, but was one of the amendment's worst counties (Passed with 54 percent of the vote, whereas in the Presidential election at the same time, Bush got 59 percent of the vote). That, and the ones outside SLC represent parts of the inner-ring suburbs, which are more "moderate" (the outer ring suburbs, on the other hand...)
Your state also struck down the cohabitation ban. Awesome week for Utah!

Forgot about that.

Anyway, living in Utah just got way more awesome. Cool
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RosettaStoned
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« Reply #68 on: December 20, 2013, 09:17:04 PM »

 The Government should not be involved in marriage.
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Badger
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« Reply #69 on: December 20, 2013, 09:23:44 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

Now that some folks in Utah have actually gotten married today following this ruling, it can't be.

What? Where do you get this stuff? Of course It doesn't mean that.


I think gay marriage supporters are a bit too sanguine about this law's prospects in the SCOTUS.
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Zioneer
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« Reply #70 on: December 20, 2013, 09:29:45 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

Now that some folks in Utah have actually gotten married today following this ruling, it can't be.

What? Where do you get this stuff? Of course It doesn't mean that.


I think gay marriage supporters are a bit too sanguine about this law's prospects in the SCOTUS.

The judge that struck down the law literally used the same arguments the Supreme Court used last year. I don't think they'll contradict themselves.
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angus
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« Reply #71 on: December 20, 2013, 09:41:01 PM »

The Government should not be involved in marriage.

Of course the government should not be involved in many things:  Airplane tickets, medical services, recreational drug sales, marriage, etc.  The government should exist mainly to ensure domestic tranquility and to protect the borders.  Ah, but as a practical matter we should accept the fact that it does involve itself in other matters.  One of those matters is spousal economic benefits.  What about life insurance, medical insurance, dental insurance, social security, and the like?  I don't really care whether Uncle Sam provides his imprimatur upon my Las Vegas marriage to my wife, but my insurance company does.  The chinese say, "If you raise your hands to heaven, you will last a hundred years" but they may not abuse themselves as much as I do.  I'd like to know that there's enough in the bank account to ensure a private university education for my son should I meet my demise before he's ready to take on the world.  In any case, I'd like to know that the amount I set aside for him every month will reach him, whether or not my marriage falls into the bounds of political correctness (which, by the way, it would not have in many states until the very early 21st century.)

I say that so long as the government does involve itself in those matters, then it should recognize all of them.  Gay, straight, interracial, and poly, so long as they're undertaken seriously. 

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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #72 on: December 20, 2013, 10:01:36 PM »

Mary Landrieu better start praying frantically that this same thing doesn't happen in Louisiana.

She be better served in praying that it's a Republican appointed judge that does the striking.  That is far likelier to happen IMO now that we've gotten our first district court ruling.  Also, when it does happen in Louisiana, things may get weird for a bit as Louisiana is split between three different district courts.  For those states that have multiple Federal district courts in them, it's quite possible that they'll end up with their laws banning the recognition of SSM be invalidated in only part of a state.
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bedstuy
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« Reply #73 on: December 20, 2013, 10:08:49 PM »

I hate to ruin the celebration, but won't this ruling almost certainly be overturned?

Now that some folks in Utah have actually gotten married today following this ruling, it can't be.

What? Where do you get this stuff? Of course It doesn't mean that.


I think gay marriage supporters are a bit too sanguine about this law's prospects in the SCOTUS.

I think the case of Prop 8 shows that you can get unmarried by a legal change without complete chaos.  This is probably why the state of Utah didn't get a TRO to stop gay marriages in the state.  There's no irreparable harm to Utah in issuing marriage licenses now, if they can be rescinded later. 

On the SCOTUS question, I think that's a good point.  There are likely 4 votes on the side of marriage equality.  We don't know if Kennedy is going to find some caveat that allows Utah to ban gay marriage.  The hopeful sign to me is that gay marriage opponents have no good arguments that can pass rational basis review and they aren't going to find a novel compelling argument.  Kennedy is going to have to buy into a tenuous argument on the ration basis grounds for discriminating against gays.  Considering his history on this issue, I'm cautiously optimistic.
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
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« Reply #74 on: December 20, 2013, 10:34:26 PM »

At this point, the only hope of SSM opponents is that one of the five justices in the majority on Windsor leaves the Court and either Obama messes up and appoints a SSM opponent or that the GOP retakes the Senate next November and blocks all Obama nominations in hopes of having a Republican win the White House in 2016.  I just see no way that anyone who signed onto Kennedy's opinion in Windsor could uphold the existing SSM bans.  The only reason the court moved slowly was to give the country more time to change its views on its own before the inevitable decision is handed down.  The court does not want SSM to become another issue like abortion where it moved way ahead of public opinion and prevented it from forming on its own.
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