Israel refuses to honor Christian Israelis' beliefs and put tree in Knesset

[Indy Texas]

Israel is refusing to acknowledge the fact that a sizable number of its citizens celebrate Christmas and has denied a request by a Christian member of the Knesset to place a tree in the legislative buiding for the holiday season.

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For some context, roughly 2% of Israelis identify as Christian. Roughly 2% of Americans identify as Jewish. If the United States can bother to erect a giant menorah on the National Mall for Hanukkah, surely the Israeli Knesset can be bothered to stick a tree somewhere for Christmas.

[Donerail]

If Hana Sweid the Christian-Arab MP of Hadash was Hannah Steinberg the (convert) Christian MP of Likud they probably wouldn't refuse to put up the tree...

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I've called this an anti-Christian country many times and it keeps proving that.

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

Ok. Can Boynton City Hall take down the menorah, since Hanukah was a month ago?

[Indy Texas]

Ok. Can Boynton City Hall take down the menorah, since Hanukah was a month ago?

Considering most Goyim simply regard Hanukkah as "Jewish Christmas" it doesn't surprise me when Hanukkah displays remain up until the Christmas stuff is taken down as well.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

At least they aren't jailing and executing Christians like their neighbors (though TBF some of the far-right ultra-Orthodox nutcases wouldn't oppose doing so).

[Indy Texas]

At least they aren't jailing and executing Christians like their neighbors (though TBF some of the far-right ultra-Orthodox nutcases wouldn't oppose doing so).

Every time Israel does something untoward like this, the kneejerk response from some people is, "Well, the other Middle Eastern countries would be doing even worse things if XYZ was happening in their country!" But if we're going to privilege Israel above its neighbors, on the grounds that it is a democracy or more "civilized" or whatever, Israel needs to be held to a higher standard than Syria or Egypt or Saudi Arabia. If they want to continue to be given special treatment by us, they need to conduct themselves in ways that make special treatment deserved.

[Хahar 🤔]

Hannah Steinberg the (convert) Christian MP of Likud

I find it very unlikely that such a person would exist.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Hannah Steinberg the (convert) Christian MP of Likud

I find it very unlikely that such a person would exist.

Yeah, that's basically unfathomable. A good chunk of Likud probably would LITERALLY support killing any Jewish converts to Christianity.

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

But if we're going to privilege Israel above its neighbors, on the grounds that it is a democracy or more "civilized" or whatever, Israel needs to be held to a higher standard than Syria or Egypt or Saudi Arabia.

I don't think Israel should be given "special treatment", and I wouldn't consider myself "pro-Israel", at least in the American sense of the term. But holding them to a higher standard is problematic. Are the leaders of Qatar and Saudi Arabia like animals that just don't know any better? Human rights abuse is human rights abuse whether it's done by Jerusalem or Riyadh or Tehran or Washington. Suggesting that one government should be held to a higher standard for upholding human rights than another is absurd and a deliberate attempt to obfuscate the fact that Israel, for all its problems, has a better human rights situation than any other country in the region.

[Bacon King]

both sides of this argument are terrible

why is this an issue

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

both sides of this argument are terrible

why is this an issue

Because with all the wars in the Middle East, why not fight the War on Christmas there as well?

[danny]

Israel is a Jewish state, that's the basis for its existence, and this isn't something anti-christian in particular. The US has its own laws and ways of doing things that have nothing to do with Israel. Israel doesn't need to change itself just to fit in with the way it is done in the US.

[MaxQue]

Israel is a Jewish state, that's the basis for its existence, and this isn't something anti-christian in particular. The US has its own laws and ways of doing things that have nothing to do with Israel. Israel doesn't need to change itself just to fit in with the way it is done in the US.

Well, don't be surprised if the "Christian" states are stopping to support you, at a point.

[Hnv1]

How ironic is that the person who rejected this request is the religious speaker of the house Edelstein born Christian? heck his father is still an orthodox priest! btw this is not state policy it's more of this speaker's (who by my account is a nut-job) policy.

Now a more formal reply, Israel respects different religious beliefs (well de jure at least) and all Christians have a bank holiday during their holidays and such. I wouldn't compare this to the US as American is a country of more universal political nationality compared to a religious\ethnic\ethnic-religious (depends on who you're asking) nationality state like Israel. Hence within this political framework it is still reasonable to withhold this request. On the personal note I think he's a tool and should have done so (like my home city of Haifa did) on a more human and pluralist notion of his role as speaker of a parliament which represents everyone regardless.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Israel is a Jewish state, that's the basis for its existence, and this isn't something anti-christian in particular. The US has its own laws and ways of doing things that have nothing to do with Israel. Israel doesn't need to change itself just to fit in with the way it is done in the US.

Well, don't be surprised if the "Christian" states are stopping to support you, at a point.

The irony of virtually any "Christian" nation causing trouble for Israel because we're not friendly enough to Christians would be brilliant.

Why do you think the Jews felt they needed a state in the first place?

[Donerail]

Hannah Steinberg the (convert) Christian MP of Likud

I find it very unlikely that such a person would exist.

True - but for the sake of argument, my point is that

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It's more the latter descriptor than the former that's the problem.

[Silent Hunter]

Christmas trees aren't "Christian"... they're a pagan import to the festival and specifically originate in Germany.

Also, Christians have done many a nasty thing to Jews over the years.

[Zanas]

The obvious answer is of course the above poster's. The "Christmas tree" is not even Christian to begin with, and I don't see why there should be one inside a Parliament house, in Israel or the US or Germany or France or whatever. Do what you like at home, at church, not in branches of government. Let's be serious.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

Israel never pledged to abide by US standards of separation of Church and State, and I don't believe that's any sort of human rights issue.

There's near-total free exercise of religion in Israel, but Israel is a Jewish state.

[Indy Texas]

Christmas trees aren't "Christian"... they're a pagan import to the festival and specifically originate in Germany.

Also, Christians have done many a nasty thing to Jews over the years.

Most Christians all over the world use Christmas trees to celebrate Christmas. They may not have originated as a Christian tradition but they are one now.

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners. To this day, Israel expects all Jews all over the world to be loyal to their state, which kind of lends credence to the notion that you can't be truly American/British/French/etc if you're Jewish. The Holocaust was not conducted from a Christian standpoint; you can't blame Christianity for that. Furthermore, I'm pretty sure the Christians who live in Israel had nothing to do with any of the above historical events seeing as those happened in Europe.

[Vosem]

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners.

If you have any free time at some point, I'd encourage you to maybe try and open a book.


As for the thread topic, who gives a fuvk besides people looking for (and not finding) something to criticize about Israel?

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners.

If you have any free time at some point, I'd encourage you to maybe try and open a book.

If you open a book, you will find "Christians" have indeed done nasty things to Jews, but the cause of the discrimination had nothing to do with the European Christians being Christian or the Jews being foreigners. The Holocaust was not a crime done unto Jews by Christians at all, for example.

As for the thread topic, who gives a fuvk besides people looking for (and not finding) something to criticize about Israel?

There are a lot of BS criticisms of Israel, and this is one of the more trivial ones for sure.

[Stand With Israel. Crush Hamas]

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners.

If you have any free time at some point, I'd encourage you to maybe try and open a book.

If you open a book, you will find "Christians" have indeed done nasty things to Jews, but the cause of the discrimination had nothing to do with the European Christians being Christian or the Jews being foreigners. The Holocaust was not a crime done unto Jews by Christians at all, for example.

As for the thread topic, who gives a fuvk besides people looking for (and not finding) something to criticize about Israel?

There are a lot of BS criticisms of Israel, and this is one of the more trivial ones for sure.

There were a lot of Pogroms, particularly in Eastern Europe, that were motivated by religious fervor and actively egged on by the Roman Catholic Church. Blood libels were persistent and deadly for hundreds of years. The Holocaust had nothing really to do with Christianity and was more rooted in racist nationalism, but the anti-semitism that it drew on to create enthusiastic supporters definitely did have links to it.

And yeah, this really strikes me more as people being angry that Israel's sensibilities aren't exactly the same as the US'.

[Indy Texas]

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners.

If you have any free time at some point, I'd encourage you to maybe try and open a book.

If you open a book, you will find "Christians" have indeed done nasty things to Jews, but the cause of the discrimination had nothing to do with the European Christians being Christian or the Jews being foreigners. The Holocaust was not a crime done unto Jews by Christians at all, for example.

As for the thread topic, who gives a fuvk besides people looking for (and not finding) something to criticize about Israel?

There are a lot of BS criticisms of Israel, and this is one of the more trivial ones for sure.

There were a lot of Pogroms, particularly in Eastern Europe, that were motivated by religious fervor and actively egged on by the Roman Catholic Church. Blood libels were persistent and deadly for hundreds of years. The Holocaust had nothing really to do with Christianity and was more rooted in racist nationalism, but the anti-semitism that it drew on to create enthusiastic supporters definitely did have links to it.

And yeah, this really strikes me more as people being angry that Israel's sensibilities aren't exactly the same as the US'.

Israel's sensibilities aren't the same as ours. They're closer to those of their neighbors. Which is why I don't quite understand the logic of those who view Israel as "special" and deserving of better treatment than its neighbors.

The fact is that 98% of Americans, were they living in Israel, would be regarded as second class citizens by virtue of not being Jewish.

When have Christians done nasty things to Jews other than the Inquisition more than 500 years ago? Jews were discriminated against in Europe at other times but they were not being discriminated against from a Christian perspective; they were discriminated against because they were essentially foreigners.

If you have any free time at some point, I'd encourage you to maybe try and open a book.


As for the thread topic, who gives a fuvk besides people looking for (and not finding) something to criticize about Israel?

You can't seem to give me a concrete example, as is the case when most people simply offer a vague exhortation to "open a book."

I'm well aware that you're an Israel Firster, Vosem, which is why I can't understand why your family came here to begin with. There are plenty of your kind in Israel - the Russians I mean - though I'm sorry to say they've by and large made it a much less civilized place than it was before they arrived.