Is America really a great democracy?
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  Is America really a great democracy?
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Author Topic: Is America really a great democracy?  (Read 3219 times)
Knives
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« on: April 02, 2014, 08:14:50 AM »

We've been disusing this in our politics class and have been comparing the Australian system to the American system and in general have come to the conclusion that America isn't a 'great' democracy in comparison. I'm just wondering if anyone agrees, disagrees.
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dead0man
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« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2014, 08:19:45 AM »

Well, we're a democracy (loose sense of the word) that has done great things.  I don't know if we're a "great democracy" though as I'm not sure what that means.
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Knives
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« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2014, 08:25:31 AM »

Well, we're a democracy (loose sense of the word) that has done great things.  I don't know if we're a "great democracy" though as I'm not sure what that means.

As in if you asked an average American they'd say you were the 'greatest democracy' but my question is do you really uphold all the democratic values to be able to claim this - especially in comparison to other states.
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dead0man
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« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2014, 08:28:53 AM »

Yeah, I don't like when people say any country is the greatest at anything, especially something as nebulous as "democracy" so I'm probably not the best person to answer.
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Хahar 🤔
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« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2014, 09:47:58 AM »

This strikes me as an aggressively pointless question.
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Randy Bobandy
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« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2014, 09:49:34 AM »

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no.
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AggregateDemand
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« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2014, 10:08:50 AM »

The United States created modern constitutional federalism, but US culture has a bigger impact on democracy than our system of government. The US electorate seem to favor direct democracy and they expect politicians to cater to their demands. Unfortunately, much of the US electorate is not self-aware and they do not exercise social responsibility at the ballot box, imo. US government devolves into factions of people with wildly unreasonable demands. The factions claim they are good for the US, but they are really just a reflection of their own wants and desires. Disenfranchised voters become the norm.

I think US democracy is exceptional, but the US electorate is subpar.
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2014, 11:09:54 AM »

Of course not, but neither is Australia (as both have capitalism).
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Franzl
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« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2014, 12:19:36 PM »

Subjective to a large extent, of course, but it's hard to conclude it isn't subpar in comparison to a good deal of other democracies.

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politicus
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« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2014, 03:21:00 PM »

Its superior to the other big democracies (India, Indonesia and Brazil), but a lot of smaller countries have better functioning democracies.

If you combine quality of democracy with great power status I suppose you could (marginally) justify the term.
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Starbucks Union Thug HokeyPuck
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« Reply #10 on: April 02, 2014, 03:40:06 PM »

No, we are a great constitutional republic that incorporates some democratic ideas.   
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H.E. VOLODYMYR ZELENKSYY
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« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2014, 05:43:40 PM »

We're great, we're a democracy, we're not a great democracy.
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PiMp DaDdy FitzGerald
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« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2014, 07:11:50 PM »

Looking at things globally, all of your developed countries have governments similar enough that they only appear that different relative to each other. Your garden variety tinpot dictatorships have far more diversity that your wealthy liberal democracies.
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angus
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« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2014, 07:57:46 PM »

We've been disusing this in our politics class and have been comparing the Australian system to the American system and in general have come to the conclusion that America isn't a 'great' democracy in comparison. I'm just wondering if anyone agrees, disagrees.

The US is great, and it operates in a democratic fashion, so I suppose it is a great democracy.  It isn't the greatest, however.  That would be India.
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Mordecai
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« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2014, 06:43:42 AM »

We've been disusing this in our politics class and have been comparing the Australian system to the American system and in general have come to the conclusion that America isn't a 'great' democracy in comparison. I'm just wondering if anyone agrees, disagrees.

I agree, although it is (was) evolving towards one until Citizens United and Shelby County.

To be fair though, Australia had the benefit of hundreds of years of history which allowed it to integrate some of the best bits of electoral systems like group voting, an elected Senate, etc. The United States wasn't really concerned about democracy but the way the system was allowed to evolve to become democratic while still maintaining stability is admirable.

Edit: And Australia doesn't have its own head of state either. Sad
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Del Tachi
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« Reply #15 on: April 04, 2014, 01:51:51 PM »

American democracy sure does beat Australian democracy.
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Orser67
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« Reply #16 on: April 04, 2014, 04:37:38 PM »

I don't think the US is perfect, but I don't think it's dramatically better or worse than other developed economies with democracies. I do hope that, 50 years from now, we'll disapprove of current practices (gerrymandering, outside money) much like how we (mostly) disapprove of practices from 50 years ago (candidates chosen by party bosses, exclusion of many minorities from the political process).

If the US is a "great democracy," I would say it's because of the impressive longevity and evolution of democracy in the US, as well as because of the amount of people who are able to co-exist in one democratic country. I'd also add that the US has done a good job of integrating immigrants into the democratic structure.
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #17 on: April 04, 2014, 06:29:09 PM »

Choosing your preferred thug dictator while having no alternative to the capitalist slave system isn't "democracy".
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tik 🪀✨
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« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2014, 12:11:57 AM »

Choosing your preferred thug dictator while having no alternative to the capitalist slave system isn't "democracy".

I'm sorry your parents are divorced and that no matter which you decide to visit over Christmas, they will make you do the dishes.
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SteveRogers
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« Reply #19 on: April 06, 2014, 04:45:50 PM »

I suppose it depends on what "all the democratic values are." I'd say America is a pretty great democracy.  Our system works pretty well for us. It might not work well for other countries. Differences in electoral rules and political culture don't necessarily mean we're any more or less democratic than other western democracies.

This basically sums up my view of American democracy:
http://www.theonion.com/articles/american-public-gets-exactly-what-it-deserves-for,18401/
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Princess Nyan Cat
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« Reply #20 on: April 06, 2014, 10:29:55 PM »

Choosing your preferred thug dictator while having no alternative to the capitalist slave system isn't "democracy".

As opposed to enlightened Marxist states where no one chooses their leaders at all and those who dare question the wisdom of dear leader are enslaved in gulags and reeducation camps.

Thanks, but I'll stick with my capitalist democracy.
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Associate Justice PiT
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« Reply #21 on: April 07, 2014, 04:01:15 AM »

     It is a pale imitation of the one true light that shines over this world, die Schweizerische Eidgenossenschaft. I suppose it is a great democracy by the lesser standard of other countries.
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Franzl
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« Reply #22 on: April 07, 2014, 06:20:14 AM »

American democracy sure does beat Australian democracy.

Did you really say that with a straight face?
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homelycooking
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« Reply #23 on: April 07, 2014, 08:02:44 AM »

I find it hard to call it a democracy at all when almost ten million of its adult citizens are denied the right to vote either for the United States' chief executive or for their own effective legislative representation in Congress by virtue of where they live, whether it be in one of the United States' outlying colonial territories, in its own federal capital territory or in its vast carceral archipelago. Any nation that permits its states to revoke the right to vote from its citizens on the basis of a past felony conviction does not deserve to be referred to as a democracy anyway.
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RTX
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« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2014, 08:59:16 PM »
« Edited: April 09, 2014, 10:02:53 PM by RTX »

No. On the Federal level, it's a great republic. I'm paraphrasing, but I believe George Washington said that democracy is 51 wolves deciding to eat 49 sheep. Part of the purpose of the US Constitution is to protect the right of a minority (regarding free speech, religion, political opinion, etc.), despite the demands or views of the majority.

On the state and local level, there are more things that are considered democracy, with varying degrees of importance: ex. voting on issuance of bonds for a particular project, amendments to state constitutions, and things such as legalization of marijuana.
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