Would you rather live in Fargo, ND or Phoenix, AZ?
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  Would you rather live in Fargo, ND or Phoenix, AZ?
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Question: Would you rather live in Fargo, ND or Phoenix, AZ?
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Fargo, ND
 
#2
Phoenix, AZ
 
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Author Topic: Would you rather live in Fargo, ND or Phoenix, AZ?  (Read 5188 times)
RosettaStoned
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« Reply #25 on: April 19, 2014, 07:49:02 PM »

 Phoenix, because there is much more to do there.
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politicallefty
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« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2014, 07:30:31 AM »

Phoenix. It's a big city, so there should at least be stuff to do. I can also easily bear the brutal Phoenix summer. North Dakota's winters seem downright nightmarish.
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BRTD
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« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2014, 09:18:37 AM »

I lived through more than 18 North Dakota winters. Its no big deal.
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Oldiesfreak1854
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« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2014, 10:05:35 AM »

Fargo, by at least the distance between the two of them.
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TDAS04
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« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2014, 12:14:44 PM »

It's easier to get warm in bitter cold winters than it is to get cool in the extreme heat typical of Phoenix, even with air conditioning. If it's cold, it's fairly easy to get inside, and even outside, you just have to dress warmly enough.  Wearing light enough clothing when it's 120 degrees is a little more difficult.

Also, the argument that you can cool off in Phoenix just by heading for the mountains or ocean is not that convincing.  It takes more than just a few minutes.
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Nathan
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« Reply #30 on: April 20, 2014, 01:05:16 PM »


Yeah.

Also, the idea that there's only 'stuff to do' in cities of over--what's the cutoff here? Two hundred thousand? Five hundred thousand? More?--people is completely ridiculous and one of my absolute least favorite things that I hear people my age say.
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bedstuy
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« Reply #31 on: April 20, 2014, 01:16:44 PM »

It's easier to get warm in bitter cold winters than it is to get cool in the extreme heat typical of Phoenix, even with air conditioning. If it's cold, it's fairly easy to get inside, and even outside, you just have to dress warmly enough.  Wearing light enough clothing when it's 120 degrees is a little more difficult.

Also, the argument that you can cool off in Phoenix just by heading for the mountains or ocean is not that convincing.  It takes more than just a few minutes.

I've lived in Arizona and Minnesota and I disagree.

First off, 120 is the all time record high for Phoenix.  If you want to play that game we have to compare 120 to -48, the record low for Fargo.  The summers in Phoenix are really hot, sure.  But, the average day is more like 105.  105 is hot, but it's not 105 all day.  When it's actually 105, you're usually at work or school.  In the morning, it's like 85 at most so it's pretty comfortable considering the lack of humidity.  If you get up early, you can be outside comfortably, there's no parallel for that in a Fargo winter.

Cold winters also create all these problems like de-icing your windshield, shoveling snow, your car not starting because it's too cold, your car rusting from salt on the streets, driving in snow and ice, lack of vitamin D and sunshine, not being able to exercise outside.  And, just in terms of physical discomfort, 0 degrees is fifty times worse than 100 degrees.

On the proximity to cooler climates point, I mean you can take a quick weekend trip to the beach or mountains during the hot summer months.
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TNF
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« Reply #32 on: April 20, 2014, 01:31:23 PM »

Fargo.
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patrick1
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« Reply #33 on: April 20, 2014, 01:59:19 PM »

Phoenix, especially so after this winter.  I hate the cold and snow now.
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TDAS04
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« Reply #34 on: April 20, 2014, 02:09:49 PM »

It's easier to get warm in bitter cold winters than it is to get cool in the extreme heat typical of Phoenix, even with air conditioning. If it's cold, it's fairly easy to get inside, and even outside, you just have to dress warmly enough.  Wearing light enough clothing when it's 120 degrees is a little more difficult.

Also, the argument that you can cool off in Phoenix just by heading for the mountains or ocean is not that convincing.  It takes more than just a few minutes.

I've lived in Arizona and Minnesota and I disagree.

First off, 120 is the all time record high for Phoenix.  If you want to play that game we have to compare 120 to -48, the record low for Fargo.  The summers in Phoenix are really hot, sure.  But, the average day is more like 105.  105 is hot, but it's not 105 all day.  When it's actually 105, you're usually at work or school.  In the morning, it's like 85 at most so it's pretty comfortable considering the lack of humidity.  If you get up early, you can be outside comfortably, there's no parallel for that in a Fargo winter.

Cold winters also create all these problems like de-icing your windshield, shoveling snow, your car not starting because it's too cold, your car rusting from salt on the streets, driving in snow and ice, lack of vitamin D and sunshine, not being able to exercise outside.  And, just in terms of physical discomfort, 0 degrees is fifty times worse than 100 degrees.

On the proximity to cooler climates point, I mean you can take a quick weekend trip to the beach or mountains during the hot summer months.

I am more comfortable in 0 degrees than I am in 100 degrees (as long as I'm bungled up in the cold).  When it's -20, you're also likely to be at work or school, and the buildings are kept warm.

As someone who enjoys brisk walks, even 80 is not very comfortable for walking a mile or two at a fast pace.  It's much easier when it's 30-40 with the proper clothes.

I am aware that Arizona is a "dry heat".  While there may be some advantages over a humid heat, dryness has its own problems, especially when combined with heat.  It's not great for the skin, and I get thirsty easily, especially during the hot months.

The climate here in the Dakotas is great for the majority of the year, with maybe a couple months each for bitter cold and for sweltering heat.  I'd rather not have a daily high in the 80s or higher for a majority of the year.
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Goldwater
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« Reply #35 on: April 20, 2014, 02:35:53 PM »

Really? Even most people I know that like cooler weather prefer 100 degrees to 0 degrees, if they are forced to choose. You must have a lot of natural body heat or someting. Tongue
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TDAS04
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« Reply #36 on: April 20, 2014, 03:12:27 PM »

Really? Even most people I know that like cooler weather prefer 100 degrees to 0 degrees, if they are forced to choose. You must have a lot of natural body heat or someting. Tongue

It may be different if I have to be outside.  My house has good heating, even in 0 degrees.  It's harder to keep my place comfortable in 100.
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« Reply #37 on: April 20, 2014, 06:42:23 PM »

Really? Even most people I know that like cooler weather prefer 100 degrees to 0 degrees, if they are forced to choose. You must have a lot of natural body heat or someting. Tongue

0 degrees is far preferable to 100, no contest. You'd have to go down to about -15F or so for it to become comparable.
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Goldwater
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« Reply #38 on: April 20, 2014, 06:44:31 PM »

Really? Even most people I know that like cooler weather prefer 100 degrees to 0 degrees, if they are forced to choose. You must have a lot of natural body heat or someting. Tongue

0 degrees is far preferable to 100, no contest. You'd have to go down to about -15F or so for it to become comparable.

You must be talking about Celsius. Wink
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bedstuy
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« Reply #39 on: April 20, 2014, 06:59:53 PM »

Really? Even most people I know that like cooler weather prefer 100 degrees to 0 degrees, if they are forced to choose. You must have a lot of natural body heat or someting. Tongue

0 degrees is far preferable to 100, no contest. You'd have to go down to about -15F or so for it to become comparable.

Since we're talking about Phoenix, keep in mind, this is 100 with no humidity.  It's really not that bad.  But, I would even take a humid NYC 100 over 0. 

I feel like people tend to adjust to wherever they live anyway though.
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Badger
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« Reply #40 on: April 24, 2014, 08:12:35 PM »


Where to begin?

1) The weather preference is the closest thing to a personally subjective comparison. Yeah, it's a dry heat in Phoenix, but it's still a lot of heat. That said, anybody who claims Fargo winters "aren't that bad" because "I've survived about 18 of them" is not only objectively wrong, but likely suffering from an Ingress-related head injury. Point: Phoenix.

2) Joe Arpaio sucks, but he hardly "runs" Phoenix. He's in charge of the county jail and law enforcement generally in the unincorporated parts of Maricopa County plus a few (mostly smaller) incorporated communities they contract with. Phoenix PD is the law enforcement agency one would most likely deal with. Furthermore, most people on the Forum aren't likely to be arrested, at least not for anything serious. Again, Arpaio sucks, but thinking he'd have a tangible impact on one's life to avoid moving there is just boneheaded. That'd be like a Democrat not moving to WI or ME because they're "run" by Walker or LePage. But I imagine that if there are enough hipster churches there even that'd be okay. Fargo is penalized for general cluelessness by it's boosters---Point: Phoenix.

3) The largest city in the American Southwest with an enormous offering of cultural, recreational and entertainment opportunities vs.........Fargo. This isn't even debatable. Name an area of interest: music, art, sports, cultural, dining, dance, educational, nightlife, etc, etc, etc, etc. Phoenix has it, and often in spades.
Someone aptly pointed out that too many people believe the fallacy a city has to have at least "X" thousand people in it for there to be things to do. True, but we're not comparing Phoenix to Santa Fe, or even Green Bay, but to Fargo. The only apparent cultural attractions of note there are a plethora of regrettable "fests". Point: Phoenix x 100000.

4) Diversity: We're comparing a city of one and a half million with not only a large Hispanic population, but also sizable vibrant African-American, Native American, and Asian communties. It's truly a melting pot.

vs. Fargo, population a bit over 100k, whose whiteness matches it's landscape 7 months a year. "Diversity? Oh, yah, we gots lotsa diversity hereabouts. We got Germans AND Norwegians dontcha know." And no, having both emoviolence fans and screamcore fans IS NOT diversity.
PointGOOOOOOOAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL: Phoenix.

5) Landscape. I went to Phoenix a couple years ago. It's uniformly breathtaking. The mesas and desert cliffs. One would have to be flint-hearted not to be moved.

As best as I can tell, the landscape in greater Fargo, when one can see it the few months it's not buried under snow, is largely flat--as in "Hey! I can see Bismark standing on the hood of my truck!", flat--croplands for several area codes in every direction. But hey, if you like wheatfield after wheatfield after wheatfield after dairy farm after corn field after wheatfield after wheatfield, this is definitely the place for you!
Point: The Place With Great Scenery (not Fargo)

7) Being sick of the incessant attention-whoring BRTD threads involving Fargo or North Dakota. It technically may have nothing to do with either city's desirability, but on general principle--Point: Phoenix.
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Torie
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« Reply #41 on: April 24, 2014, 08:27:42 PM »

I demand another option, or I will sue.
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TJ in Oregon
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« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2014, 11:53:58 PM »

Fargo hands down. Phoenix is like something out of a suburbia-based dystopia novel: a sprawling concrete wasteland that has nothing but brown as far as the eye can see. And yes, of course I'd gladly take 0°F over 100°F without question. I know people will say it's only 85°F in the mornings, but I hate having to get up at 5am to do things before work. It's not enjoyable and 85°F is still too hot for much to be enjoyable anyway. I've never been to Fargo, but I'll gladly take practically anywhere in the US over Phoenix.
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Grumpier Than Uncle Joe
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« Reply #43 on: April 25, 2014, 04:53:15 AM »

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« Reply #44 on: April 25, 2014, 05:27:27 AM »

I would surely prefeer ND climate. Fargo.
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dead0man
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« Reply #45 on: April 25, 2014, 06:16:04 AM »

Fargo
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Kushahontas
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« Reply #46 on: April 25, 2014, 10:57:55 AM »

Phoenix easily (and I kinda hate hot weather)
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Goldwater
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« Reply #47 on: April 25, 2014, 07:01:36 PM »

I know I sound like a broken record right now, and my obsession with warm weather has probably annoyed the hell out of everybody already, but just don't get it. Anarchists, Communists, and Fascists make more sense to me than cold weather lovers. Tongue
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politicallefty
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« Reply #48 on: April 26, 2014, 06:53:27 AM »

I lived through more than 18 North Dakota winters. Its no big deal.

I can't bear cold weather. I can't say that I'd particularly enjoy a constant temperature above 100, but it's preferable to a constant temperature below freezing (let alone the the much lower temps typical in a Fargo winter). I'd also prefer not to live in the snow (with the exception of Colorado).
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« Reply #49 on: April 26, 2014, 09:39:10 AM »


Where to begin?

1) The weather preference is the closest thing to a personally subjective comparison. Yeah, it's a dry heat in Phoenix, but it's still a lot of heat. That said, anybody who claims Fargo winters "aren't that bad" because "I've survived about 18 of them" is not only objectively wrong, but likely suffering from an Ingress-related head injury. Point: Phoenix.

2) Joe Arpaio sucks, but he hardly "runs" Phoenix. He's in charge of the county jail and law enforcement generally in the unincorporated parts of Maricopa County plus a few (mostly smaller) incorporated communities they contract with. Phoenix PD is the law enforcement agency one would most likely deal with. Furthermore, most people on the Forum aren't likely to be arrested, at least not for anything serious. Again, Arpaio sucks, but thinking he'd have a tangible impact on one's life to avoid moving there is just boneheaded. That'd be like a Democrat not moving to WI or ME because they're "run" by Walker or LePage. But I imagine that if there are enough hipster churches there even that'd be okay. Fargo is penalized for general cluelessness by it's boosters---Point: Phoenix.

3) The largest city in the American Southwest with an enormous offering of cultural, recreational and entertainment opportunities vs.........Fargo. This isn't even debatable. Name an area of interest: music, art, sports, cultural, dining, dance, educational, nightlife, etc, etc, etc, etc. Phoenix has it, and often in spades.
Someone aptly pointed out that too many people believe the fallacy a city has to have at least "X" thousand people in it for there to be things to do. True, but we're not comparing Phoenix to Santa Fe, or even Green Bay, but to Fargo. The only apparent cultural attractions of note there are a plethora of regrettable "fests". Point: Phoenix x 100000.

4) Diversity: We're comparing a city of one and a half million with not only a large Hispanic population, but also sizable vibrant African-American, Native American, and Asian communties. It's truly a melting pot.

vs. Fargo, population a bit over 100k, whose whiteness matches it's landscape 7 months a year. "Diversity? Oh, yah, we gots lotsa diversity hereabouts. We got Germans AND Norwegians dontcha know." And no, having both emoviolence fans and screamcore fans IS NOT diversity.
PointGOOOOOOOAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL: Phoenix.

5) Landscape. I went to Phoenix a couple years ago. It's uniformly breathtaking. The mesas and desert cliffs. One would have to be flint-hearted not to be moved.

As best as I can tell, the landscape in greater Fargo, when one can see it the few months it's not buried under snow, is largely flat--as in "Hey! I can see Bismark standing on the hood of my truck!", flat--croplands for several area codes in every direction. But hey, if you like wheatfield after wheatfield after wheatfield after dairy farm after corn field after wheatfield after wheatfield, this is definitely the place for you!
Point: The Place With Great Scenery (not Fargo)

7) Being sick of the incessant attention-whoring BRTD threads involving Fargo or North Dakota. It technically may have nothing to do with either city's desirability, but on general principle--Point: Phoenix.

1) I've always held the heat to be far worse than the cold, because for cold you just have to put on a heavier jacket or another layer. Not much you can do with Phoenix level heat. Also every summer I hear stories about people collapsing and dying in heat waves, it's pretty rare to hear a story about someone freezing to death here even in the winter (and when it happens it's usually hypothermia because of some drunk person walking into a lake or something)

2) Actually Scott Walker is the main reason I would not move to Wisconsin from here. And Arpaio's violations of civil liberties are hardly trivial. It might be OK to overlook if Phoenix was an otherwise desirable place to live instead of a hot sprawling mess but as it is...

3) The show I saw last month in Fargo was one of the most fun ones I've ever been to. Per capita Fargo actually has far more than Phoenix. For various reasons bands prefer to play in Tuscon than Phoenix. Phoenix is not just a particularly desirable city to go to shows in, from what I gather the scene is mostly bad metalcore, think the type of crap 20RP12 liked. There was Jimmy Eat World I suppose but they started out two decades ago.

4) I described Fargo in another thread as the type of place where you can walk down a grocery store aisle passing a Somali man and a Hispanic woman with a chestpiece tattoo and necklace that says "DOPE" on it. I know this because I actually did it. Fargo is kind of becoming Twin Cities-lite in demographics. One demographic group that Phoenix has far more of is annoying olds who can't drive.

5) OK you have obviously never been to Fargo now if you think there's only a "few" months it's not under snow. Even North Dakota doesn't get any permanent snow until around Thanksgiving (there might be some earlier but it usually melts before that) and by mid-March it's mostly gone. There might be a snow storm or two after that, but then it all melts away quickly. So that leaves around 3-4 months of being buried in snow, or around only 25-33% of the year.

Now it's true that it's flat in that area (and while you can't see Bismarck from Fargo, you can from over 20 miles away on I-94, especially if it's dark out as Bismarck is the only light source) but I'm sure many might disagree on that being just boring, see Nathan's comment here:
Has absolutely no redeeming characteristics, or characteristics in general. HS, but because it is boring and white it will get a large FS majority.

It has a lot of open, stark natural beauty, although I imagine it had more before the energy boom started. That's why I'm voting FS on most of the Interior West states, not anything to do with their racial demographics.

Plus in Fargo you're not too far from being able to visit many of the places listed here if you want to check out cool scenery: www.ghostsofnorthdakota.com

6) (as it was skipped to 7.) Actually I explained above why I made this and the other thread, because the show I went to in Fargo was actually quite awesome and in fact even better than your average Minneapolis show.
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