City of Hudson's weighed voting system under scrutiny

[Torie]

This is the previous attempt to switch to equal population districts.

March 18, 2003 Common Council minutes. Resolution for equal population wards is at Page 15 of PDF

Gossips of Rivertown has suggested that it was a vote to switch to 6 districts, and has produced a map drawn by the city clerk, which was indeed based on 2000 census numbers, but I have not found any official record. There is a glitch in the common council minutes beginning in about August of 2003, with a couple of months missing, so it is conceivable that there was a replacement in the few months before the November election. The results of the referendum are on the Columbia County BOE web site.

This is my interpretation of the text.

Yeah, that is the map. The City clerk went on a hunt for me, since it was missing from the minutes, and found it in another file. Of course, given the population errors for the split census tracts, the map if a fail because the population numbers are wrong, but that will all be fixed soon. See below.

[jimrtex]

This is the previous attempt to switch to equal population districts.

March 18, 2003 Common Council minutes. Resolution for equal population wards is at Page 15 of PDF

Gossips of Rivertown has suggested that it was a vote to switch to 6 districts, and has produced a map drawn by the city clerk, which was indeed based on 2000 census numbers, but I have not found any official record. There is a glitch in the common council minutes beginning in about August of 2003, with a couple of months missing, so it is conceivable that there was a replacement in the few months before the November election. The results of the referendum are on the Columbia County BOE web site.

This is my interpretation of the text.

Yeah, that is the map. The City clerk went on a hunt for me, since it was missing from the minutes, and found it in another file. Of course, given the population errors for the split census tracts, the map if a fail because the population numbers are wrong, but that will all be fixed soon. See below.

Why do you want to maintain the split blocks?

What about coming across Warren to Columbia?

What was the area in the green circle on my map as the intersection of Warren and Worth. It is a tire store now, correct? It has a mansard roof, so it theoretically could have been an apartment, but it doesn't look large enough for 75 persons.

The block is bounded by Worth and Warren (Warren extends past the intersection and curves south as a residential street), and a short line on the south that does not appear to correspond to anything that looks like a road. It is sort of parallel to the alley south of Warren (Cherry Alley?), but isn't.

BTW, have you ever looked at the referendum results from 2003? They are on the Columbia Board of Elections website.

[Torie]

This is the map that I drew that I think is best, and following my advice as the premier map junkie in the City of Hudson (you would be of course, but you don't live in Hudson, so thus I assume the honor ), it has been approved by the appropriate cabal. The split of the census block involving the projection of Fifth Street maintains the status quo. The split of the Hudson Terrace Apartments census block also hews to the status quo, and using Warren Street as a dividing line, is politically almost required absent compelling reasons to depart from that line, and there are no such compelling reasons. The census block population splits were carefully calculated by the City Clerk using data from the assessor's office as to the number of residential units per legal parcel, and I am accepting her numbers.

Below is the legal description of the wards. Fun stuff. I am writing the balance of the referendum now, although it is still unclear what text goes on the petition and/or the ballot, and what not. That is the toughest part. Nobody seems to have gone the referendum by petition route before in New York State, and thus, now going where no person has gone before, there is a lack of a suitable template that has been legally tested, or at least used in the past. The Home Rule Law provides little guidance. I fear that at the minimum the whole darn text will need to go on the petitions, above the signature lines. Ugh!

A.  First Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then southwesterly and then northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the First Ward.

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

C.  Third Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where the center line of Worth Avenue intersects the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then easterly bounds of the City to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the center line of Fairview Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in a northwesterly and then westerly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly, direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Third Ward.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

E.  Fifth Ward.   All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and running thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in an easterly and then southeasterly direction to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the easterly bounds of the City in a northerly direction to where said boundary intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fifth Ward.

[jimrtex]

This is the map that I drew that I think is best, and following my advice as the premier map junkie in the City of Hudson (you would be of course, but you don't live in Hudson, so thus I assume the honor ), it has been approved by the appropriate cabal. The split of the census block involving the projection of Fifth Street maintains the status quo. The split of the Hudson Terrace Apartments census block also hews to the status quo, and using Warren Street as a dividing line, is politically almost required absent compelling reasons to depart from that line, and there are no such compelling reasons. The census block population splits were carefully calculated by the City Clerk using data from the assessor's office as to the number of residential units per legal parcel, and I am accepting her numbers.

The division of Hudson Terrace Apartments splits a predominately black community, and submerges the southern part in a ward that will now extend to the southeast part of the city. At the time Hudson was divided into four wards, Warren extended west of Front Street, and the extension was from the Promenade to the middle of the river. The division also confuses the board of elections since the street addresses for the two sections are 19 North Front and 19 South Front, and people either did not know their street address or it was unclear on their registration form. The addresses also includes building numbers, so the post office will probably deliver mail using that. The 5th Street split has also caused problems, plus splits a house.


Below is the legal description of the wards. Fun stuff. I am writing the balance of the referendum now, although it is still unclear what text goes on the petition and/or the ballot, and what not. That is the toughest part. Nobody seems to have gone the referendum by petition route before in New York State, and thus, now going where no person has gone before, there is a lack of a suitable template that has been legally tested, or at least used in the past. The Home Rule Law provides little guidance. I fear that at the minimum the whole darn text will need to go on the petitions, above the signature lines. Ugh!

A.  First Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then southwesterly and then northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the First Ward.

Missing article

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

Census Tract numbers are relative to counties. I am pretty sure that the road you are following is now considered to be Second Street (it is by the Census Bureau). Presumably, you will have a map, inventory of census blocks, and populations associated with your plan. The tax office also shows this as being 2nd St, but they are using Google as part of their mapping application, and Google is likely getting their maps from the census bureau.

In addition, the intersection of Second Street with Block 1000 is ambiguous since Second Street forms the boundary of Block 1000 from Strawberry Alley northward.

I believe that North and South are parts of the proper names of the numbered streets.

I would substitute the following for the text in red.

"thence along the center line of North Second Street in a northeasterly and northerly direction"

If you look at the map used for the 1940 Census at the very edge of map it says "to brick works", and the boundary of the enumeration district is described as being formed by Second Street and the road to the brick works. The area to the east of the road was used for mining clay for bricks, and then was used a a dump. The area is now capped to prevent leaching into the groundwater and into the Hudson. The city want to do something with the area, but hasn't figured out to avoid penetrating or eroding the cap. Your secret trail is the remnant of an access to the dump from the east.


C.  Third Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where the center line of Worth Avenue intersects the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then easterly bounds of the City to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the center line of Fairview Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in a northwesterly and then westerly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly, direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of North Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of North Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Third Ward.

Extraneous comma. That little tab bounded by 6th, Rope Alley, Dodge, and State Street is not needed. Personally, I would start the description at 5th and Warren. It is easier for me to understand the lines that separate wards, and use the city limits for a middle portion or final part of the description.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

I think the starting point is odd. I'd start at well known point such as 5th and Warren, and then when you get to Washington and 5th, you can use 5th and 5th extended to Harry Howard. See the comments above regarding the Dodge-Rope tab, and North 2nd Street above.

E.  Fifth Ward.   All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and running thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in an easterly and then southeasterly direction to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the easterly bounds of the City in a northerly direction to where said boundary intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fifth Ward.
[/quote]

I would start at 5th and Washington, or 6th and State, and go counter-clockwise.

[Torie]

The division of Hudson Terrace Apartments splits  ...

I know all of the above, but I am sticking to the existing map here for political reasons.


Below is the legal description of the wards. Fun stuff. I am writing the balance of the referendum now, although it is still unclear what text goes on the petition and/or the ballot, and what not. That is the toughest part. Nobody seems to have gone the referendum by petition route before in New York State, and thus, now going where no person has gone before, there is a lack of a suitable template that has been legally tested, or at least used in the past. The Home Rule Law provides little guidance. I fear that at the minimum the whole darn text will need to go on the petitions, above the signature lines. Ugh!

A.  First Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then southwesterly and then northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the First Ward.

Missing article

Yeah.

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

Census Tract numbers are relative to counties. I am pretty sure that the road you are following is now considered to be Second Street (it is by the Census Bureau). Presumably, you will have a map, inventory of census blocks, and populations associated with your plan. The tax office also shows this as being 2nd St, but they are using Google as part of their mapping application, and Google is likely getting their maps from the census bureau.

No, 2nd street goes all the way to the end to the factory facility, and this intrudes into census block 1000.

In addition, the intersection of Second Street with Block 1000 is ambiguous since Second Street forms the boundary of Block 1000 from Strawberry Alley northward.

I don't think so. When 2nd street intersects census block 1000, you then depart from the 2nd street boundary line, and follow the census block line to the city border.

I believe that North and South are parts of the proper names of the numbered streets.

Yes, I agree, although the existing legals for the wards don't use north and south.

I would substitute the following for the text in red.

"thence along the center line of North Second Street in a northeasterly and northerly direction"

If you look at the map used for the 1940 Census at the very edge of map it says "to brick works", and the boundary of the enumeration district is described as being formed by Second Street and the road to the brick works. The area to the east of the road was used for mining clay for bricks, and then was used a a dump. The area is now capped to prevent leaching into the groundwater and into the Hudson. The city want to do something with the area, but hasn't figured out to avoid penetrating or eroding the cap. Your secret trail is the remnant of an access to the dump from the east.


C.  Third Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where the center line of Worth Avenue intersects the southerly bounds of the City, and thence along the southerly and then easterly bounds of the City to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the center line of Fairview Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in a northwesterly and then westerly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly, direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of North Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of North Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Third Ward.

Extraneous comma. That little tab bounded by 6th, Rope Alley, Dodge, and State Street is not needed. Personally, I would start the description at 5th and Warren. It is easier for me to understand the lines that separate wards, and use the city limits for a middle portion or final part of the description.

Where is the extra comma? Oh, I see. What do you mean the tab is not needed? Are you suggesting that the map be changed. The tab is there to equalize populations better.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

I think the starting point is odd. I'd start at well known point such as 5th and Warren, and then when you get to Washington and 5th, you can use 5th and 5th extended to Harry Howard. See the comments above regarding the Dodge-Rope tab, and North 2nd Street above.

I did it because that is the way the existing legal starts, albeit from the city boundary of the fifth street extension rather than the intersection of Harry Howard avenue.

E.  Fifth Ward.   All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and running thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Green Street, and thence along the center line of Green Street in an easterly and then southeasterly direction to the center line of Fairview Avenue, and thence along the easterly bounds of the City in a northerly direction to where said boundary intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in a southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fifth Ward.

I would start at 5th and Washington, or 6th and State, and go counter-clockwise.

Ditto to the above.

[jimrtex]

The division of Hudson Terrace Apartments splits  ...

I know all of the above, but I am sticking to the existing map here for political reasons.

Cracking of minority population, and disregard for census geography are not legitimate political reasons.

B.  Second Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street in a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and northwesterly bounds of the City to the place of beginning, shall be the Second Ward.

Census Tract numbers are relative to counties. I am pretty sure that the road you are following is now considered to be Second Street (it is by the Census Bureau). Presumably, you will have a map, inventory of census blocks, and populations associated with your plan. The tax office also shows this as being 2nd St, but they are using Google as part of their mapping application, and Google is likely getting their maps from the census bureau.

No, 2nd street goes all the way to the end to the factory facility, and this intrudes into census block 1000.


The Register-Star is not a definitive source, neither is the Census Bureau.  It is normal to be assigned a postal address based on the nearest street. At the time of the 1990 Census, Second Street was shown with a more northerly alignment, matching the 1940 Census Map and extending to the northern city limit. It formed the western boundary of what is in the 1990 Census, Block 101.
Were you describing your ward boundary in 1996, you would have referred to the boundary as Second Street.



During the mid-1990s, the dump was capped, the button factory built, and the road rebuilt to the west of the dump cap. In 2000 and 2010, this new road formed the boundary of the census block.

The button factory is on what used to be Second Street. The street is on property owned by the City of Hudson as is the former dump site. The plant itself is on a different parcel.

So when the dump was capped, the new road was built, looping around the west side of the dump cap to the city limits. The old alignment was truncated at the button factory where what you are calling 2nd Street flows into the parking lot. While it is along the former alignment, it is functionally a driveway.

In addition, the intersection of Second Street with Block 1000 is ambiguous since Second Street forms the boundary of Block 1000 from Strawberry Alley northward.

I don't think so. When 2nd street intersects census block 1000, you then depart from the 2nd street boundary line, and follow the census block line to the city border.
You are using the Census block boundary, but are rejecting the census name for that boundary. And that is not an "intersection" even if it 2nd Street going to the button factory.




I believe that North and South are parts of the proper names of the numbered streets.

Yes, I agree, although the existing legals for the wards don't use north and south.
It is also possible that North and South are part of the postal address designation - the census bureau is particularly interested in having postal addresses for verifying their enumeration.

The existing ward description also refers to Gifford Place. Third Street was first used as a ward boundary in 1815, when Hudson included parts of of Stockport and Greenport had not been created. The ward boundary went north-south, and used 3rd Street across Hudson. Postal addresses did not come until much later. The use of Warren as a ward boundary did not begin until 1854.

Incidentally, South 7th Street begins at Columbia, and not Warren (at least according to the Census Bureau), but that doesn't match what the Tax Office thinks.

C.  Third Ward.  [...]thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction [...]

That little tab bounded by 6th, Rope Alley, Dodge, and State Street is not needed. Personally, I would start the description at 5th and Warren. It is easier for me to understand the lines that separate wards, and use the city limits for a middle portion or final part of the description.
What do you mean the tab is not needed? Are you suggesting that the map be changed. The tab is there to equalize populations better.
The population is equal enough without the tab. Ward 4: +2.8%, Ward 5: -2.4%. When 13 persons represent 1% of the quota, you could probably justify going outside 5% limits. You've quartered a city block without any reason to do so.

D.  Fourth Ward.  All that part of the City lying within the lines beginning at a point where a northerly extension projecting the center line of Fifth Street intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along said projection and the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Washington Street, and thence along the center line of Washington Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Sixth Street, and thence along the center line of Sixth Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Dodge Street, and thence along the center line of Dodge Street in a southwesterly direction to the center line of State Street, and thence along the center line of State Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Fifth Street, and thence along the center line of Fifth Street in a southwesterly direction  to the center line of Warren Street, and thence along the center line of Warren Street in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Third Street, and thence along the center line of Third Street in a northeasterly direction to the center line of Rope Alley, and thence along the center line of Rope Alley in a northwesterly direction to the center line of Second Street, and thence along the center line of Second Street n a northeasterly direction to where the center line of Second Street intersects the boundary of that certain United States census block described in the 2010 United States census as Tract 12, Block 1000 in the City of Hudson, and thence along said census boundary line in a northerly direction to the northerly bounds of the City, and thence along the northerly and easterly bounds of the City to where said boundary line intersects the center line of Harry Howard Avenue, and thence along the center line of Harry Howard Avenue in  southwesterly direction to the place of beginning, shall be the Fourth Ward.

I think the starting point is odd. I'd start at well known point such as 5th and Warren, and then when you get to Washington and 5th, you can use 5th and 5th extended to Harry Howard. See the comments above regarding the Dodge-Rope tab, and North 2nd Street above.
I did it because that is the way the existing legal starts, albeit from the city boundary of the fifth street extension rather than the intersection of Harry Howard avenue.
The original (1815) ward boundary was 3rd  Street, then going up the Dugway and out what is now Harry Howard. The city was divided into 4 wards in 1854, dividing the existing two wards on Warren (and Columbia and Columbia Turnpike). By that time Greenport had been created, so for practical purposes, 3rd Street within the grid was the ward boundary. The extensions to the city limits were just mathematical exercises. In 1886, the 5th ward was divided off from the 4th ward. it was easy enough to copy the 3rd Street extension in the definition. At that time the extension really did not present the problems it does now.

If we want a consistent definition, you could use a well-understood intersection with the city limits, followed by the boundary within the city, and completed by the city limits. Note that current desription of Wards 1 and 2 do not include a loop, but simply describe a quartering of the city.

Ward 1: Warren (extended) & west city limit, traversed CW.
Ward 2: Warren (extended) & west city limit, traversed CCW.
Ward 3: Worth & south city limit, traversed CW.
Ward 4: Harry Howard & (north)east city limit, traversed CCW
Ward 5: Harry Howard & (north)east city limit, traversed CCW

For Ward 3, this would make the traverse to the intersection of Fairview&Graham, and then following the city limits. Since Fairview doesn't cross the city limits at a point, this would be easier to understand.

[jimrtex]

This is the formal census description of the Great Northern block.

Block 1000, Block Group 1, Census Tract 12, Columbia County, New York

The block group is redundant since it is the thousands digit of the block number, so can be omitted:

Block 1000, Census Tract 12, Columbia County, New York

Arguably "New York" is understood in this context, but Columbia County is necessary.

[jimrtex]

This eliminates the splits of census blocks and avoids use of alleys. Total deviation is 4.4%



1   1294   +1.0%
2   1263   -1.4%
3   1250   -2.4%
4   1290   +0.7%
5   1306   +2.0%

[jimrtex]

Can you see this?

[Torie]

Can you see this?

It said I requested permission, so you have to approve me I guess. The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

Nice map above, but it is not happening, and the population variances are too large. The variances may be legal (I think for any population variation under federal law, you need some reasonable rationale for the departure from perfect equality (other than just because you feel like it), and having nice rectangular lines may not be enough), but I don't want to go there, either legally or politically. You also excised a heaving black census block from the 2nd ward (the one with 158 people in it, perhaps the most run down side of a block in all of the city of Hudson), which will cause consternation. That block was specifically mentioned by one the 2nd ward alderpersons.

Oh, per Google Earth, you are right about the N. Second Street affair, so I changed my legal descriptions for the 2nd and 4th wards accordingly. The other 2nd Street is called 2nd Street Extension.

[muon2]

The way I have done ward descriptions in IL would make Ward 1 read as follows:

A.  First Ward.  The first ward shall consist of that part of the City lying south and west of a line described as follows: Beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to a point at the southerly bounds of the City, said point being the terminus of the described line.

Note that this method of description relies on the non-necessity of repeating the boundary that is the corporate limit. It assumes that the corporate limits are well defined elsewhere. In IL it has the advantage of adjusting to future annexation changing the corporate limits, though that presumably is less of an issue in Hudson.

[muon2]

Oh, per Google Earth, you are right about the N. Second Street affair, so I changed my legal descriptions for the 2nd and 4th wards accordingly. The other 2nd Street is called 2nd Street Extension.

Interestingly on Google Maps the dirt road that forks to the northwest is N 2nd St. On Mapquest (using TomTom) the same road is called 2nd St Ext. Just to really mix things up, Bing maps calls all of the road past Mill St into the factory 2nd St Ext, and they have no label for the dirt road the branches and defines the boundary of the Census block. Ugh. What does the county actually think it is?

For what it's worth Google shows that the dirt road it calls N 2nd St actually intersects the corporate limits at its terminus.

[Torie]

I am just going with N. 2nd street and abandoning the reference to the census tract. Nobody lives in this area anyway. The census must have thought the dirt road was a road. Zillow calls the paved road past Mill Street N. 2nd Street Extension. Google maps (even more clearly than Google Earth) clearly calls out as N. 2nd Street the paved road to the dirt road and then the dirt road. 

Anyway, I have jogged on that dirt road a few times. I like getting out into the country, and communing with nature, day dreaming impossible dreams, which bucolic bliss is but one block away from my old disheveled brick house. Now I know I was jogging on N. 2nd Street!

[muon2]

I am just going with N. 2nd street and abandoning the reference to the census tract. Nobody lives in this area anyway. The census must have thought the dirt road was a road. Zillow calls the paved road past Mill Street N. 2nd Street Extension. Google maps (even more clearly than Google Earth) clearly calls out as N. 2nd Street the paved road to the dirt road and then the dirt road. 

Anyway, I have jogged on that dirt road a few times. I like getting out into the country, and communing with nature, day dreaming impossible dreams, which bucolic bliss is but one block away from my old disheveled brick house. Now I know I was jogging on N. 2nd Street!

Yep. I have found the Census geography is only as good as the state local officials assigned to review their block definitions. After the 2000 census I found one of those kinds of geography errors that resulted in 100 people placed outside my city's boundaries. Getting them back inside resulted in an extra 10K+/year in state distributive funds.

What did you think of my boundary formulation?

[jimrtex]

How about this?

[jimrtex]

You should read this opinion - lots of interesting thoughts about electoral and representation equality.

Calvin v Jefferson County (PDF)

Ignore that the decision is about prisons, and that Hudson has a prison - but focus on the underlying principles.

[jimrtex]

It said I requested permission, so you have to approve me I guess.

I think I fixed it, try the link posted in another message.

Nice map above, but it is not happening, and the population variances are too large. The variances may be legal (I think for any population variation under federal law, you need some reasonable rationale for the departure from perfect equality (other than just because you feel like it), and having nice rectangular lines may not be enough), but I don't want to go there, either legally or politically.

What does federal law other than the VRA have to do with state or local governmental elections? Doesn't the 10th Amendment apply to New York?

The SCOTUS has interpreted the equal protection clause to mean that if the range of deviation is less than 10% that the burden is on the challenger to prove that there is an equal protection violation. If the range is above 10%, then the burden shifts to the government (see Abate v Mundt

Splitting of census blocks is demonstrably beyond Hudson and Columbia election authorities capability to handle.

(1) Census enumerators did not rigorously follow ward boundaries.
(2) When VTDs were introduced they were told that they couldn't split census blocks. But they also included the block surrounded by Short-State-5th-Washington in the VTD corresponding to Ward 5.
(3) The BOE used the VTD maps for the public, but internally used another definition which does not match the law.
(4) In the 1990s Columbia County used the VTD maps to determine voting weights (legendary sleepy Hudson didn't bother to update its voting weights).
(5) In the 2000s Hudson used the legal ward lines to determine the voting weights, but did not communicate this to the BOE, who did not use the legal ward lines.
(6) In the 2010s Hudson and Columbia County used the VTD maps to determine the voting weights, but totally botched the allocation of population for blocks where multiple wards were included within one VTD.
(7) Voters at the Firemen's Home were denied the right to vote in 2015 (they form a clearly identifiable class. This is likely a violation of the 26th Amendment.
(8) The current voting weights violate equal protection, and probably due process, yet Hudson and Columbia persist in using them, even though they know they are wrong.
(9) Hudson paid for a survey ($4000?) of the 5th street extension, and Columbia County ignored the results.
(10) The 5th Street extension runs through a house on Clinton.
(11) The Board of Elections has misregistered voters in the Front Street block because of confusion over addresses.
(12) The Front Street block was not divided by Warren Street extend in 1854. It was divided by (west) Warren Street. You are using a street that no longer exists and was deliberately obliterated.

The Warren Street extension divides a single unified apartment complex which is over 80% minority, and mostly low income, and would be submerged in a greatly expanded Ward 1.

You don't  use 5th Street as the boundary. The 5th Street extension was theoretical when it was drawn in 1886. The Firemen's Home did not exist. The houses on Harry Howard north of Underhill Pond did not exist (and Harry Howard was not Harry Howard), even the houses on Clinton did not exist.

You also excised a heaving black census block from the 2nd ward (the one with 158 people in it, perhaps the most run down side of a block in all of the city of Hudson), which will cause consternation. That block was specifically mentioned by one the 2nd ward alderpersons.

I can fix that.

I suspect you mean that the north side of State (or south side of Rope Alley) is heavily black. The Front Street apartments are slightly more Black and Asian, the State street block more Hispanic.

Oh, per Google Earth, you are right about the N. Second Street affair, so I changed my legal descriptions for the 2nd and 4th wards accordingly. The other 2nd Street is called 2nd Street Extension.

Google apparently uses the census definition. The census includes address ranges, and shows 128 to be just south of Mill Street. 128 Second Street is the address of the button factory. Did the city redesignate 2nd Street?

[Torie]

You should read this opinion - lots of interesting thoughts about electoral and representation equality.

Calvin v Jefferson County (PDF)

Ignore that the decision is about prisons, and that Hudson has a prison - but focus on the underlying principles.

Interesting reading. Mirror, mirror on the wall, is the 5th ward screwed after all (more folks per alderperson, thus less "access," or "unfairly" benefitted (because it has more critical votes than it should assuming its two alderpersons do not vote randomly vis a vis each other)?

[jimrtex]

The way I have done ward descriptions in IL would make Ward 1 read as follows:

A.  First Ward.  The first ward shall consist of that part of the City lying south and west of a line described as follows: Beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to a point at the southerly bounds of the City, said point being the terminus of the described line.

Note that this method of description relies on the non-necessity of repeating the boundary that is the corporate limit. It assumes that the corporate limits are well defined elsewhere. In IL it has the advantage of adjusting to future annexation changing the corporate limits, though that presumably is less of an issue in Hudson.

Columbia Turnpike intersected the city boundary when it was established as the ward boundary in 1854. Hudson later annexed the cemetery to the southeast, so that Columbia Turnpike is tangential to the new annexed area. This may have caused confusion which resulted in the Columbia triangle being flipped (though this was in part to the definition of Columbia Street being changed).

The  quartering definition like you used is currently used for the 1st and 2nd wards. The original ward division of Hudson was on 3rd street, dividing the city west and east.

When the 3rd and 4th wards were added in 1854, Warren was used to split the city north-south. So the 1st and 2nd wards are clearly* the southwest and northwest quadrants. For the 3rd and 4th it is more ambiguous since the Warren division did not go to the city limits. *Warren runs at 135 degrees, but is apparently considered to run East-West, likely since it is perpendicular to the Hudson River.

But with the new proposed boundaries, only Ward 1 is in two directions of its boundary lines.

[muon2]

The way I have done ward descriptions in IL would make Ward 1 read as follows:

A.  First Ward.  The first ward shall consist of that part of the City lying south and west of a line described as follows: Beginning at a point where a northwesterly extension projecting the center line of Warren Street intersects the northwesterly bounds of the City, and thence along said projection and the center line of Warren Street in a southeasterly direction to the center line of Worth Avenue, and thence along the center line of Worth Avenue in a southerly direction to a point at the southerly bounds of the City, said point being the terminus of the described line.

Note that this method of description relies on the non-necessity of repeating the boundary that is the corporate limit. It assumes that the corporate limits are well defined elsewhere. In IL it has the advantage of adjusting to future annexation changing the corporate limits, though that presumably is less of an issue in Hudson.

Columbia Turnpike intersected the city boundary when it was established as the ward boundary in 1854. Hudson later annexed the cemetery to the southeast, so that Columbia Turnpike is tangential to the new annexed area. This may have caused confusion which resulted in the Columbia triangle being flipped (though this was in part to the definition of Columbia Street being changed).

The  quartering definition like you used is currently used for the 1st and 2nd wards. The original ward division of Hudson was on 3rd street, dividing the city west and east.

When the 3rd and 4th wards were added in 1854, Warren was used to split the city north-south. So the 1st and 2nd wards are clearly* the southwest and northwest quadrants. For the 3rd and 4th it is more ambiguous since the Warren division did not go to the city limits. *Warren runs at 135 degrees, but is apparently considered to run East-West, likely since it is perpendicular to the Hudson River.

But with the new proposed boundaries, only Ward 1 is in two directions of its boundary lines.

At least one of the wards in my city starts as "That portion of the corporate area of the city lying south, east, north and west of a line which runs as follows:", so it works even when things aren't quartered. The sequence of the cardinal directions correspond to the order in which the ward is in that direction, thus the ward is south of the initial line segment, but ends up west of the line. In this case the ward is entirely enclosed by the line which ends at its beginning.

[jimrtex]

Here is a revised version which addresses the concern of a Ward 1 alderman about the block on the north side of State Street between 2nd and 3rd.



1   1286   +0.4%
2   1307   +2.1%
3   1250   -2.4%
4   1254   -2.1%
5   1306   +2.0%

Here is the racial/ethnic breakdown (VAP). Note LATFOR did not distinguish among the Hispanic population based on race.

   White   Hispanic   Black      Asian      Other
1   77.3%   4.0%   13.8%   3.3%   1.6%
2   33.0%   7.2%   43.8%   15.1%   0.9%
3   69.2%   8.2%   17.5%   3.1%   2.0%
4   58.7%   7.2%   24.8%   7.3%   1.9%
5   73.8%   4.8%   14.5%   4.7%   2.3%

It does a good job of preserving the core of the existing wards 1, 2, and 4. Ward 5 is so grossly overpopulated that it must shed about half the ward, but most of the population is in the portion of Ward 5 outside the street grid (ie northeastern Hudson). Ward 3 is currently a composite of two areas, which are split. New Ward 1 could considered to be the successor of both the existing Wards 1 and 3, while the New Ward 3 is largely a new district, shifted east and north/

Composition of wards:
Existing Ward 1 593

To Ward 2     130 (22% old)

Retained       463 (78% old, 36% new)

From Ward 2  137 (11% of new)
From Ward 3  686 (53% of new)

New Ward 1  1286 (Ward 3 53%, Ward 1 36%, Ward 2 11%)
Existing Ward 2 1477

To Ward 4 163 (11% of old)
To Ward 1 137 (9% of old)

Retained 1177 (80% of old, 90% of new)

From Ward 1 130 (10% of new)

New Ward 2 1307 (Ward 2 90%, Ward 1 10%)
Existing Ward 3 1142

To Ward 1 686 (60% of old)

Retained 456 (40% of old, 36% of new)

From Ward 5 794 (64% of new)

New Ward 3 1250 (Ward 5 64%, Ward 3 36%)
Existing Ward 4 801

To Ward 5 75 (9% of old)

Retained 726 (91% of old, 58% of new)

From Ward 2 163 (13% of new)
From Ward 5 365 (29% of new)

New Ward 4 1254 (Ward 4 58%, Ward 5 29%, Ward 2 13%)
Ward 5 2390

To Ward 3 794 (33% of old)
To Ward 4 365 (15%  of old)

Retained 1231 (52% of old, 94% of new)

From Ward 4 75 (6% of new)

New Ward 5 1306 (Ward 5 94%, Ward 4 6%)

[jimrtex]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

[Torie]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

I told the City clerk to ask for split census block totals from the census bureau in 2019, so Hudson will not need to do estimates in the future. The split blocks reflect the status quo, and I don't want the small wards to do anything but expand out, as part of a least change regime, and I don't want to cross Warren Street.

[jimrtex]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

I told the City clerk to ask for split census block totals from the census bureau in 2019, so Hudson will not need to do estimates in the future. The split blocks reflect the status quo, and I don't want the small wards to do anything but expand out, as part of a least change regime, and I don't want to cross Warren Street.

The Census Bureau only releases block data following the census. They only use visible feature, and political boundaries for defining census block boundaries. Before the 2010 census they did permit states to propose use of artificial boundaries for VTDs, which would in turn cause creation of a new census blocks, but explained that state law might not permit that. In New York, VTDs correspond to election districts, and state law strongly is opposed to election districts that an ordinary decent citizen can determine without special equipment.

Following the 2020 census you will likely have to come across Warren to maintain equal population wards.

[Torie]

The text of the proposed law is now all done. Once we resolve what has to be on the petition itself, and some alpha counsel who is an expert on these matters vets the text and tosses some holy water on it, we will be ready for our May 1 launch.

What is the constitutional or statutory basis for local initiative?

I came across some proposed constitutional amendments that would provide for both statewide and local initiatives, but none appear to have made it out of the legislature.
The estimates of the split block are estimates. Your actual deviation is probably greater. Did the city clerk provide error estimates? In the past, Hudson was stuck making estimates, but is it rational city policy to split blocks deliberately going forward?

I told the City clerk to ask for split census block totals from the census bureau in 2019, so Hudson will not need to do estimates in the future. The split blocks reflect the status quo, and I don't want the small wards to do anything but expand out, as part of a least change regime, and I don't want to cross Warren Street.

The Census Bureau only releases block data following the census. They only use visible feature, and political boundaries for defining census block boundaries. Before the 2010 census they did permit states to propose use of artificial boundaries for VTDs, which would in turn cause creation of a new census blocks, but explained that state law might not permit that. In New York, VTDs correspond to election districts, and state law strongly is opposed to election districts that an ordinary decent citizen can determine without special equipment.

Following the 2020 census you will likely have to come across Warren to maintain equal population wards.

Ah, whether the ward lines can be changed after the 2020 census is itself an interesting issue that I needed to fitness. Wheels, within wheels, within wheels.

And nobody knows how to frame the petition. The law is that much of a mess. So to be cautious, it will be full dress, as if a constitutional amendment to the state constitution. At least the AG's office reassured me, that the abstract will not be subject to their vetting (the actual law in unclear).