Gunman near UCSB kills 6 people, injures 7

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

In addition to all his videos, he has a 137 page manifesto. Someone could probably write a doctoral dissertation about this guy.

[MaxQue]

In addition to all his videos, he has a 137 page manifesto. Someone could probably write a doctoral dissertation about this guy.

I give it 40% odds of happening in the 10 next years. A thesis, most likely.

[MalaspinaGold]

Is Xahar ok?

[retromike22]

I just finished. The scariest moment was when he bought a gun and realized the significance of what he was planning.

I must say that his step mother was quite evil and his father very cold, if what he claims is true.

He does have a very sick race/money superiority complex.

I did not expect World of Warcraft to be mentioned so much.

[Mechaman]

Just read this entire thread.

Sweet baby carrot! This is one of the worst threads in history!  You guys realize you're going to hell, right?

Anyway, I won't say much except that I'll be keeping illegaloperation and others affected by this tragedy in my thoughts.  Because at the end of the day this is a tragedy and people died.  I'll refrain the urge, like many of you have given into, of viciously and viscerally demeaning largely non-violent segments of the American population for the time being.

I would say you should be ashamed of yourselves, but after five years here I think it's safe to say there is no shame left to be lost.

[Deus Naturae]

Just read this entire thread.

Sweet baby carrot! This is one of the worst threads in history!  You guys realize you're going to hell, right?

Anyway, I won't say much except that I'll be keeping illegaloperation and others affected by this tragedy in my thoughts.  Because at the end of the day this is a tragedy and people died.  I'll refrain the urge, like many of you have given into, of viciously and viscerally demeaning largely non-violent segments of the American population for the time being.

I would say you should be ashamed of yourselves, but after five years here I think it's safe to say there is no shame left to be lost.

What are you talking about? Who has been demeaned in this thread? MRA's?

[retromike22]

Just read this entire thread.

Sweet baby carrot! This is one of the worst threads in history!  You guys realize you're going to hell, right?

Anyway, I won't say much except that I'll be keeping illegaloperation and others affected by this tragedy in my thoughts.  Because at the end of the day this is a tragedy and people died.  I'll refrain the urge, like many of you have given into, of viciously and viscerally demeaning largely non-violent segments of the American population for the time being.

I would say you should be ashamed of yourselves, but after five years here I think it's safe to say there is no shame left to be lost.

What are you talking about? Who has been demeaned in this thread? MRA's?

I think he means World of Warcraft players.

[Mechaman]

Just read this entire thread.

Sweet baby carrot! This is one of the worst threads in history!  You guys realize you're going to hell, right?

Anyway, I won't say much except that I'll be keeping illegaloperation and others affected by this tragedy in my thoughts.  Because at the end of the day this is a tragedy and people died.  I'll refrain the urge, like many of you have given into, of viciously and viscerally demeaning largely non-violent segments of the American population for the time being.

I would say you should be ashamed of yourselves, but after five years here I think it's safe to say there is no shame left to be lost.

What are you talking about? Who has been demeaned in this thread? MRA's?

I would argue that everybody from those with mental health issues to gun owners to people who are unlucky sexually and everything in between were demeaned in some way.

Point is, I think it's wrong that we take a tragedy like this and we use it as a wedge to attack whole segments of the population.  IMO, this is like using an incident of a sexually abusive priest to strawman all Catholics as deranged pedophiles.

But of course, I'm not surprised you, and probably a large number of this forum, don't see that.

EDIT: And I'm saying this as somebody who is not at all a fan of "MRAs".

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Keep in mind that I say the following as a supporter of the right to bear arms.

Since as far as I am aware, no existing gun law was broken before he went on his shooting spree.  Nor were such laws broken in the case of Newtown.  So bringing out the canard that we need to enforce the existing laws before even daring to consider anything else is really really not helpful.  Now if you actually have something to say that pertains to this particular incident, please do so.  However, the enforce meme exists only to delay doing anything, and not just with gun issues.  So unless you have something relevant to say, either shut up or go on Fox News.

It is illegal for mentally-ill individuals to purchase firearms. This individual is clearly mentally ill. Therefore, we are not enforcing the laws we have on the books, and this is basically Jared Loughner Part II, though, we do not have a failed military psyche evaluation on Rodgers record.

When did this happen?

[Likely Voter]

Keep in mind that I say the following as a supporter of the right to bear arms.

Since as far as I am aware, no existing gun law was broken before he went on his shooting spree.  Nor were such laws broken in the case of Newtown.  So bringing out the canard that we need to enforce the existing laws before even daring to consider anything else is really really not helpful.  Now if you actually have something to say that pertains to this particular incident, please do so.  However, the enforce meme exists only to delay doing anything, and not just with gun issues.  So unless you have something relevant to say, either shut up or go on Fox News.

It is illegal for mentally-ill individuals to purchase firearms. This individual is clearly mentally ill. Therefore, we are not enforcing the laws we have on the books, and this is basically Jared Loughner Part II, though, we do not have a failed military psyche evaluation on Rodgers record.

When did this happen?

Not sure when it was made law, but Fed Law declares that any person who "has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution" cannot own a gun. However being in therapy and even having serious mental illness is not the same as "adjudicated as a mental defective"...that requires a court.


So to the point, it is not illegal for the mentally ill to purchase firearms, only for those so mentally ill they have been committed or a court has deemed them mentally ill...and there is a HUUUUGE difference. And even with that, background checks often do not catch even those who are legally banned from owning guns. ...case in point...http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/30/health/mental-illness-guns/

And of course any effort to make tighter restrictions on the definition of mentally ill or the robustness of background checks would be destroyed by the NRA as an attack on the 2nd Ammend and freedom and democracy and America and how dare you for even thinking of it, go back to Russia

[Snowstalker Mk. II]

>yfw when mentally ill people are on average less likely to harm others than the non-mentally ill

[AggregateDemand]

Do you propose having everyone who wants to buy a gun first go through a mental health exam and be proven to be 100% sane?  Shall we also require a new exam each time someone buys ammunition or another gun?  How about certificates from a psychiatrist to be allowed to attend a gun show?

No, but I think as a bear minimum requirement, the federal government could at least require all federal agencies to report to NICS. Hopefully the private sector will follow soon afterward.

There is no reason to impose new regulations on sane law-abiding people, if the government hasn't even taken the most basic steps to insure that Firearm Control 1968 is properly enforced.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Do you propose having everyone who wants to buy a gun first go through a mental health exam and be proven to be 100% sane?  Shall we also require a new exam each time someone buys ammunition or another gun?  How about certificates from a psychiatrist to be allowed to attend a gun show?

No, but I think as a bare minimum requirement, the federal government could at least require all federal agencies to report to NICS. Hopefully the private sector will follow soon afterward.

Hopefully?  Leaving aside the fact that your suggestion would have done nothing to prevent this particular incident, the idea that the private sector would voluntarily do as you suggest is so laughable that one must consider you either inhabit a libertarian fantasy land or—as is more likely since you sport a blue and not a yellow avatar—you simply don't want any additional gun regulation whatsoever under any circumstances.  I could respect someone who forthrightly put forward that opinion, especially since I'm dubious of additional regulation myself, but I can't respect someone who hides behind the weaselly "enforce the existing laws" meme even when the situation is not one in which better enforcing the existing laws would have accomplished anything.

[AggregateDemand]

Hopefully?  Leaving aside the fact that your suggestion would have done nothing to prevent this particular incident, the idea that the private sector would voluntarily do as you suggest is so laughable that one must consider you either inhabit a libertarian fantasy land or—as is more likely since you sport a blue and not a yellow avatar—you simply don't want any additional gun regulation whatsoever under any circumstances.  I could respect someone who forthrightly put forward that opinion, especially since I'm dubious of additional regulation myself, but I can't respect someone who hides behind the weaselly "enforce the existing laws" meme even when the situation is not one in which better enforcing the existing laws would have accomplished anything.

I meant hopefully private sector regulation will follow, after the federal reporting regs have been ironed out and tested.

Improperly written gun laws introduce the specter of more danger, like the AWB in 1994, which led to massive importation of pre-ban equipment and growth of gray markets gun shows. Arms dealers, particularly those of the anti-government militia persuasion, were made wealthy and powerful by ill-conceived gun control regulation. If you're writing gun legislation, pro or con, you're still dealing with firearms, and the unintended consequences could be deadly.

Why should I have to state the blatantly obvious to qualify my opinion? I'm not hiding behind "enforce the existing regulations". Refusing to enforce the mentally-ill restrictions have been the origin of most of our recent high profile shootings, though, enforcement could not have stopped Adam Lanza.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

>yfw when mentally ill people are on average less likely to harm others than the non-mentally ill

Just as to the point, are far more likely to be victims of violence than the non-mentally ill.

[Simfan34]

Cheng Yuan Hong, 20, George Chen, 19, and Weihan Wang, 20

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Why didn't this guy just hire a prostitute?

I kind of wondered that myself. Especially considering how rich and privileged he was, he could've easily afforded a pretty good looking escort as opposed to a drug addicted streetwalker.

Well actually though the answer is obvious, that's what a guy who was simply frustrated would do. This guy was clearly completely nuts, as if there was any doubt that little screed certainly proves it even moreso.

You are assuming that this was about sex, and when it's really about that sort of social status that 'being a Virgin at 22' implies. That, and, yes, the fact that he was 'crazy' (although its not exactly unusual to hear similar sentiments on some other parts of the Internet. Is there a shrine to him on Reddit yet?)

[Tetro Kornbluth]

The kid had Asperger syndrome and he very clearly suffered from other mental and emotional problems. The men's rights movement is a victimhood group first and foremost and it's very easy for a sexually frustrated guy to pick up on what they have to say. The blame on the killings lies firmly on himself, though. He could have maybe had an active romantic life if he devoted his time and resources into self-improvement rather than admiring himself in a classically narcissistic fashion and holding severe jealousy for those who've had better luck than him.

I know you are trying to be well meaning and sh-t but please.... stop. Just stop.

[ingemann]

Keep in mind that I say the following as a supporter of the right to bear arms.

Since as far as I am aware, no existing gun law was broken before he went on his shooting spree.  Nor were such laws broken in the case of Newtown.  So bringing out the canard that we need to enforce the existing laws before even daring to consider anything else is really really not helpful.  Now if you actually have something to say that pertains to this particular incident, please do so.  However, the enforce meme exists only to delay doing anything, and not just with gun issues.  So unless you have something relevant to say, either shut up or go on Fox News.

It is illegal for mentally-ill individuals to purchase firearms. This individual is clearly mentally ill. Therefore, we are not enforcing the laws we have on the books, and this is basically Jared Loughner Part II, though, we do not have a failed military psyche evaluation on Rodgers record.

Do this person have a diagnose outside asbergers? Because if not, no matter how clearly you think, he's mentally ill, he's not according to the law, as such no matter how much you enforced laws on the mentally ills, it wouldn't have stopped him from gettin guns.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Why should I have to state the blatantly obvious to qualify my opinion? I'm not hiding behind "enforce the existing regulations". Refusing to enforce the mentally-ill restrictions have been the origin of most of our recent high profile shootings, though, enforcement could not have stopped Adam Lanza.

What restriction was violated in this case?  Are you arguing that seeing a mental health professional for whatever reason should automatically disqualify one from owning a gun?  Yes, in hindsight, whoever he was seeing possibly could have done more, tho that assumes that the problems he evidenced when that professional saw him was something that should have caused him to be judged a danger to himself or others.

You keep bringing up something that has not been demonstrated, that this gunman's observed behavior before the shooting was indeed sufficient before he bought his weaponry that some existing regulation was violated and then wonder why I think you are hiding behind the "enforce the existing regulations" meme.

Improperly written gun laws introduce the specter of more danger, like the AWB in 1994, which led to massive importation of pre-ban equipment and growth of gray markets gun shows. Arms dealers, particularly those of the anti-government militia persuasion, were made wealthy and powerful by ill-conceived gun control regulation. If you're writing gun legislation, pro or con, you're still dealing with firearms, and the unintended consequences could be deadly.

I agree that any proposal needs to be carefully considered, but you've been arguing we don't need to consider anything right now except enforce existing laws when it hasn't even been shown that a refusal to do so was a contributing factor in this case.

[Хahar 🤔]

Cheng Yuan Hong, 20

He was in my English class in twelfth grade. Talking to him could be a little difficult because he was still learning the language and had a strong accent, but I remember doing a couple projects with him and he was an unfailingly pleasant person. It's sobering to hear about this.

[IceSpear]

I skimmed his manifesto, and probably the most glaring thing I realized (aside from the complete absence of self awareness) was that this guy never even asked a girl out. Yes, the guy who killed several people because of his supposed "endless rejection" never once got rejected. The most I remember was him smiling at a girl and saying "Hi". Maybe I missed something because I only skimmed it, but it truly is mindblowing.

[AggregateDemand]

What restriction was violated in this case?  Are you arguing that seeing a mental health professional for whatever reason should automatically disqualify one from owning a gun?  Yes, in hindsight, whoever he was seeing possibly could have done more, tho that assumes that the problems he evidenced when that professional saw him was something that should have caused him to be judged a danger to himself or others.

Rodger had a therapist. Last month, relatives called police to pay him a visit because they were worried about his mental condition. The man was mentally-ill. He purchased firearms. What extenuating circumstances are causing confusion? Granted, we don't know the timing of the therapy and the purchase, but it's somewhat moot at this point. The Isla Vista rampage is another example of government refusing to enforce Gun Control Act of 1968.

Personally, I don't think anyone in emotional or psychological therapy should be able to purchase firearms, particularly handguns, for a period of time. People diagnosed with schizophrenia or other serious mental-illnesses should not be able to purchase firearms at all.

The specific course of action is up to the executive branch; however, it seems quite obvious that society is enduring extraordinary cost by failing to enforce GSA 1968. I'm not sure how anyone could construe that postulate as hiding behind a legislative meme. Even after a member of Congress is shot in the head at point-blank by a man who failed a military psyche evaluation, the legislature still does nothing to make institutions report to NICS. The public doesn't seem to care about enforcing GCA 1968, though the mentally-ill jeopardize the 2nd Amendment (right) and the domestic tranquility (left). Even the NRA said that the mentally-ill provision is about the only part of GCA 1968 they support.

This isn't a meme. The lack of enforcement is a social calamity that the public ignores as quickly as possible so they can focus on tangential political totem, like universal background checks.

[Marokai Backbeat]

The NRA has also said they support background checks; guess what happens whenever people try to enforce them or enact them?

If you want the government to enforce something, you have to actually let the government make efforts to enforce it. It's like how the Right will often say "Look at how many taxes we have? We don't need to raise taxes; why can't we just enforce what we already have on the books!?" and then quietly work to undermine any effort to hire more people in the IRS so people can actually do just that. It's garbage. It's lies. If you want people to enforce the gun control laws already in effect in a harder fashion you need to hire more people (and hire the right people) to do so. If a bill was brought up specifically for that purpose it would get voted down as well.

[AggregateDemand]

The NRA has also said they support background checks; guess what happens whenever people try to enforce them or enact them?

If you want the government to enforce something, you have to actually let the government make efforts to enforce it. It's like how the Right will often say "Look at how many taxes we have? We don't need to raise taxes; why can't we just enforce what we already have on the books!?" and then quietly work to undermine any effort to hire more people in the IRS so people can actually do just that. It's garbage. It's lies. If you want people to enforce the gun control laws already in effect in a harder fashion you need to hire more people (and hire the right people) to do so. If a bill was brought up specifically for that purpose it would get voted down as well.

It's reasonable to allege conspiracy, when one party has something to gain. Please explain to us how these rampages by the mentally-ill are in the best interest of the NRA and gun-owners. Even the gun and ammo manufacturers, who usually benefit from a spike in demand after tragedies, are not particularly interested in this kind of political exposure.