Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl, imprisoned by Taliban in Afghanistan since 2009, is freed

[Joe Republic]

I just it is ridiculous that people think it is no big deal that a soldier deserted a counterinsurgency outpost.

When was his court martial?

[Never]

I just it is ridiculous that people think it is no big deal that a soldier deserted a counterinsurgency outpost.

When was his court martial?

I find it unnerving that people here are ignoring the word of our soldiers who were there in the same unit as Bergdahl and said that he did in fact desert, as in left, his post.

[Meursault]

And you were appointed to his tribunal?

This is an 'issue' only because of knee-jerk patriotardism. Nothing more.

[7,052,770]

I just it is ridiculous that people think it is no big deal that a soldier deserted a counterinsurgency outpost.

When was his court martial?

I find it unnerving that people here are ignoring the word of our soldiers who were there in the same unit as Bergdahl and said that he did in fact desert, as in left, his post.

How many soldiers have said he deserted? A couple? That's a very small sample of the soldiers who knew him.

Of course everyone else's silence doesn't necessarily mean he didn't desert, but there's no reason to automatically believe these few soldiers over everyone else's words, at least before hard facts are out.

[Never]

And you were appointed to his tribunal?

This is an 'issue' only because of knee-jerk patriotardism. Nothing more.

Your post is the epitome of hackishness.

Maybe Merriam-Webster
can help you understand what a deserter is:

"To abandon (military service) without leave"

intransitive verb

"To quit one's post, allegiance, or service without leave or justification; especially: to abandon military duty without leave and intent to return"

I don't need a tribunal to tell me that Bergdahl did in fact carry out the act of deserting.

[Meursault]

You need a tribunal to convict him of it, genius. And even then, "leaving him as a prisoner of war" isn't in the sentencing options.

You are offended because you want to be.

[Never]

I just it is ridiculous that people think it is no big deal that a soldier deserted a counterinsurgency outpost.

When was his court martial?

I find it unnerving that people here are ignoring the word of our soldiers who were there in the same unit as Bergdahl and said that he did in fact desert, as in left, his post.

How many soldiers have said he deserted? A couple? That's a very small sample of the soldiers who knew him.

Of course everyone else's silence doesn't necessarily mean he didn't desert, but there's no reason to automatically believe these few soldiers over everyone else's words, at least before hard facts are out.

I guess you don't place much value on personal witnesses. It wasn't just one soldier who criticized Bergdahl.

For example, if someone publicly murdered another person, how many witnesses does it take to prove the identity of that murder? 2, 5, 10, 100? Heck, what about five hundred? Do we need every single living person who served alongside Bergdahl in his unit to come out against him? If the accusations that these soldiers are throwing aren't true, wouldn't we expect at least one or two people to come forward and refute them?

[Never]

You need a tribunal to convict him of it, genius. And even then, "leaving him as a prisoner of war" isn't in the sentencing options.

You are offended because you want to be.

Whatever, since when did liberals like military tribunals anyway?!

[7,052,770]

I don't need a tribunal to tell me that Bergdahl did in fact carry out the act of deserting.

What? Yes you do. Maybe if there were some kind of indisputable proof out there you could conclude he deserted without any kind of trial, but the anecdotes of a very small percentage of the soldiers who met him is not nearly enough to be certain.

[Maxwell]

I like the whole Guilty til Proven innocent logic working here.

I know some people have come out, that doesn't mean its the case, and he could have serious mental health issues. Until we have all those facts out there, calling him a deserter is just unfounded.

[7,052,770]

I guess you don't place much value on personal witnesses. It wasn't just one soldier who criticized Bergdahl.

No, I don't. Who knows what the agenda of these few soldiers are. Maybe they're telling the truth, maybe they're lying, maybe they're bending the truth, maybe they think they're telling the truth but they're actually wrong, etc., etc.

The military can and will get to the bottom of this. We shouldn't rush to judgment based on the statements of a tiny fraction of the people who knew him 5 years ago.

[Meursault]

I have a thread in Individual Politics praising Benito Mussolini, you intellectual invertebrate. I am no liberal, in any use of the term.

[Never]

I don't need a tribunal to tell me that Bergdahl did in fact carry out the act of deserting.

What? Yes you do. Maybe if there were some kind of indisputable proof out there you could conclude he deserted without any kind of trial, but the anecdotes of a very small percentage of the soldiers who met him is not nearly enough to be certain.

Legally, I need that tribunal, but I don't have to quash belief in something because a ruling hasn't happened.

I like the whole Guilty til Proven innocent logic working here.

I know some people have come out, that doesn't mean its the case, and he could have serious mental health issues. Until we have all those facts out there, calling him a deserter is just unfounded.

We might already have facts. What about the Pentagon back in 2010, which reported that Bergdahl walked away from his unit?

Perhaps we already know what has happened, and people just refuse to believe it.

I have a thread in Individual Politics praising Benito Mussolini, you intellectual invertebrate. I am no liberal, in any use of the term.

Okay, so you're a fascist sympathizer, who praised someone aligned with Hitler? I don't see how that is supposed to improve your image, if that was your intent. You being a fascist really explains your stupid posts.

[Meursault]

And yet, oddly, your position (that deserters who "betray the nation" deserve the worst possible of fates) is more classically Hitlerite than my own.

You also support a concentration camp - Gitmo. I do not.

[Never]

And yet, oddly, your position (that deserters who "betray the nation" deserve the worst possible of fates) is more classically Hitlerite than my own.

You also support a concentration camp - Gitmo. I do not.

When did I specifically say that Bergdahl deserved the worst horrible fate? I am saying that once he is back in America, he probably deserves some type of punishment. At the very least, he should be demoted from the rank of Sergeant.

Guantanamo Bay is not a concentration camp. It is a prison in which we feed, clothe, and shelter terrorists. That prison is not perfect, but it isn't the next Holocaust.

[Never]

Not that it will change anyone's mind here, but Charles Krauthammer at the Washington Post did a write-up about Bergdahl, arguing that:

- Everyone negotiates with terrorists, and that we need to get over it.
- The Obama Administration disobeyed the law by not notifying Congress thirty days in advance of the Taliban-Bergdahl swap, though Congress seems hypocritical in developing a backbone at this point, since it has allowed the President to get away with so many other executive decisions that undermined the power of the legislature.
- Releasing five Taliban detainees for one American captive will endanger the nation, but the fact of the matter is that Americans value human life more than our enemies, so the uneven trade in particular wasn't unusual.
- It appears that Bergdahl was a deserter, but it is unclear whether he was a defector. If he were a defector, meaning that he actually became an active enemy instead of a captive, he would deserve death, but this judgment could be counteracted by recognition of the Stockholm Syndrome.
- Bergdahl should be tried and found guilty of desertion, based on the evidence at hand.
- The Obama Administration's initial celebratory mode after Bergdahl's release was unwarranted, as an action of this magnitude deserved a grimmer attitude.

[Joe Republic]

I am saying that now that he is back in America

What?  No he isn't.  Are you even following the details of this story?

[Never]

I am saying that now that he is back in America

What?  No he isn't.  Are you even following the details of this story?

To be fair, it is 3:00 a.m., but I'm really sorry for making that one mistake, and I am aware that Bergdahl is in Germany recuperating from captivity. I meant to write "Once he is back in America.", but at this point, I don't think anyone who disagrees with me on this thread can really see what I'm saying anyhow, so what does that one mistake in a post matter?

To answer your question, yes, I'm following the details of this story, but I'm not God. I make mistakes.

[Never]

@Joe Republic: You know what, it seems strange that you would take a jab at me when we have someone comparing me to Hitler on this thread, but that's just my opinion. I've always thought it demeaning to compare people expressing opinions to particular madmen.  I would expect a moderator to notice those kinds of things, though I am aware that you are not the moderator for this board, so it is not as if you can do much about anything here.

[Joe Republic]

Somebody compared you to Hitler?  Welcome to the internet.

Being called a fascist is like somebody in real life saying "you look tired".  It's annoying, but you get over it and move on.

[Never]

Somebody compared you to Hitler?  Welcome to the internet.

Being called a fascist is like somebody in real life saying "you look tired".  It's annoying, but you get over it and move on.

Point taken, but this same poster (Meursault) also seems anti-Semitic based on other posts. Is that acceptable on this forum?

[Landslide Lyndon]

Who is this Never troll?
Is he a new kind of fruitcake or just the reincarnation of an old acquaintance?

[Never]

Who is this Never troll?
Is he a new kind of fruitcake or just the reincarnation of an old acquaintance?

I'm new, and I'm not usually as much of a "troll" as I am being on this thread. I just have strong feelings on this particular topic.

EDIT: But wait, why am I being picked out as the troll on this topic? I see a few other ones here...

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

I really want to know if some of Bergdahl's critics here (Grumps and Riley) have ever served in the military? Because I have heard a lot of (potential) chickenhawking going on in this thread, and I say that as someone who really likes both posters.

Nice red herring, Sanchez.

Perhaps my family's long military background is prejudicing my posts here, but I doubt it matters, since a guy like Badger, whose family has a longer and more highly distinguished military background thinks I'm over the top.

Let me just sum it up here simply - 1) I believe the guys in his unit - real combat soldiers - who feel he deserted, and 2) I think the kid's dad is a Taliban sympathizer and has been since before his capture.

So I'm taking the word of active duty soldiers on the first and a hunch on the second......nothing that's not done here everyday, young friend.

[MalaspinaGold]

For a little bit of perspective, here is what some people in Berdahl's unit were saying:

Soldier one: "These people just want to be left alone."

Soldier two: "They got dicked with from the Russians for 17 years and then now we're here."

Soldier one: "Same thing in Iraq when I was there. These people just want to be left alone. Have their crops, weddings, stuff like that, that's it, man."

From Sean Smith, at The Guardian. Note that neither of these soldiers is Bergdahl, who would go missing days after Smith left.

It would be quite ironic if these soldiers were the ones slurring Bergdahl. Also, Never Convinced is giving off some major Barfbag vibes to me.