Man Accidentally Killed by Police Choke Hold in Staten Island
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  Man Accidentally Killed by Police Choke Hold in Staten Island
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Author Topic: Man Accidentally Killed by Police Choke Hold in Staten Island  (Read 8527 times)
ElectionsGuy
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« on: July 24, 2014, 09:59:59 PM »
« edited: July 24, 2014, 10:01:45 PM by ElectionsGuy »

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This is a few days old, but I didn't see it anywhere on here. A man who served almost no threat to the police other than to be left alone (if you watch the whole video) was treated as if he was a violent criminal. The choke hold was banned by the NYPD 20+ years ago, and a crime that wouldn't get you time in jail ordinarily cost him death. There is a investigation going on now, and hopefully this will never happen again and justice is carried out. RIP Eric Garner Sad
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« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2014, 10:33:57 PM »

His death was caused by NYCs asinine cigarette policy as much as it was by police brutality. I doubt the police would have bothered him, none the less wouldn't have murdered him in another city.
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bedstuy
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« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2014, 11:43:48 PM »

That's disgusting.  This is why people hate the police.

I didn't even know they enforce that law.  At the local bodegas in my neighborhood, people buy loosie cigarettes all the time.  In fact, I don't think I've ever seen someone buy a pack of cigarettes in my neighborhood.  That just goes to how capricious the law is in NYC.  We let a lot of stuff slide, like the basic non-enforcement of traffic law.  But, when a black person does something in front of these angry, racist redneck cops, look out.  We need to look at teaching the police force to treat our citizens as human beings and not their gladiatorial opponents. 

And, by the way, there's a good reason to ban loosie cigarettes.  It's a great preventative measure against smoking among poor folk.  A poor person isn't going to spend $13 for a pack of cigarettes.
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« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2014, 02:09:49 AM »

Why should only rich people be allowed to smoke?
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dead0man
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« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2014, 04:09:54 AM »

Three things caused this man's death:
A.the law about selling loose cigs
2.Mr. Garner not cooperating with the cops (he had been arrested several times before without resisting)
III.the chokehold
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Flake
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« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2014, 04:22:44 AM »

Three things caused this man's death:
A.the law about selling loose cigs
2.Mr. Garner not cooperating with the cops (he had been arrested several times before without resisting)
III.the chokehold

The only thing that caused his death was the chokehold. Why did they have to be brutal on some guy who's 400 pounds? What can he really do?

They were far too harsh and even when he was yelling "I can't breathe! I can't breathe!" they still kept him in that chokehold.
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2014, 04:25:24 AM »

These barbaric monsters should immediately be fired from the police and charged with murder.
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ingemann
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« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2014, 04:37:01 AM »

The moment you forced a fat guy down, his arms on his bag and he warn he can't breathe, the cops should have reacted. This is not the first time a fat man have died that way. The question is whether this is a result of lack of training or the cops ignoring their training. In the former case the state should be held responsable, in the latter case the cops should be held primary responsable (while the state should still pay reparations to the man's family).
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dead0man
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2014, 06:23:24 AM »
« Edited: July 25, 2014, 01:41:57 PM by dead0man »

The only thing that caused his death was the chokehold. Why did they have to be brutal on some guy who's 400 pounds? What can he really do?
He resisted arrest.  Cops can't let people go that physically resist arrest.

I agree that the law is dumb and the cop(s) acted poorly, but Mr Garner instigated the actions by resisting.
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Ray Goldfield
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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2014, 08:43:49 AM »

Autopsy reports indicate that he died of a heart attack, not due to injuries from the chokehold. Still, a gross violation of police procedure, and they should be fired and charged with excessive force.
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Badger
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« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2014, 12:24:50 PM »

The guy shouldn't have lost his life, but he bares more than a little responsibility for resisting arrest. He's a 400 lb man who died of a heart attack while physically resisting arrest. Again, not entirely unforeseeable.

Once the media aspect of the case is withdrawn, to me the issues are simply:

a) Did the police's use of force violate protocol, and if so to what degree? Again, the fact the police used physical force on a huge guy who was resisting arrest, and the obese guy died of a resulting heart attack is by NO means dispositive of the issue.

b) If yes, what impact, if any, did the deviation from procedure impact/cause the man's demise?

When cops are going to arrest someone who decides they don't want to go to jail that day, there HAS to be permissible options beyond simply repeating "pretty please with sugar on top?".
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AggregateDemand
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« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2014, 01:27:46 PM »

I sympathize with the man who died in custody. Police brutality is not something we can casually gloss over, but I'm not sure how we can make the police responsible for preserving the life of a man who was effectively committing suicide via gluttony.

If the suspect lacks the instinct of self-preservation, it seems a bit absurd to make law enforcement responsible for keeping him alive.
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2014, 01:42:52 PM »

These barbaric monsters should immediately be fired from the police and charged with murder.

>implying that pigs are ever held accountable
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Badger
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« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2014, 01:50:31 PM »

I sympathize with the man who died in custody. Police brutality is not something we can casually gloss over, but I'm not sure how we can make the police responsible for preserving the life of a man who was effectively committing suicide via gluttony.

If the suspect lacks the instinct of self-preservation, it seems a bit absurd to make law enforcement responsible for keeping him alive.

Your "sympathy" is underwhelming, even appalling.
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AggregateDemand
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« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2014, 02:05:27 PM »

Your "sympathy" is underwhelming, even appalling.

Your self-serving slacktivism is propelling America to new heights.
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Badger
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« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2014, 02:20:49 PM »

Your "sympathy" is underwhelming, even appalling.

Your self-serving slacktivism is propelling America to new heights.

Sig material.
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Badger
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« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2014, 02:23:06 PM »

These barbaric monsters should immediately be fired from the police and charged with murder.

>implying that pigs are ever held accountable

> X 1000 A-holes who call cops "pigs".

> X 1,000,000 The same coming from white college-age Marxists "fighting the power".
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Badger
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« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2014, 02:25:46 PM »

Your "sympathy" is underwhelming, even appalling.

Your self-serving slacktivism is propelling America to new heights.

Oh what the hell. Against my better judgment, explain yourself.

Seriously, as usual no one has a clue what you're trying to say.
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ingemann
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« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2014, 02:48:40 PM »

I sympathize with the man who died in custody. Police brutality is not something we can casually gloss over, but I'm not sure how we can make the police responsible for preserving the life of a man who was effectively committing suicide via gluttony.

If the suspect lacks the instinct of self-preservation, it seems a bit absurd to make law enforcement responsible for keeping him alive.


I guess the day someone kill you, we will say that it was a case of suicide via being an a**hole. This guy likely had at least +15-20 year life expectancy ahead of him, to suggest that the enforcer of the state, have no responsibility for looking at a guy they arrest and think "we better be careful we don't kill him", is blindblowing. What you suggest are that the police should have a right to kill anybody they feel like killing.
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Simfan34
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« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2014, 03:23:25 PM »

The only thing that caused his death was the chokehold. Why did they have to be brutal on some guy who's 400 pounds? What can he really do?
He resisted arrest.  Cops can't let people go that physically resist arrest.

I agree that the law is dumb and the cop(s) acted poorly, but Mr Garner instigated the actions by resisting.

This sounds right. Also, cigarettes are expensive for a reason. AggregateDemand is on to something in pointing out that he would have had an untimely death one way or another.
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2014, 05:43:59 PM »

These barbaric monsters should immediately be fired from the police and charged with murder.

>implying that pigs are ever held accountable

Thanks for your valuable insight.
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AggregateDemand
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« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2014, 05:55:50 PM »

Oh what the hell. Against my better judgment, explain yourself.

Seriously, as usual no one has a clue what you're trying to say.

Nothing. I'm just accusing you of paying lip-service to the politically-correct cause to bolster your own image. Standard ad hominem internet rebuttal, like accusing people of being uncouth or stone-hearted.
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AggregateDemand
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« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2014, 06:05:05 PM »
« Edited: July 25, 2014, 07:26:51 PM by AggregateDemand »

This sounds right. Also, cigarettes are expensive for a reason. AggregateDemand is on to something in pointing out that he would have had an untimely death one way or another.

His future was uncertain. My point is that the cause of death is directly attributable to his own self-neglect and his choice to resist arrest (assuming he actually did resist arrest). Can we really expect officers to preserve the lives of citizens, who are inadvertently killing themselves?

The possibility of excessive force via choke-hold, seems unrelated to the man's death.
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patrick1
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« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2014, 06:38:12 PM »

This sounds right. Also, cigarettes are expensive for a reason. AggregateDemand is on to something in pointing out that he would have had an untimely death one way or another.

His future was uncertain. My point is that the cause of death is directly attributable to his own self-neglect and his choice to resist arrest (assuming he actually did resist arrest). Can we really expect officers to preserve the life of citizens, who are inadvertently killing themselves?

The possibility of excessive force via choke-hold, seems unrelated to the man's death.

...wtf, is this a joke?
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Badger
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« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2014, 07:28:32 PM »

Oh what the hell. Against my better judgment, explain yourself.

Seriously, as usual no one has a clue what you're trying to say.

Nothing. I'm just accusing you of paying lip-service to the politically-correct cause to bolster your own image. Standard ad hominem internet rebuttal, like accusing people of being uncouth or stone-hearted.

Did you even read my post just a couple above yours? Or did you fail to perceive it in your characteristic monomania?

Dude, I actualy generally AGREE with you that the guy may've to a significant degree brought this on himself and his obesity may've contributed to his death. But the difference is I have enough empathy to realize the guy had a family who mouns his loss, and his weight isn'tt grounds to think "ah, the fat slob was on borrowed time anyway".

I'm not out to win any popularity contests here, sport., but I'm more than willing to call you out on brazen sociopathy.
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