St Louis police murder scandal (PLUS: riots, idiotic press conferences, etc.)
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  St Louis police murder scandal (PLUS: riots, idiotic press conferences, etc.)
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Author Topic: St Louis police murder scandal (PLUS: riots, idiotic press conferences, etc.)  (Read 45695 times)
J. J.
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« Reply #300 on: August 19, 2014, 08:10:24 PM »

Btw, both the City of Ferguson's as well as the St. Louis County's official websites have been offline for a couple of days now due to a suspected Anonymous hacks.

http://www.fergusoncity.com/

http://www.stlouisco.com/

The State of Missouri, the Missouri National Guard, and the City of St. Louis are still there though.

I was on both yesterday. 
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dead0man
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« Reply #301 on: August 19, 2014, 11:44:46 PM »

It's quite obvious there was a robbery at the store, otherwise why would he be shoving the owner like that? Just for fun? That is even worse. And it's not as if he was underage and couldn't buy those legally. Maybe he didn't have his ID on him and still wanted the cigars, in which case that is even more idiotic.

I read that the store owner only walked out from behind the counter because he was upset that Michael Brown had reached over the counter for his cigars. Perhaps Brown was irritated that he had been called out on this, and was shoved.

In fact, there's a video of Michael Brown actually paying for the cigars, with the cashier visibly handling the money he was given.
Get off Tumblr bro.  They DID steal the cigars, his buddy has confirmed it and did so almost a week ago.  THIS IS A CITE!!!!!111one.  Here comes a quote from that cite
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dead0man
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« Reply #302 on: August 19, 2014, 11:54:32 PM »

I don't have the playbook you guys are using, but I think you're supposed to ignore the above and show pictures of white guys with guns again...maybe add some ignorance like "THEY USING BIPLANES ON THE PEACEFUL PROTESTORS NOW!?!?" or try and explain how the rioting really isn't rioting because they have an excuse.


or the always popular "attack the poster who disagrees with you with insults because you're not smart enough to discuss things with people you disagree with".
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J. J.
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« Reply #303 on: August 20, 2014, 03:48:12 AM »
« Edited: August 20, 2014, 03:49:45 AM by J. J. »

I don't have the playbook you guys are using, but I think you're supposed to ignore the above and show pictures of white guys with guns again...maybe add some ignorance like "THEY USING BIPLANES ON THE PEACEFUL PROTESTORS NOW!?!?" or try and explain how the rioting really isn't rioting because they have an excuse.


or the always popular "attack the poster who disagrees with you with insults because you're not smart enough to discuss things with people you disagree with".

I think there is a lot of that on this thread.  Sad

I do empathize with the police in the riot situation, at least since Johnson took over.  Look at some of the police rushing in situations.  Yes, they are mobbing one individual, but that individual is one who did something like throw something.  The are not doing with the people that were peacefully protesting standing one or two feet away.  When the get the single individual, they are not clubbing him with nightsticks, or punching him, but immobilizing him, holding him and then arresting him. 

Now the assault vehicles and rubber bullets were wrong, but Johnson seems to have some idea how to do this.  So do most of the protestors.
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Deus Naturae
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« Reply #304 on: August 20, 2014, 08:41:50 AM »

Pentagon defends 1033 program.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #305 on: August 20, 2014, 12:35:31 PM »

Breaking now: Alert media. Safe house - St Marks Missionary Church 9950 Glen Owen Dr. in St Louis. Home of medical and healing center being raided by police. Please retweet and share. #ferguson

Breaking now: #ferguson St. marks Missionary Church - home of medical triage and healing for community currently being raided by police.
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Chancellor Tanterterg
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« Reply #306 on: August 20, 2014, 12:46:08 PM »

Breaking now: Alert media. Safe house - St Marks Missionary Church 9950 Glen Owen Dr. in St Louis. Home of medical and healing center being raided by police. Please retweet and share. #ferguson

Breaking now: #ferguson St. marks Missionary Church - home of medical triage and healing for community currently being raided by police.

Unclear if that's a hoax or not from what I'm seeing.
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Queen Mum Inks.LWC
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« Reply #307 on: August 20, 2014, 03:31:19 PM »

The willingness to throw due process aside when some on this site think a cop did something wrong is frightening. Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #308 on: August 20, 2014, 03:38:44 PM »

Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.

nothing, nothing at all, you underdeveloped neo-Platonist?
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #309 on: August 20, 2014, 03:51:25 PM »

fact is, blacks have NEVER had anything approaching a fair shake in the criminal justice realm.  particularly not in the south; I don't even think we need to discuss pre-1965.  since then it's a more complicated realm of oppression that has taken over via a synthesis of drug laws, several moves by the Supreme Court to weaken the power of the 4th Amendment, racially disparate on-the-ground policing tactics (a very small part of which is explained by the concentration of blacks in urban ghettos, to be fair), the high cost of access to legal services, and the "Trial Tax" that effectively forces even those who believe themselves to be innocent to plead guilty/no contest.  it's no coincidence that incarceration rates have skyrocketed since the implementation of civil rights law and the end of lynching as a tactic of state terrorism.

as a result there's a constant tinder of black resentment, anger, whatever you want to call it and a white cop pouring bullets into a black teen provides the propane.
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Queen Mum Inks.LWC
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« Reply #310 on: August 20, 2014, 03:54:48 PM »

Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.

nothing, nothing at all, you underdeveloped neo-Platonist?

I would argue that there's not.  That mentality has led to the absolute decay in appreciation for due process.  And that decay has led to rulings like Hamdi v. Rumsfeld which should scare every American.  The Nancy Graces of the world have done 10 times more harm than good.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #311 on: August 20, 2014, 04:31:29 PM »

Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.

nothing, nothing at all, you underdeveloped neo-Platonist?

I would argue that there's not.  That mentality has led to the absolute decay in appreciation for due process.  And that decay has led to rulings like Hamdi v. Rumsfeld which should scare every American.  The Nancy Graces of the world have done 10 times more harm than good.

you have your cause-effect wrong.  state power conditions the commercial media, not the other way around.
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Queen Mum Inks.LWC
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« Reply #312 on: August 20, 2014, 04:33:31 PM »

Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.

nothing, nothing at all, you underdeveloped neo-Platonist?

I would argue that there's not.  That mentality has led to the absolute decay in appreciation for due process.  And that decay has led to rulings like Hamdi v. Rumsfeld which should scare every American.  The Nancy Graces of the world have done 10 times more harm than good.

you have your cause-effect wrong.  state power conditions the commercial media, not the other way around.

It's not just the media. It's most Americans. The media certainly hasn't helped, but this problem has been snowballing for years.
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Miamiu1027
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« Reply #313 on: August 20, 2014, 04:37:02 PM »

Nothing has done more to weaken our judicial system than those who seek to obtain guilty verdicts from the court of public opinion.

nothing, nothing at all, you underdeveloped neo-Platonist?

I would argue that there's not.  That mentality has led to the absolute decay in appreciation for due process.  And that decay has led to rulings like Hamdi v. Rumsfeld which should scare every American.  The Nancy Graces of the world have done 10 times more harm than good.

you have your cause-effect wrong.  state power conditions the commercial media, not the other way around.

It's not just the media. It's most Americans. The media certainly hasn't helped, but this problem has been snowballing for years.

and where do most Americans get their picture of the world from?  commercial media.
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #314 on: August 20, 2014, 05:41:15 PM »

Apparently this Robert McCulloch guy's entire family has been police, his father was a police officer who was killed by a black suspect, and he wanted to be a cop before he lost his leg due to cancer. But I'm sure he'll do a great job and definitely won't do everything in his power to ensure that the grand jury doesn't return an indictment. Roll Eyes
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #315 on: August 20, 2014, 07:22:56 PM »

Also it looks like the St. Louis police murdered another black guy yesterday and are already lying about it: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/20/kajieme-powell-shooting_n_5696546.html?1408579745&ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067
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Chancellor Tanterterg
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« Reply #316 on: August 20, 2014, 08:09:34 PM »


Holy f!ck Shocked
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Sbane
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« Reply #317 on: August 20, 2014, 09:19:59 PM »


This is absolutely ridiculous. Who wants to defend this now? Do we not have all the facts on this one either? Why do we condone murder by the police?
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dead0man
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« Reply #318 on: August 20, 2014, 10:34:49 PM »


This is absolutely ridiculous. Who wants to defend this now? Do we not have all the facts on this one either? Why do we condone murder by the police?
The dude did have a knife, he was walking up to the cops, he did just steal sh**t, he was literally asking for the cops to shoot him and his actions were showing that it wasn't just words.  Ok, he wasn't 3 or 4 feet away...he was 5 or 6 feet away (kind of hard to tell at the angle and distance...could be as far as 10 feet I suppose)...how close does an armed crazy guy need to get to a cop before it's ok to shoot him?
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #319 on: August 20, 2014, 10:43:34 PM »

You do know that there are interactions that cops are able to have with people that don't include shooting them to death right?
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True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
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« Reply #320 on: August 20, 2014, 10:45:58 PM »


This is absolutely ridiculous. Who wants to defend this now? Do we not have all the facts on this one either? Why do we condone murder by the police?

The facts indicate that this was suicide by cop, i.e., the guy was forcing the cops to shoot him.
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Sbane
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« Reply #321 on: August 20, 2014, 10:46:49 PM »


This is absolutely ridiculous. Who wants to defend this now? Do we not have all the facts on this one either? Why do we condone murder by the police?
The dude did have a knife, he was walking up to the cops, he did just steal sh**t, he was literally asking for the cops to shoot him and his actions were showing that it wasn't just words.  Ok, he wasn't 3 or 4 feet away...he was 5 or 6 feet away (kind of hard to tell at the angle and distance...could be as far as 10 feet I suppose)...how close does an armed crazy guy need to get to a cop before it's ok to shoot him?

Closer than where he was. The problem with the police is that they know they are not going to be accountable for their actions and so they do whatever they feel like. Just because you have been given the authority to shoot to kill when the situation warrants it, that does not mean you don't have the responsibility of avoiding that situation to the best of your ability (even if it is waiting a second longer). The guy deserved to be in a mental institution (aka jail in America), not dead.
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Lief 🗽
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« Reply #322 on: August 20, 2014, 10:48:42 PM »
« Edited: August 20, 2014, 11:20:21 PM by ℒief »

It's not the cops' job to indulge mentally ill people's desires to commit suicide. Shooting someone to death should be absolutely the last resort. The fact that they showed up and shot the guy multiple times to death ten seconds later is a complete failure of policing.

Of course the fact that they are lying about the entire situation, to make it seem like he was more threatening than he was, already belies the assertion that they were acting appropriately.
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Sbane
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« Reply #323 on: August 20, 2014, 11:13:02 PM »

Oh yeah, them lying about it might be even worse than the shooting itself. What are your thoughts on that Dead0man? When you give the police the license to do what they want without oversight, they will abuse it. It's just human nature.
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dead0man
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« Reply #324 on: August 20, 2014, 11:24:32 PM »


This is absolutely ridiculous. Who wants to defend this now? Do we not have all the facts on this one either? Why do we condone murder by the police?
The dude did have a knife, he was walking up to the cops, he did just steal sh**t, he was literally asking for the cops to shoot him and his actions were showing that it wasn't just words.  Ok, he wasn't 3 or 4 feet away...he was 5 or 6 feet away (kind of hard to tell at the angle and distance...could be as far as 10 feet I suppose)...how close does an armed crazy guy need to get to a cop before it's ok to shoot him?

Closer than where he was. The problem with the police is that they know they are not going to be accountable for their actions and so they do whatever they feel like. Just because you have been given the authority to shoot to kill when the situation warrants it, that does not mean you don't have the responsibility of avoiding that situation to the best of your ability (even if it is waiting a second longer). The guy deserved to be in a mental institution (aka jail in America), not dead.
Didn't I just hear that a cop was suspended?  Police officer suspended for pointing rifle at protesters, threatening them

They could have Tazered him, but those aren't as foolproof as a 9mm.  (there are a million youtubes of dudes not reacting at all to Tazers) Especially when dealing with someone acting a bit nutty.  They could have whipped out their billy clubs and attempted to beat the sh**t out of him, but that's how cops get killed.  Cops don't have to risk their lives (and I'm 95% sure the Supremes have backed them up on this, but my Google Fu seems a bit off tonight) to detain an armed crazy guy.
Oh yeah, them lying about it might be even worse than the shooting itself. What are your thoughts on that Dead0man? When you give the police the license to do what they want without oversight, they will abuse it. It's just human nature.
I agree with you.  I think every cop should have the "hat cam" things, it should be as standard as handcuffs and a sidearm.  The tech is there, obviously, and if bought in huge numbers, probably not all that expensive.  A cop could easily have 3 on him and each car should at least have 4, one pointing in each direction.  Like you said, without oversight, certain people will abuse their authority.  If every cop knows every action he/she takes is being watched (or at least will be watched if something actually happens) nearly every cop is going to do sh**t as by the book as he/she can.  With the added benefit of backing up the cop's story when they are right.
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