St Louis police murder scandal (PLUS: riots, idiotic press conferences, etc.)

[dead0man]

Wot, no thread?

Yeah, I've been wondering when this one was going to pop up.

[dead0man]

This whole situation is quite disturbing.

Given the violence that occurred the other night, law enforcement has a responsibility to be there and ready to preserve the peace.  However, their actions against peaceful protests are making circumstances less peaceful.

Its sad when you turn on Al Jazeera and they have heavily armed officials in military regalia firing tear gas and intimidating a peaceful crowd... and you realize this isn't Egypt or Iran, its Missouri.

and not even BFE Missouri, but St.Louis funking County.

[dead0man]

Operators have been answering the phone, directing racial slurs at those asking what is going on, and hanging up.

Is there a source to verify this? As horrible as its gone, the optimist in me is inclined to believe that things haven't gotten this bad.

https://38.media.tumblr.com/91d051e5b698f1d32d8543ab3723389f/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo1_1280.jpg
https://38.media.tumblr.com/244013aa1b434ecacfc87ff5be0e11ff/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo2_1280.jpg
https://31.media.tumblr.com/818ada20a8a01443638dd242854f3f66/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo3_1280.jpg
https://38.media.tumblr.com/94808cfec0d6a09bcfe181c5b21d6556/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo4_1280.jpg
https://38.media.tumblr.com/267078f024be8c4eef3be29b97159619/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo5_1280.jpg
https://31.media.tumblr.com/a475b963b455f131bc7c95f1ea945319/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo6_1280.jpg
https://38.media.tumblr.com/26ff87f765c3e3a74f83d7bf5c2def65/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo7_1280.jpg
https://31.media.tumblr.com/75a21934d15acc4bfa12b958d042f8e3/tumblr_naa8iuS5qq1r2dmgzo8_1280.jpg

Lets try again, is their a source for this that is:
A.a real source
B.in English

[dead0man]

The real question wasn't asked here yet.

What is Jay Nixon doing?! It's his job to manage that!

You want him to call in the NG to stop the rioters?  I'm not sure that would help deescalate the situation.

[dead0man]

Lets try again, is their a source for this that is:
A.a real source
B.in English

Let me get this straight

You want me to find a news article about how black people are being racially attacked while calling the Ferguson Police.

Alright.

k

The real question wasn't asked here yet.

What is Jay Nixon doing?! It's his job to manage that!

You want him to call in the NG to stop the rioters?  I'm not sure that would help deescalate the situation.

How about calling in the NG to stop the Ferguson police?

That would be interesting...seems unlikely though.

[dead0man]

It seems like it would be stupid easy to prove one way or the other too....hell, you, I or even R2 could pick up the phone and make the call and see how they act.  Hell, do your best "black" voice for effect.

[dead0man]

Does anyone have the most factually accurate version of the story surrounding Michael Brown's death?

I really doubt we ever will.  We've got the word of the dead man's buddy, you've got to take with a grain of salt.  And we'v got the word of the cops, also must take with salt.  There will be some hard evidence that will come out, number of times the man was shot, number of shots fired, direction and distance, etc and they will point towards the validity of one side or the other (or both), but they will only paint part of the picture.  We've got a couple of things that both sides agree on:the men were walking in the street, the cops told them to get out of the street, they didn't, words were exchanged, then a scuffle, but still not a complete picture.


One of the main things I've taken from this and the fat man dying in NYC a couple of weeks ago is that we've got to get some of these pansy ass laws off the books.  Illegal to sell a single cig?  STUPID!  Walking in the street shouldn't be something a cop can hassle you over, walk at your own risk dumbasses.  The cop can suggest you not do that, just like any other wise person would suggest, but it shouldn't be a law.

[dead0man]

It's the only one I've read.  I know some people came around as it was unfolding, but AFAIK, they didn't see the whole thing and what they report would come with salt too.  Less salt than the cops or the buddy, but still salt.

[dead0man]

Too bad the Ferguson police don't have mandatory dashboard cameras in cop cars...

Omaha, as of last year at least, only had functioning cameras in their K9 cars due to lack of funds*.


*we've got pension issues.

[dead0man]

Indeed, Hannity can't know what it's like to be young male and black in America.  This guy does though.

[dead0man]

But the police and army are in general a cesspool for far-right white extremists (not just in the US).

That's not true in the US.  The far-right white power guys here hate the govt.

[dead0man]

But the police and army are in general a cesspool for far-right white extremists (not just in the US).

That's not true in the US.  The far-right white power guys here hate the govt.

Oh, it is true (especially in the US).

Take a look at this documentary about the US border patrol and how they sniper to death unarmed Mexican kids from their control posts on the wall between the US/Mexico border:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYmnngW3Zgo#t=9m01s

I have made the video start at the relevant section.

Your cite that police and the Army in the us is a cesspool for far right white extremists is an Al Jazeera documentary on the US Border Patrol (that isn't even available on the US youtube I might add)?  Odd.

[dead0man]

But the police and army are in general a cesspool for far-right white extremists (not just in the US).

That's not true in the US.  The far-right white power guys here hate the govt.

From what I can tell the Ferguson police chief (who is thankfully not in command now), is a far-right white extremist.

That's quite possible, I haven't argued that there are NO white extremists in the Army or acting as cops.  I'm saying it's not prevalent.  The Army specifically not.

[dead0man]

Is it good news or bad news that the attorneys for the dead man's family can't spell (or use a spell check on a press release)?  All three (3!) of them.

[dead0man]

Why are they still rioting?  I guess I can understand the argument in the first days (to get media attention....wrong, of course, but understandable), but at this point it seems VERY counterproductive.

[dead0man]

Don't forget that the robbery video was released due to a FOI request. The police department likely wouldn't want to release it otherwise, since it's too weak to be evidence but strong enough to raise tensions.

They didn't want to release it because there is/was still an investigation going on, that is normal protocol.

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He wasn't running away from the cops, he was running back TO the cops.  link

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What I'm guessing happened is this:
1.Mr Brown and his buddy steal some little cigars, store owner confronts them, he physically hassles/threatens the store owner
2.Mr. Brown and buddy leave store
3.several cops are called to the area
4.one of the cop cars (an SUV) sees Brown and buddy walking down the street and asks them to get out of the street
5.Brown assumes that these cops are here to bust him so tries to not get caught, he does that by trying to make sure the cops can't get out of the car
6.when he realizes that ain't going to work he tries to run
7.when he realizes THAT's not going to work he tries to go after the cops again
8.the cops shoot him as he's running towards them
9.everybody freaks out

Yes, these are not the actions of a rational man, which makes me think he was probably high on goofballs.

All just a guess, but it's much more likely than the version of what most people seem to assume what happened.  I'm not saying the cops made no mistakes, then or afterwords.  I'm saying it's ridiculous to freak out, assume the worst before the evidence is in or the investigation is complete.

[dead0man]

Can anyone explain why lethal force would be justifiable even if the accusations are true? Not seeing how any sane person could believe that.

Even if a 6'4" 300lb man is running directly at a cop with his gun drawn?  Not 10 seconds after he had physically attacked a cop.  That seems 100% justified.  If he was running away, I will agree with you, but the evidence isn't really pointing that way.

[dead0man]

"and the dude started running, coming towards the cops"

I'm pretty sure the bystander would have mentioned if he was trying to surrender...plus, that's not how one surrenders.  It seems you guys WANT the cop to have murdered this guy more than you want the truth.

[dead0man]

"and the dude started running, coming towards the cops"

I'm pretty sure the bystander would have mentioned if he was trying to surrender...plus, that's not how one surrenders.  It seems you guys WANT the cop to have murdered this guy more than you want the truth.

So you believe that dude and think everyone who said he had his hands up is lying?

That guy didn't know this was going to be the next "big race story of the month" at the time, he was just an eyewitness telling his story to a buddy a minute after the sh**t went down.  I don't know why he would lie in that situation.  I also don't know who the "everyone" is, most people saying he had his hands up are just parroting the thing that makes Mr Brown look the best.  They're not lying, they are (probably) just missinformed, just like all of us where in the first few days.  As more and more evidence comes out, the "gentle giant" narrative looks more and more silly.

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Maybe.

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Agreed.  Maybe hopped up on goofballs.

[dead0man]

Anonymous comments in a youtube video are probably admissible in court, right?

I'm not suggesting that as we're not in a court of law, just the court of public opinion.  Why do you think the guy would LIE in that situation though?  Seems much more likely that he was telling the truth as he saw it.

[dead0man]

So you're saying everybody else is lying? That they all got together and concocted a story, or all came up with it on their own?

I don't know who is lying, even if my theory (note, I'm not saying I know the whole truth, but I'm looking it for it and I'm not coming from the assumption that the cop is guilty, like most people always seem to in situations like this.  I'm also not saying you or Sbane are making that mistake.) is true, most people saying that wouldn't be lying, they'd be misinformed.

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You're putting words (barreling) into my mouth.

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It seems like the guy would have said it differently in tone and words if Mr Brown looked to be surrendering...have you listened to the video?

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He made some choices that a normal sober person wouldn't tend to make and I'm not the only one wondering the status of the guy's head at the time the sh**t went down.  "hopped up on goofballs" is a colloquialism for someone appearing to be on some kind of drug.  Usually used in a "jokey" way.  

[dead0man]

Well at least you noticed the important part.

[dead0man]

Again, I'm not saying it's "the gospel truth" that's you, again, putting words in my mouth.

[dead0man]

Possibly and they are just as wrong as the people on the other side that knew the cops were murderers before the evidence was in.

[dead0man]

I still don't understand why they are still rioting.  If the evidence points that the cop was in the wrong and the investigations conclude otherwise, I could understand it (rioting would still be wrong), but for now it just looks stupid and serves no good purpose.


I also saw a dude with a gas mask on with no filter, I'd like to know what went through his head when his gear did nothing.