Jennifer Lawrence and many other celebrities...

[Gustaf]

A part of me wants to feel sorry of them, but another part of me thinks it serves them right and they shouldn't have taken the pictures in the first place.

Please elaborate on which consensual sexual acts you believe women should and should not do, Obamanation.

Whatever they want to do, let them do it. Like I said, I'm conflicted about this.

Obamanation is sexist again? STOP THE PRESSES!

[Gustaf]

A " weird midsection"... " bit boxy"... "on her way to having weight problems"... what is wrong with you people? Perhaps this is the sexist patriarchy the angry people are always going on about.

Dudes discussing women in a male-dominated environment is sexist now?  I thought it was a normal thing guys just do.  Women discuss the physical attractiveness of men all the time!  And didn't I say she had killer t1ts and a beautiful face?

Sentence 1: No, you didn't get it
Sentence 2: lol
Sentence 3: you're still not getting it
Sentence 4: wow, didn't know it was possible to miss the point THIS much. And why self-censor tits? I have no speech.

[Gustaf]

A " weird midsection"... " bit boxy"... "on her way to having weight problems"... what is wrong with you people? Perhaps this is the sexist patriarchy the angry people are always going on about.

Dudes discussing women in a male-dominated environment is sexist now?  I thought it was a normal thing guys just do.  Women discuss the physical attractiveness of men all the time!  And didn't I say she had killer t1ts and a beautiful face?

Sentence 1: No, you didn't get it
Sentence 2: lol
Sentence 3: you're still not getting it
Sentence 4: wow, didn't know it was possible to miss the point THIS much. And why self-censor tits? I have no speech.

No, Gustaf, youre just a boring prick who likes to stand on your little cloud of judgment passing life lessons out to all the sinners.  Go ahead and report that.

I don't report a great many posts, I'm not like Opebo and those other cry babies.

And I think you once again, like other Atlas misogynists, conflate dislike of sexism with dislike of sex. They're very different things and you would probably get more of the latter if you weren't so enamoured with the former.

I'm certainly more of a sinner than a prude and have very little of a judgmental attitude in this realm.

[Gustaf]

A " weird midsection"... " bit boxy"... "on her way to having weight problems"... what is wrong with you people? Perhaps this is the sexist patriarchy the angry people are always going on about.

Dudes discussing women in a male-dominated environment is sexist now?  I thought it was a normal thing guys just do.  Women discuss the physical attractiveness of men all the time!  And didn't I say she had killer t1ts and a beautiful face?

Sentence 1: No, you didn't get it
Sentence 2: lol
Sentence 3: you're still not getting it
Sentence 4: wow, didn't know it was possible to miss the point THIS much. And why self-censor tits? I have no speech.

No, Gustaf, youre just a boring prick who likes to stand on your little cloud of judgment passing life lessons out to all the sinners.  Go ahead and report that.

I don't report a great many posts, I'm not like Opebo and those other cry babies.

And I think you once again, like other Atlas misogynists, conflate dislike of sexism with dislike of sex. They're very different things and you would probably get more of the latter if you weren't so enamoured with the former.

I'm certainly more of a sinner than a prude and have very little of a judgmental attitude in this realm.

I'm sorry, I'm not a misogynist or enamored with sexism because I talk about the physical appearance of women with other men.  If it makes me a misogynist in someone else's book, fine, but that's not something I'm going to feel guilty about. 

I realize that it can be painful to question yourself, your flaws and your prejudices. It's much simpler to rely on one's dogma and insist that whatever you do can't be wrong 'just because'. But it's easy to educate yourself on how objectification, especially of the nasty kind displayed in this thread, hurts women and is part of a power structure that is essentially amoral.

But, sure complain about how mean other people are being to you by not being assholes.

(as an aside I find the whole "self-righteous/white knight" stuff that misogynists throw around to be one of the lamest type of arguments ever. It's essentially saying that other people being nicer than you makes you feel bad about yourself so they should stop. How did that ever become a socially accepted retort to anything?)

[Gustaf]

A " weird midsection"... " bit boxy"... "on her way to having weight problems"... what is wrong with you people? Perhaps this is the sexist patriarchy the angry people are always going on about.

Dudes discussing women in a male-dominated environment is sexist now?  I thought it was a normal thing guys just do.  Women discuss the physical attractiveness of men all the time!  And didn't I say she had killer t1ts and a beautiful face?

Sentence 1: No, you didn't get it
Sentence 2: lol
Sentence 3: you're still not getting it
Sentence 4: wow, didn't know it was possible to miss the point THIS much. And why self-censor tits? I have no speech.

No, Gustaf, youre just a boring prick who likes to stand on your little cloud of judgment passing life lessons out to all the sinners.  Go ahead and report that.

I don't report a great many posts, I'm not like Opebo and those other cry babies.

And I think you once again, like other Atlas misogynists, conflate dislike of sexism with dislike of sex. They're very different things and you would probably get more of the latter if you weren't so enamoured with the former.

I'm certainly more of a sinner than a prude and have very little of a judgmental attitude in this realm.

I'm sorry, I'm not a misogynist or enamored with sexism because I talk about the physical appearance of women with other men.  If it makes me a misogynist in someone else's book, fine, but that's not something I'm going to feel guilty about. 

I realize that it can be painful to question yourself, your flaws and your prejudices. It's much simpler to rely on one's dogma and insist that whatever you do can't be wrong 'just because'. But it's easy to educate yourself on how objectification, especially of the nasty kind displayed in this thread, hurts women and is part of a power structure that is essentially amoral.

But, sure complain about how mean other people are being to you by not being assholes.

(as an aside I find the whole "self-righteous/white knight" stuff that misogynists throw around to be one of the lamest type of arguments ever. It's essentially saying that other people being nicer than you makes you feel bad about yourself so they should stop. How did that ever become a socially accepted retort to anything?)

'Staf, I've yet to meet one woman in my social circle or somewhat connected to it that finds it offensive or sexist that men have opinions on the physical appearance of females and that they often discuss it amongst each other.   Not.  Friggin.  One.  I've also not one straight female friend that has not made a remark about the physical appearance of a male.  I'm not sure you are understanding how normal this is.  You are defining sexism as failure to live in an alternate reality where inner beauty and personality and all those types of things are all that matters.  Nah man, I'm perfectly happy living in our ugly little reality where men judge the appearance of women and women judge the appearance of men and that's it okay to just have fun with the subject and not get so damn uppity and butthurt about the fact that I think Kate Upton has an abnormally-shaped midsection and great boobs.  

You mean women don't tell misogynist men about their fears and problems? Shocking!

See, this isn't about having opinions on appearance or inner beauty. That's what I already pointed out, you're not getting it at all. Which is why you should perhaps try to educate yourself on it, since you're clearly thinking it's about something that it isn't.

And as a response to what Snowstalker said, yeah, I'm obviously trying to get laid on the Atlas.

[Gustaf]

A " weird midsection"... " bit boxy"... "on her way to having weight problems"... what is wrong with you people? Perhaps this is the sexist patriarchy the angry people are always going on about.

Dudes discussing women in a male-dominated environment is sexist now?  I thought it was a normal thing guys just do.  Women discuss the physical attractiveness of men all the time!  And didn't I say she had killer t1ts and a beautiful face?

Sentence 1: No, you didn't get it
Sentence 2: lol
Sentence 3: you're still not getting it
Sentence 4: wow, didn't know it was possible to miss the point THIS much. And why self-censor tits? I have no speech.

No, Gustaf, youre just a boring prick who likes to stand on your little cloud of judgment passing life lessons out to all the sinners.  Go ahead and report that.

I don't report a great many posts, I'm not like Opebo and those other cry babies.

And I think you once again, like other Atlas misogynists, conflate dislike of sexism with dislike of sex. They're very different things and you would probably get more of the latter if you weren't so enamoured with the former.

I'm certainly more of a sinner than a prude and have very little of a judgmental attitude in this realm.

I'm sorry, I'm not a misogynist or enamored with sexism because I talk about the physical appearance of women with other men.  If it makes me a misogynist in someone else's book, fine, but that's not something I'm going to feel guilty about. 

I realize that it can be painful to question yourself, your flaws and your prejudices. It's much simpler to rely on one's dogma and insist that whatever you do can't be wrong 'just because'. But it's easy to educate yourself on how objectification, especially of the nasty kind displayed in this thread, hurts women and is part of a power structure that is essentially amoral.

But, sure complain about how mean other people are being to you by not being assholes.

(as an aside I find the whole "self-righteous/white knight" stuff that misogynists throw around to be one of the lamest type of arguments ever. It's essentially saying that other people being nicer than you makes you feel bad about yourself so they should stop. How did that ever become a socially accepted retort to anything?)

'Staf, I've yet to meet one woman in my social circle or somewhat connected to it that finds it offensive or sexist that men have opinions on the physical appearance of females and that they often discuss it amongst each other.   Not.  Friggin.  One.  I've also not one straight female friend that has not made a remark about the physical appearance of a male.  I'm not sure you are understanding how normal this is.  You are defining sexism as failure to live in an alternate reality where inner beauty and personality and all those types of things are all that matters.  Nah man, I'm perfectly happy living in our ugly little reality where men judge the appearance of women and women judge the appearance of men and that's it okay to just have fun with the subject and not get so damn uppity and butthurt about the fact that I think Kate Upton has an abnormally-shaped midsection and great boobs.  

You mean women don't tell misogynist men about their fears and problems? Shocking!

See, this isn't about having opinions on appearance or inner beauty. That's what I already pointed out, you're not getting it at all. Which is why you should perhaps try to educate yourself on it, since you're clearly thinking it's about something that it isn't.

And as a response to what Snowstalker said, yeah, I'm obviously trying to get laid on the Atlas.

Please enlighten me as to what I'm not getting at.

So, firstly, of course finding people attractive or whatever is part of human nature. And talking to friends about such things can be fine too. It becomes problematic when women, as they often are, get reduced to mere sexual objects, and when women are sexualized in a mean-spirited way it's more a tool of oppression than an expression of natural desire.

Men who feel compelled to constantly harp on about women's appearance, especially in a demeaning way are contributing to a culture that creates a lot of suffering for a lot of women. And, fundamentally, there just isn't that much need as far as I can see. I never felt particularly in need of making my opinions about hot women known to the world. The underlying premise is that the world and women especially should care greatly about what random men think of their bodies and that isn't really true.

If I'm going to have sex with a woman I'll let her know what I find physically attractive about her but beyond that I don't engage much with that topic and I don't feel like I'm losing out much.

[Gustaf]

Discussing the attractiveness of professional models is not misogyny, calm down Gus.

Nice try, but I'm perfectly calm. Just pointing something out. Context also matters, and HockeyDude is pretty established already even if he is no Memphis.

It's amusing that you're both acting as if I've never discussed the attractiveness of women in my life.

[Gustaf]

It's amusing that you're both acting as if I've never discussed the attractiveness of women in my life.

But when we do we're misogynists.

Well...if you do it in a misogynist way you're being misogynist. That isn't all that complex. For example, in a context of peoples' privacy being violated it is telling if one decides to make fun of the victims' appearance.

[Gustaf]

It's amusing that you're both acting as if I've never discussed the attractiveness of women in my life.

But when we do we're misogynists.

Well...if you do it in a misogynist way you're being misogynist. That isn't all that complex. For example, in a context of peoples' privacy being violated it is telling if one decides to make fun of the victims' appearance.

Except...that isn't at all what happened. Snowstalker made a comment upon Upton's "excess" (come to think of it, Snow's post was pretty sexist, but that's a different matter), which Patrick1 misinterpreted as a comment about Upton's weight, which he noted could potentially be a problem in the context of her profession as a supermodel. In reply, HockeyDude said that Upton was indeed "a "bit boxy" (again, in the context of her being a supermodel).

Either you didn't actually read most of the posts in this thread, or you're just unable to understand the context of a discussion.

I think maybe you're missing the context here.

Actually on topic, Lawrence commented on the whole thing in Vanity Fair. It's getting a fair bit of attention.

http://www.vanityfair.com/vf-hollywood/2014/10/jennifer-lawrence-cover