Opinion of Henry VIII

[Panda Express]

Well?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Certainly he was a Fat Fyck.

[Grumpier Than Thou]

An asshole of history™

[Dr. Cynic]

As loathe as I am to speak ill of fellow fatties, he was a real asshole.

[tpfkaw]

Should've made the acquaintance of the Spanish Inquisition.

[SWE]

Clearly terrible

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Even aside from his monstrous treatment of his wives and children, the man was a failure of a monarch. He inherited a kingdom in relatively good shape, and left it divided, bankrupt and without a clear successor. Nearly all his foreign jaunts were utterly useless and with little financial gain, he tended to swap his favoured court members rashly, he half-arsed the "English Reformation" leaving numerous problems for his successors, and managed to spark an uprising in the North by destroying the only support for the impoverished (the religious houses) with no replacement. The only positive legacies of his rule were all largely independent of the king, and largely down to Thomas Cromwell and Wolsey.

He was certainly a man of some talent, but he was also petty, paranoid and ultimately a dismal failure, who is only really remembered as a grotesquely comedic figure. I would like to say he is one of the worst English monarchs, but sadly England is spoilt for choice as far as lousy monarchs are concerned.

[DemPGH]

Heinous. HP.

Every bit as bad as John (1199-1216) and Mary I (1553-1558).

[ElectionsGuy]

HP, like the vast majority of middle ages monarchs.

[politicus]

HP, like the vast majority of middle ages monarchs.

Not really, more of a renaissance man.

[patrick1]

Even aside from his monstrous treatment of his wives and children, the man was a failure of a monarch. He inherited a kingdom in relatively good shape, and left it divided, bankrupt and without a clear successor. Nearly all his foreign jaunts were utterly useless and with little financial gain, he tended to swap his favoured court members rashly, he half-arsed the "English Reformation" leaving numerous problems for his successors, and managed to spark an uprising in the North by destroying the only support for the impoverished (the religious houses) with no replacement. The only positive legacies of his rule were all largely independent of the king, and largely down to Thomas Cromwell and Wolsey.

He was certainly a man of some talent, but he was also petty, paranoid and ultimately a dismal failure, who is only really remembered as a grotesquely comedic figure. I would like to say he is one of the worst English monarchs, but sadly England is spoilt for choice as far as lousy monarchs are concerned.

Good post Cc. It is sad that popular history forgets those effective monarchs that don't have a dramatic and intrigue laden life story.

[7,052,770]

FF. A fascinating historical figure, and The Tudors is one of my all-time favorite shows.

[Miles]

HP (Catholic)

[Spamage]

HP.

Nonetheless, he is by far one of the most interesting figures in European History.

[Frodo]

HP (Catholic)

Is it any coincidence that the man turned into a monster when he abandoned the Catholic Church?  I wonder how differently his reign (and England's by extension) have turned out if the Pope had agreed to annul his marriage to Queen Catherine...  

[Spamage]

HP (Catholic)

Is it any coincidence that the man turned into a monster when he abandoned the Catholic Church?  I wonder how differently his reign (and England's by extension) have turned out if the Pope had agreed to annul his marriage to Queen Catherine...  

He was a very strong Catholic prior to the break with the Church (and he would adhered to many traditional Catholic principles throughout his life). Had his marriage been annulled, England would've likely remained Catholic, and by extension Scotland as well. Mary and Catherine would've had probably just a terrible treatment however, with Mary being less devout (one core reason for her religious devotion was the fact the Church said she was legitimate. Had she been deemed a bastard by the Pope, and seen Luther in support of her mother, which he surprisingly was, perhaps she would look at Protestantism)

I'm not sure how Anne Boleyn would feel about England remaining Catholic, although her influence in her husband's affairs would likely be much smaller in this scenario, with Henry likely remaining a strict and stubborn Catholic.

It would've been interesting to say the least, especially if Anne only had one daughter (which some historians think the couple having one surviving child was inevitable due to some disorder Henry had due to genetic inheritance from Jacquetta of Luxembourg due to her being his direct maternal ancestor).

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Even aside from his monstrous treatment of his wives and children, the man was a failure of a monarch. He inherited a kingdom in relatively good shape, and left it divided, bankrupt and without a clear successor. Nearly all his foreign jaunts were utterly useless and with little financial gain, he tended to swap his favoured court members rashly, he half-arsed the "English Reformation" leaving numerous problems for his successors, and managed to spark an uprising in the North by destroying the only support for the impoverished (the religious houses) with no replacement. The only positive legacies of his rule were all largely independent of the king, and largely down to Thomas Cromwell and Wolsey.

He was certainly a man of some talent, but he was also petty, paranoid and ultimately a dismal failure, who is only really remembered as a grotesquely comedic figure. I would like to say he is one of the worst English monarchs, but sadly England is spoilt for choice as far as lousy monarchs are concerned.

Good post Cc. It is sad that popular history forgets those effective monarchs that don't have a dramatic and intrigue laden life story.

In a way, I consider Henry's latter day legacy quite amusing. He was an educated and artistic Renaissance man, brought up under a humanist education, a polyglot, an intellectual and (in his prime) a physically imposing, handsome figure; and how do we think of him now? Why, that oafish fat man with the wives you learn about in primary school right!

I think the Tudors are such an interesting dynasty to study, simply because I have so much ... cartoonish notions of them from endless primary school history lessons. It's weird viewing them through the prism of reality.

NB Before I am misconstrued in my first statement, I don't really think either Cromwell or Wolsey were good people, but they were competent.

HP (Catholic)

Is it any coincidence that the man turned into a monster when he abandoned the Catholic Church?  I wonder how differently his reign (and England's by extension) have turned out if the Pope had agreed to annul his marriage to Queen Catherine...  

He probably would have broken relations anyway, such was the tremendous spoils of the Church. Wolsey would have lost favour some other way, and a Cromwell and More would always be lurking in the background. I don't buy the idea that Henry suddenly changed personalities. I just think his numerous flaws and neuroses festered over time and burst out over time in great fits of temper.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Clearly awful but I appreciate his musical contributions.

[Fmr President & Senator Polnut]

Amazing potential .... ruined

[Kaine for Senate '18]

Clearly awful but I appreciate his musical contributions.

You mean this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDFDeDh430Q

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Clearly awful but I appreciate his musical contributions.

You aren't referring to Greensleeves are you? The style of composition its written in didn't exist in England until after his death, and there's about an equal chance that he wrote it as he did Rites of Spring's For Want Of.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

Clearly awful but I appreciate his musical contributions.

You aren't referring to Greensleeves are you? The style of composition its written in didn't exist in England until after his death, and there's about an equal chance that he wrote it as he did Rites of Spring's For Want Of.

That's a bit hyperbolic, but no, I wasn't referring to Greensleeves except perhaps in the general sense of the impact of Henry VIII's patronage of the musical arts for his own time and later.  He was actually a musician and a composer of a number of songs, the most famous probably being 'Pastime With Good Company'.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

Clearly awful but I appreciate his musical contributions.

You aren't referring to Greensleeves are you? The style of composition its written in didn't exist in England until after his death, and there's about an equal chance that he wrote it as he did Rites of Spring's For Want Of.

That's a bit hyperbolic, but no, I wasn't referring to Greensleeves except perhaps in the general sense of the impact of Henry VIII's patronage of the musical arts for his own time and later.  He was actually a musician and a composer of a number of songs, the most famous probably being 'Pastime With Good Company'.

I was hoping you were referring to Rick Wakeman's "The Six Wives of Henry VIII".

[Indy Texas]

Without him, we'd never have had...

Her...


or this...

[morgieb]

Certainly a huge HP, but he is one of the more interesting figures of the time.