For Democrats: Is Direct Democracy the Solution?

[Boston Bread]

Hopefully I don't need to explain tonight's results. But what popped out at me is despite how unfriendly the electorate that came out was to democrats, our platform was given a mandate in direct voter initiatives. Minimum wage and background checks won, personhood lost, regardless of how red a state is (within reasonable limits). Yet many of these voters went on to support candidates who were on the wrong side of public opinion and they won.

While money and soundbites can change voter's mind on a candidate, it seems that ballot initiatives are a much more accurate gauge of public opinion on policy because referenda are direct and has nothing to do the "who understands me" battle that Democrats suck at. American voters are gullible maybe, but not malevolent. When people see issues before them that affect their lives, reason overcomes fear and loathing.

Without doubt, the vast majority of policy changes enacted in federal and state governments are going to be bad news to us. Reversing their gains in seats is long and expensive. Not to mention the Senate is stacked against us because states like WY and CA get the same representation and due to gerrymandering across the country. But we can implement much of our goals without seats. Tonight showed wide support for progressive causes exist regardless of election results. I don't understand ballot initiative laws in every state, but it was a waste to see so much of that potential go to waste. Where we can, we must go on the offensive with ballot initiatives to expand medicare, raise the minimum wage, stop tax breaks for the 1%, get background checks, etc. Gets the base turned out too. Controversial issues like gun control which tend to motivate the other side more than our own could be decoupled from the national party and left for grassroots supporters to fight through referenda. This also gets us out of the win-lose cycle based on the guy at the top. In a realignment where we are favoured in presidential races by nature, we will inevitably be blamed in bad times regardless of the logic behind it. We won't always win referenda either, but we have a much better prospect of this than electing (D)s everywhere. We need more of these direct votes. Agree?

[Joe Republic]

Oh god no.  The general public is woefully uninformed on virtually every issue.  (Tonight's results demonstrate that rather well.)

[Oakvale]

No, never. The public is f!cking horrible.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

It's easy to defeat a Proposition if the powerful interests spend a lot of money to defeat it. Some good examples here in California.

http://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_29,_Tobacco_Tax_for_Cancer_Research_Act_(June_2012)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_87_(2006)
http://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_79,_Prescription_Drug_Discount_Program_(2005)
http://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_45,_Public_Notice_Required_for_Insurance_Company_Rates_Initiative_(2014)

[Boston Bread]

I still believe Americans are more rational when it comes to ballot initiatives than selecting a candidate. A lot of propositions that come up, even if defeated due to powerful interests (who would lobby the government nonetheless), wouldn't be considered among our current crop of elected officials. At least worth a try if the opportunity arises since a loss in referenda has no immediate negative effects.

[pbrower2a]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union. 

[Joe Republic]

^ Melodramatic, much?

[Citizen (The) Doctor]

It's really funny because I actually posited earlier today to a colleague and friend that perhaps less elections would be ideal. What would happen if we started tying all federal elections to four year intervals, with House terms lasting 4 years and Senate terms lasting 8? It's definitely something to think about when it comes to turnout.

I wonder how much of the Democratic demographic actually knew there was an election yesterday.

[Boston Bread]

It's really funny because I actually posited earlier today to a colleague and friend that perhaps less elections would be ideal. What would happen if we started tying all federal elections to four year intervals, with House terms lasting 4 years and Senate terms lasting 8? It's definitely something to think about when it comes to turnout.

I wonder how much of the Democratic demographic actually knew there was an election yesterday.

I would support it just so politicians aren't in permanent campaign mode.

[Mechaman]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union. 

This might be one of the last messages I post here, so I'll make it a good one:

Dude, would you please shut the fuck up?!

[Bandit3 the Worker]

It could too easily turn into mob rule by the 1%.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

It could too easily turn into mob rule by the 1%.

'Mob rule by the 1%' sounds scary but is a contradiction in terms.

[The Mikado]

I'm ideologically opposed to referenda of all types.  I'm not a legislator.  I do not have the legal background to analyse legislation.  Why are you asking me?  I voted for you guys to represent my interests in working this stuff out.

Referenda are a terrible idea, especially because they so often end up in that "amend language in paragraph 3 of chapter VII of statute 2814 to reflect changes in state law" form that is explicitly designed to flummox and confuse voters.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

It could too easily turn into mob rule by the 1%.

'Mob rule by the 1%' sounds scary but is a contradiction in terms.

We've had mob rule by the 1% since 1994!

[The Free North]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union.  

Yes....7 senate seats changed hands and we are now Spain under France. You're understanding of American politics is impressive.

[krazen1211]

How much money did that loser Hagan burn, anyway? Plutocrats indeed.

[Simfan34]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union.  

Yes....7 senate seats changed hands and we are now Spain under France. You're understanding of American politics is impressive.

Spain under Francisco Franco, you idiot.

[King]

American government has worked best when the people were kept as far away from the process as possible.  We need more backroom deals and more machine politics.

[The Free North]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union.  

Yes....7 senate seats changed hands and we are now Spain under France. You're understanding of American politics is impressive.

Spain under Francisco Franco, you idiot.

It was a typo and my mind is occupied with other things.


Don't be so nasty

[Mehmentum]

No, Direct Democracy isn't the answer.

The answer is to actually run on these issues that are so popular, instead of running away.

[AggregateDemand]

No, Direct Democracy isn't the answer.

The answer is to actually run on these issues that are so popular, instead of running away.

Popularity ≠ effective legislation

Embracing more ill-conceived, popular policies is not something the Democratic Party can afford.

[Citizen Hats]

It makes a lot of sense. Americans, by and large, agree with the Republicans philosophically, but they agree wit the policies the Democrats have to offer.

[krazen1211]

50% of the nation is soon to be governed by a Republican governor and legislature.

Ain't Democracy grand?

[IceSpear]

50% of the nation is soon to be governed by a Republican governor and legislature.

Ain't Democracy grand?

And Pennsylvania will no longer be one of them!

[pbrower2a]

Democracy is dead in America. We now live in a pure plutocracy with only a facade of democracy. We will have elections, but results will be rigged. Sure, there might be some Democrats winning a Congressional seat, a Senate seat, or a Governorship here or there, but those Democrats will be impotent much like  the tolerated minor parties of the old East Germany. They will not dare seek to pick off support for any legislation from the dominant GOP.

Folks, it was a great run. But it is over. We now have voted ourselves into a system of lords and masters, and those are not feudal relics as in some European countries.   You can trust that the GOP will not allow the Democrats to ever win a majority in either House of Congress, let alone the Presidency.

We screwed ourselves, and unlike the Germans in 1933 we do not have a combination of economic distress and hurt feelings from national mistreatment by victorious powers.  Democracy in America may return in the wake of military defeat as happened in much of Germany in 1945. What's our excuse? Are we more interested in slasher films and Ultimate Fighting than in our political realities?

The best that America can be now is something like Spain under Franco or Portugal under Salazar -- a cheap place for a holiday. We will still have Yellowstone, Yosemite, the Grand Canyon, beaches, ski slopes, and such great cities as Boston, New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. But most Americans will be priced out of them -- and timed out of them by having to work 70-hour workweeks for near-starvation wages. America could be a great place to visit but a horrible place to live.

We Americans are going to get much more sophisticated about politics while we become impotent to do anything about them. As propaganda becomes the norm in news and education, those who have IQs above 100 will learn to read between the lines. But too late, as in the Soviet Union.  

Yes....7 senate seats changed hands and we are now Spain under France. You're understanding of American politics is impressive.

I look at a trend. Republicans can hold onto any seat with an incumbent but every Democratic seat is up for grabs. If that operates in 2012, and the Republicans elect a President with fascistic proclivities, then the trend is for even more complete ruin of political pluralism.

The one reliable trend is that any Democratic nominee for a key office can expect not only a challenge from the direct opponent but also from one of the shadowy front groups  that offers "The Democratic candidates strangles puppies" ads.

Welcome to the world of Orwellian Doublespeak.  It is killing American democracy.Sultan-like bliss for 1% of Americans and utter deprivation for everyone else? Such is the apparent objective.

I am old enough to remember that perception of Portugal and Spain into the middle 1970s; tourists were welcome because they were unlikely to talk about politics while on the beach or dining in one of the tourist-attracting restaurants. Both countries were considered very poor by European standards. Franco and Salazar liked it that way.