Is there such a thing as objective reality?
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  Is there such a thing as objective reality?
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Author Topic: Is there such a thing as objective reality?  (Read 7697 times)
Del Tachi
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« Reply #25 on: December 19, 2014, 10:17:54 PM »

Of course there's no objective reality.

How can things be verified independently of who is observing them?  We're forced to live out of lives operating through the prism of our physical bodies, and there is no way to verify the veracity of our five senses or memories.   
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bedstuy
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« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2014, 01:24:07 AM »

Of course there's no objective reality.

How can things be verified independently of who is observing them?  We're forced to live out of lives operating through the prism of our physical bodies, and there is no way to verify the veracity of our five senses or memories.   

What about using tools to observe things that we can't observe directly?  What about with scientific experiments and theory?  That's the whole idea of an experiment, no?  You do repeatable experiments that can anyone can do and falsify your findings.  That's objective.
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DemPGH
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« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2014, 11:12:45 AM »

And then the blind man in the room does not perceive the same reality as the other participants in your experiment and the results are called into question, yes.

But that's because he's blind. All because he can't see it doesn't change the actual, physical reality.

Yes, yes, he's not eligible to participate because he can't see, but I rather think Mikado was pulling my leg a bit. When that black dog walked into the room, no one saw a dragon. Tongue
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Del Tachi
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« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2014, 04:42:38 PM »
« Edited: December 20, 2014, 05:30:26 PM by Del Tachi »

Of course there's no objective reality.

How can things be verified independently of who is observing them?  We're forced to live out of lives operating through the prism of our physical bodies, and there is no way to verify the veracity of our five senses or memories.   

What about using tools to observe things that we can't observe directly?  What about with scientific experiments and theory?  That's the whole idea of an experiment, no?  You do repeatable experiments that can anyone can do and falsify your findings.  That's objective.

But still no matter the number or type of tests that are run, we're still limited to interpreting the results through our physical senses.  It doesn't matter if we're systematically, scientifically running a chemistry test if at the end of the day we're still having to interpret the results with our eyes. 
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #29 on: December 22, 2014, 02:52:37 PM »

Only in some ways.
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #30 on: December 23, 2014, 05:37:38 AM »
« Edited: December 23, 2014, 05:40:22 AM by Antonio V »

It does probably exist, but, as Al said, we have no way of approaching it except from our own subjective perceptions of it. I would say reason (and I mean not only science, but any form of rational reflection) is humanity's way of trying to come to a common understanding of what reality is, in order to help us live together in a relatively orderly way despite our subjectivity.
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Yelnoc
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« Reply #31 on: December 23, 2014, 05:42:25 PM »


How excitingly vague!
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Redalgo
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« Reply #32 on: January 07, 2015, 01:01:21 PM »
« Edited: January 07, 2015, 01:07:59 PM by Redalgo »

I imagine there is an objective reality, sure, but because human minds are limited in their abilities to perceive, interpret, and analyze information it would be foolish to place unconditional trust in them. Intersubjectivity in assembling personal, mental constructs concerning what is real (knowledge) does not imply that everyone happens to be incorrect in all - or even most - of their perceptions. Rather, we simply cannot know beyond all doubt what is and is not real.

This is not difficult to pick up on. Scientists are continually looking for improved ways of understanding the natural world. No small number of experts create over-simplified, technically inaccurate conceptual models for people to use as tools to more efficiently convey underlying concepts and ideas. Many a religion makes truth claims about a host of supernatural beings and phenomena. There are optical illusions, conspiracy theories, wildly contrary perceptions of what particular political factions do and aspire to achieve, and so forth. Natural selection, experience, socialization, and so forth might help critters get better at making guesses about reality but some degree of imperfection and need for making basic, faith-based assumptions endures.

I think studies of reality can help us get closer to understanding it but to some extent there is always a chance that we will draw the wrong conclusions from data that may itself not even be accurate, and then proceed to think and behave with confidence in our misled ideas being objective truths.

Going back to the thought experiment from before, separate everyone afterwards. Ask more questions about the dog. You will eventually get answers that are not all alike because to some extent the folks you picked for the experiment possess differing experiences that have biased the ways in which they perceive the world all around. Bear in mind that people who go through similar experiences in similar settings living similar lives in similar cultures will probably provide you with a more similar range of answers to questions than if you used fifteen people of varied mental states, cultures, lifestyles, and countries of origin.
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