UK: Preferred Prime Minister
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  UK: Preferred Prime Minister
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Poll
Question: ...
#1
David Cameron
 
#2
Ed Miliband
 
#3
Nick Clegg
 
#4
Nigel Farage
 
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Total Voters: 71

Author Topic: UK: Preferred Prime Minister  (Read 4825 times)
politicus
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« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2014, 08:20:14 AM »


Really? You got a peculiar taste in men.
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2014, 10:44:59 AM »


For real?
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whyshouldigiveyoumyname?
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« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2014, 11:09:36 AM »

lol.
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Oldiesfreak1854
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« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2014, 07:58:37 PM »

Cameron, with Clegg in a close second.

Honestly, I hope the Tories pick someone else in the next leadership election.
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CrabCake
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« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2014, 08:16:58 AM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.
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Cassius
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« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2014, 08:45:39 AM »

Farrago of course.

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.


Hague and Howard (not so much Duncan Smith but oh well) were only 'dud' leaders because of the extremely poor position that the Conservative Party was in during the mid to late 90's and early 2000's. I doubt that anybody could have won the 2001 general election for the Tories, and even the 2005 general election seems like a bit of a longshot. If Cameron had, for whatever reason, been leading the Conservative Party into either election I doubt that he would have been able to do considerably better.

Tories are ungrateful to Cameron because he essentially promised the party that it could win a majority if it only adopted all this 'modernisation' BS. Well, he cocked that up a bit didn't he? Failing to win a majority against a highly unpopular government led by a highly unpopular PM (whether that unpopularity was deserved is of course your opinion), and instead was forced into a coalition with the Liberal bloody Democrats, who, whilst not having done very well at putting their own agenda, such as it was, into effect when in office, have done a very good job at stymying elements of the Conservative agenda.

Cameron promised everything and delivered pretty much bugger all. He's a failure.
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Oakvale
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« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2014, 10:29:12 AM »

Farrago of course.

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.


Hague and Howard (not so much Duncan Smith but oh well) were only 'dud' leaders because of the extremely poor position that the Conservative Party was in during the mid to late 90's and early 2000's. I doubt that anybody could have won the 2001 general election for the Tories, and even the 2005 general election seems like a bit of a longshot. If Cameron had, for whatever reason, been leading the Conservative Party into either election I doubt that he would have been able to do considerably better.

Tories are ungrateful to Cameron because he essentially promised the party that it could win a majority if it only adopted all this 'modernisation' BS. Well, he cocked that up a bit didn't he? Failing to win a majority against a highly unpopular government led by a highly unpopular PM (whether that unpopularity was deserved is of course your opinion), and instead was forced into a coalition with the Liberal bloody Democrats, who, whilst not having done very well at putting their own agenda, such as it was, into effect when in office, have done a very good job at stymying elements of the Conservative agenda.

Cameron promised everything and delivered pretty much bugger all. He's a failure.

That's the kind of logic that Labour left-wingers used to complain that since Blair would have won in 1997 anyway the modernisation was irrelevant. Leaving aside the fact that it's a silly proposition - who knows how things would have went? - it kind of misses  the point to only think of such a process as an electoral tool. The Tories still being not trusted isn't really Cameron's fault, unless you somehow think that Howard or whoever could have somehow won a majority.

Hague was absolutely a dud. Maybe a different leader wouldn't have done considerably better but that doesn't change the fact that his tenure was farcical. The less said about Michael "Immigrants!" Howard the better.

Cameron, with Clegg in a close second.

Honestly, I hope the Tories pick someone else in the next leadership election.

There's not going to be a leadership election until Cameron goes so that would be inevitable.
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AelroseB
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« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2014, 02:22:39 PM »

Farage - although I should know better not to fall for the charisma-isma of populists.
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Cassius
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« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2014, 06:14:20 PM »

Farrago of course.

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.


Hague and Howard (not so much Duncan Smith but oh well) were only 'dud' leaders because of the extremely poor position that the Conservative Party was in during the mid to late 90's and early 2000's. I doubt that anybody could have won the 2001 general election for the Tories, and even the 2005 general election seems like a bit of a longshot. If Cameron had, for whatever reason, been leading the Conservative Party into either election I doubt that he would have been able to do considerably better.

Tories are ungrateful to Cameron because he essentially promised the party that it could win a majority if it only adopted all this 'modernisation' BS. Well, he cocked that up a bit didn't he? Failing to win a majority against a highly unpopular government led by a highly unpopular PM (whether that unpopularity was deserved is of course your opinion), and instead was forced into a coalition with the Liberal bloody Democrats, who, whilst not having done very well at putting their own agenda, such as it was, into effect when in office, have done a very good job at stymying elements of the Conservative agenda.

Cameron promised everything and delivered pretty much bugger all. He's a failure.

That's the kind of logic that Labour left-wingers used to complain that since Blair would have won in 1997 anyway the modernisation was irrelevant. Leaving aside the fact that it's a silly proposition - who knows how things would have went? - it kind of misses  the point to only think of such a process as an electoral tool. The Tories still being not trusted isn't really Cameron's fault, unless you somehow think that Howard or whoever could have somehow won a majority.

Hague was absolutely a dud. Maybe a different leader wouldn't have done considerably better but that doesn't change the fact that his tenure was farcical. The less said about Michael "Immigrants!" Howard the better.

I'm not saying, neccessarily (and perhaps I should've made this clear) that any form of 'modernisation' was unneccessary, but I do believe that the way Cameron went about it (especially when he was in opposition, but even more recently with the whole gay marriage farce) was needlessly provocative and ultimately counter-productive, in the sense that it alienated a large number of the party's traditional supporters for comparatively little electoral gain. Many of those alianted people eventually found somewhere else to go - UKIP. Cameron may have won over a few 'centrist' voters, but at the same time has driven off a decent number of Tory stalwarts, thus leaving the party stuck at around 30% of the vote. Its all very well talking about needing to broaden a party's base of support, but if your attempts to do so infuriate and alienate much of the existing base, it has to be questioned as to whether those actions are correct.

Also of course, if we're comparing this to the criticism of Blair by the Labour left, it should be remembered that Blair delivered the electoral goods for his party, something that Cameron has failed to do after nearly a decade at the helm of the Conservative party. I think its perfectly reasonable to argue that Cameron's attempt at modernisation has been a failure.
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Phony Moderate
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« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2014, 09:54:24 PM »

Speaking as a hard leftie, I find that I have more respect for maverick right-wing Tories (Davis, Rees-Mogg, Hannan etc) than I do for the modernisers (Cameron, Osborne, Shapps etc).
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Oldiesfreak1854
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« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2014, 09:55:37 PM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.

They should be desperate?  Isn't he massively unpopular?
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« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2014, 10:03:51 PM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.

They should be desperate?  Isn't he massively unpopular?

Less so than the other party leaders, which is what has most likely ensured his survival through this parliament.
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Del Tachi
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« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2014, 10:47:45 AM »

Cameron
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CrabCake
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« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2014, 10:53:59 AM »

Cameron isn't popular, but he's certainly more popular than the Tory party as a whole.
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Oakvale
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« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2014, 11:20:09 AM »

Cameron is certainly popular relative to Miliband's utterly dire polling numbers, which is what matters.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #40 on: December 22, 2014, 01:49:02 PM »

Cameron is certainly popular relative to Miliband's utterly dire polling numbers, which is what matters.

Not particularly; personal popularity (or otherwise) of party leaders rarely makes much of a difference here for whatever reason. 1945 and 1979 are the most famous demonstrations of this...
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Oakvale
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« Reply #41 on: December 22, 2014, 01:50:25 PM »

Cameron is certainly popular relative to Miliband's utterly dire polling numbers, which is what matters.

Not particularly; personal popularity (or otherwise) of party leaders rarely makes much of a difference here for whatever reason. 1945 and 1979 are the most famous demonstrations of this...

I wasn't really speaking electorally so much as in the context of the "is Cameron 'popular'" question in isolation.
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Horus
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« Reply #42 on: December 22, 2014, 02:29:56 PM »

Yuck, Miliband by default.
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afleitch
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« Reply #43 on: December 22, 2014, 02:35:11 PM »

Miliband will be f-cking hilarious as PM.
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Kalwejt
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« Reply #44 on: December 22, 2014, 03:36:27 PM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.

They should be desperate?  Isn't he massively unpopular?

Until Cameron loses the election (and the power), he doesn't have to worry about any serious leadership challenge.
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Oldiesfreak1854
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« Reply #45 on: December 22, 2014, 08:33:23 PM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.

They should be desperate?  Isn't he massively unpopular?

Less so than the other party leaders, which is what has most likely ensured his survival through this parliament.
I guess that's to be expected in uber-liberal Britain.
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Phony Moderate
Obamaisdabest
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« Reply #46 on: December 22, 2014, 10:37:40 PM »

@Oldies, If the Tories have kept Cameron for so long they'd look pretty desperate kicking him out now.

I do think Tories are rather ungrateful to dear Cammers. You'd think after three dud leaders they'd feel kind of happy about him, rather than throwing their toys out the pram because he endorsed a few cuddly social liberal ideas.

They should be desperate?  Isn't he massively unpopular?

Less so than the other party leaders, which is what has most likely ensured his survival through this parliament.
I guess that's to be expected in uber-liberal Britain.

We certainly are not "uber-liberal" in the way that we (and virtually every other nation on earth) understand the term, and really not even in the way that you do.
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TheDeadFlagBlues
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« Reply #47 on: December 22, 2014, 11:01:21 PM »

Cameron is certainly popular relative to Miliband's utterly dire polling numbers, which is what matters.

Not particularly; personal popularity (or otherwise) of party leaders rarely makes much of a difference here for whatever reason. 1945 and 1979 are the most famous demonstrations of this...

I wasn't really speaking electorally so much as in the context of the "is Cameron 'popular'" question in isolation.

I agree with this. Sporting a ~40% approval rating is quite impressive in these dire times. His center-right counterparts in Europe would kill for those numbers.
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