Slovakia gay marriage/adoption/sex education referendum - Feb. 7, 2015

[Tender Branson]

A referendum will be held in Slovakia on Saturday, 7 February 2015.

Voters will be asked three questions:

* Should the definition of marriage be restricted to a union of a man and woman?

* Should same-sex partners be prevented from adopting children?

* Should children be exempted from sex education classes at school if their parents do not wish them to attend?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slovak_same-sex_marriage_referendum,_2015

Poll I found:

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[Tender Branson]

Eastern Europe still suxx on this issue.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

Hopefully the ECHR will one day strike down these bans.

I've never really understood why there is such a huge obsession with putting gay marriage to referendum. Why - from every single issue that parliaments and congresses discuss - does this one issue create such a unique desire to be placed on the ballot? Social conservatives are such weirdos :/ (no offence to anybody here)

[they don't love you like i love you]

Hopefully the ECHR will one day strike down these bans.

I've never really understood why there is such a huge obsession with putting gay marriage to referendum. Why - from every single issue that parliaments and congresses discuss - does this one issue create such a unique desire to be placed on the ballot? Social conservatives are such weirdos :/ (no offence to anybody here)

Part of the reason it was done in the US so much was Republicans trying to boost socon turnout. Doesn't really apply in Europe since there aren't other elections being held then.

(and I'm still quite proud of how that backfired big time in Minnesota and is exactly the reason we had gay marriage passed last year and no doubt cost a few Republican legislators their seats, though granted the Republicans had basically painted themselves into a corner on the issue, there was no way they could NOT put it on the ballot after more than a half decade of demonizing the DFL and comparing them to the anti-Christian persecution of the Soviet Union for not allowing the vote.)

[SNJ1985]

I would definitely vote in favor of this. It will probably pass; I hope turnout is over 50% so it can become law.

[Tender Branson]

From what I understand, the Slovak constitution already bans same-sex marriage.

Does anyone know if this is a referendum that would change the constitution if a majority votes "No" and has 50%+ turnout, or not ?

If not, what's the point of asking Question 1 (SSM), if there's already a ban ?

They could just ask Q2 and Q3.

[swl]

I've never really understood why there is such a huge obsession with putting gay marriage to referendum. Why - from every single issue that parliaments and congresses discuss - does this one issue create such a unique desire to be placed on the ballot? Social conservatives are such weirdos :/ (no offence to anybody here)

Well that's a very important issue. Law on taxes or labour can be changed every year if the government wants to, but marriage between a man and a woman has been the basis of families in Europe and in countries of Christian culture for 2000 years, and it's quite a permanent change, so I think it's fair to allow everyone to give its opinion on the topic.

I remember that the opponents in France were denouncing a 'change of civilization'. I agree with them (except that I supported this change while they opposed it).

[Clyde1998]

From what I understand, the Slovak constitution already bans same-sex marriage.

Does anyone know if this is a referendum that would change the constitution if a majority votes "No" and has 50%+ turnout, or not ?

If not, what's the point of asking Question 1 (SSM), if there's already a ban ?

They could just ask Q2 and Q3.

It may be that a no vote would make the government reverse the constitution - to allow same-sex marriage. The question seems to be slanted towards a positive response though...

[politicus]

From what I understand, the Slovak constitution already bans same-sex marriage.

Does anyone know if this is a referendum that would change the constitution if a majority votes "No" and has 50%+ turnout, or not ?

If not, what's the point of asking Question 1 (SSM), if there's already a ban ?

They could just ask Q2 and Q3.

It may be that a no vote would make the government reverse the constitution - to allow same-sex marriage. The question seems to be slanted towards a positive response though...

Alliance for Family wants to make it as hard as possible to revert the constitutional ban on same sex marriage. The current ban was approved as part of a horse trade. The ruling SDs in Smer wanted some judicial reforms and they got them through by agreeing to the gay marriage ban. Prime Minister Robert Fico doesn't seem to give a damn about this issue, but they can not be sure a future Smer leader would not reverse the party's position. Slovak opinion on gay rights has turned a lot more liberal in recent years, so its a safeguard against future attacks on the ban. You only need a 3/5 majority in Parliament to amend the Constitution (=90 seats, Smer got 83 now), but it would be politically very risky to do so by overruling a referendum. So if they get the ban confirmed in a referendum they are de facto guaranteed that it can only be changed by another referendum.

So the context with a dominant party that is on the left and not "naturally" SoCon is important, as is the increasing support for some rights to gay couples (joint property ownership, bereavement leave, medical info on partner and all the other soft stuff).

[Tender Branson]

Slovak opinion on gay rights has turned a lot more liberal in recent years

By "a lot more liberal" you mean going from 86% opposition in a 2006 poll to ca. 80% in the 2014 poll I posted above ?

[politicus]

Slovak opinion on gay rights has turned a lot more liberal in recent years

By "a lot more liberal" you mean going from 86% opposition in a 2006 poll to ca. 80% in the 2014 poll I posted above ?

Gay rights is about more than gay marriage and the numbers on the "soft stuff" has moved a lot. Seen from a SoCon POV the SoLibs seem to be winning the long game and they react against that.

[🦀🎂🦀🎂]

I've never really understood why there is such a huge obsession with putting gay marriage to referendum. Why - from every single issue that parliaments and congresses discuss - does this one issue create such a unique desire to be placed on the ballot? Social conservatives are such weirdos :/ (no offence to anybody here)

Well that's a very important issue. Law on taxes or labour can be changed every year if the government wants to, but marriage between a man and a woman has been the basis of families in Europe and in countries of Christian culture for 2000 years, and it's quite a permanent change, so I think it's fair to allow everyone to give its opinion on the topic.

I remember that the opponents in France were denouncing a 'change of civilization'. I agree with them (except that I supported this change while they opposed it).

Eh, still not seeing it. Marriage is a vastly different institution to what it was a hundred years ago or so. The idea that all marriages should be based on love is pretty new - the law is just catching up with a different social situation.

Besides, I would argue that things like easy divorce or equalising both partners roles were far more radical "changes of civilisation" that affected more people, and nobody wants a referendum on them...

[EPG]

In fact, multiple European countries have had referendums on legalising divorce simpliciter in the last twenty years.

[TDAS04]

Are there any East European (formerly Communist) countries where a majority of people favor gay marriage?  Maybe the Czech Republic?

[EPG]

A Eurobarometer poll in 2006 reported majority support in the Czech Republic, and furthermore stronger support than in France, the UK and Portugal, which have legalised gay marriage in the interim. Wikipedia describes a series of annual polls with support at lower levels, sometimes reporting a majority. Several other countries have strongly-similar institutions (Estonia; Croatia). These three countries are self-consciously oriented toward Western Europe, and will probably be the first to consistently support gay marriage, despite the Croatian referendum.

[SNJ1985]

In fact, multiple European countries have had referendums on legalising divorce simpliciter in the last twenty years.

Malta had one in 2011. Unfortunately, they voted yes.

Italy had a referendum in 1974 on reversing the legislature's decision to legalize divorce in 1970. Unfortunately, the people voted No.

[coloradocowboi]

A Eurobarometer poll in 2006 reported majority support in the Czech Republic, and furthermore stronger support than in France, the UK and Portugal, which have legalised gay marriage in the interim. Wikipedia describes a series of annual polls with support at lower levels, sometimes reporting a majority. Several other countries have strongly-similar institutions (Estonia; Croatia). These three countries are self-consciously oriented toward Western Europe, and will probably be the first to consistently support gay marriage, despite the Croatian referendum.

Voter turnout is very low in Eastern Europe, especially among young people with little memory of communism.

That's why there has been low-level opposition to gay rights in the CR. I don't know much about Hungary, but it could explain the like horrible homophobia there.

In the long run though, these family groups are literally fighting the tide. As a gay Christian, it really bums me out because it's going to make our faith just completely irrelevant in the future.

[politicus]

At bit of background:

http://visegradrevue.eu/?p=3215

[Tender Branson]

At bit of background:

http://visegradrevue.eu/?p=3215

I wonder if the referendum results will be anywhere close to the Mississippi results (86%) ...

Considering the usual underpolling. So, when the poll says 80% opposed, could it be in fact 86% ?

[politicus]

At bit of background:

http://visegradrevue.eu/?p=3215

I wonder if the referendum results will be anywhere close to the Mississippi results (86%) ...

Considering the usual underpolling. So, when the poll says 80% opposed, could it be in fact 86% ?

What poll?

[Tender Branson]

At bit of background:

http://visegradrevue.eu/?p=3215

I wonder if the referendum results will be anywhere close to the Mississippi results (86%) ...

Considering the usual underpolling. So, when the poll says 80% opposed, could it be in fact 86% ?

What poll?

The one I posted in the 1st post (but it's already old and from last year).

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The next train to arrive at this station will be the 10:32 to Birmingham New Street         Calling at      Wellington                Telford Central                Wolverhampton            Smethwick Galton Bridge    and    Birmingham New Street                

[Hash]

So I'm gone for a few days and trying to settle in a new country, and you domkops start behaving like 2 year olds? Thanks!

I will probably clean up this mess, without infraction points.

EDIT: All cleaned up. You domkops do this again and I'm handing out infraction points.

[politicus]

So I'm gone for a few days and trying to settle in a new country, and you domkops start behaving like 2 year olds? Thanks!

I will probably clean up this mess, without infraction points.

EDIT: All cleaned up. You domkops do this again and I'm handing out infraction points.

A bit weird to leave Al's train post (and then delete Tender's trolley lady ).

[Antonio the Sixth]

So I'm gone for a few days and trying to settle in a new country, and you domkops start behaving like 2 year olds? Thanks!

I will probably clean up this mess, without infraction points.

EDIT: All cleaned up. You domkops do this again and I'm handing out infraction points.

A bit weird to leave Al's train post (and then delete Tender's trolley lady ).

I guess Al had some former-Dictator privileges on this board.