what ten districts do you think has the highest percent of
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  what ten districts do you think has the highest percent of
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freepcrusher
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« on: December 31, 2014, 11:10:20 PM »

homes/places of residences that were built before WWII? And not only that but what percent would that be?

Its hard to know since Manhattan has been populated for a long time, but there are few single family homes. A lot of the tenements were torn down in the 50s by Robert Moses and replaced by giant high rises. It would probably be somewhere with a lot of single family and rowhouses. PA 1&2 and IL 4 (bungalow belt) probably fit this role somewhat.
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Brittain33
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« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2015, 11:24:35 AM »

MA-7, NJ-10, PA-14, OH-9, OH-11 all mostly made up of cities and old suburbs that were built out by WWII.
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memphis
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« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2015, 03:17:26 PM »

It needs to be somewhere that not only is old, but also has fallen on hard times, and so, has seen little new development. New York City has absolutely enormous public housing building that hold countless thousands of post war units. A better suggestion might be either of Maine's CDs, a ghetto hellhole VRA district in the Rust Belt. If MD's gerrymander were not so egregious, the winning district might be based in Baltimore.
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BRTD
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« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2015, 05:04:56 PM »
« Edited: January 01, 2015, 05:08:27 PM by incredibly specific types of post-punk music »

One of the Detroit districts?

If MD's gerrymander were not so egregious, the winning district might be based in Baltimore.

Baltimore actually has a lot of gentrifying neighborhoods from what I've heard.
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BRTD
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« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2015, 05:22:07 PM »

How about WV-3?
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morgieb
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« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2015, 05:27:47 PM »

I would've thought some isolated, rural districts would count even better than slum-like cities.
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snowguy716
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« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2015, 10:29:12 PM »

I would've thought some isolated, rural districts would count even better than slum-like cities.

Nah... Rural areas have seen more dynamism in their housing stock than some well established urban areas.  Some areas grow and shrink and with all the space people tend to abandon and raze the old and build new.
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jimrtex
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« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2015, 01:01:30 AM »

homes/places of residences that were built before WWII? And not only that but what percent would that be?

Its hard to know since Manhattan has been populated for a long time, but there are few single family homes. A lot of the tenements were torn down in the 50s by Robert Moses and replaced by giant high rises. It would probably be somewhere with a lot of single family and rowhouses. PA 1&2 and IL 4 (bungalow belt) probably fit this role somewhat.
ACS 2013 (1 year)

Percentage of housing units built 1939 or earlier:

IL-4    60.89%  Chicago, Orejeras
NY-9    58.94%  Brooklyn, Crown Heights, Flatbush
NY-7    56.00%  Brooklyn, etc, Brooklyn Heights, Chinatown, Williamsburg, Woodhaven
MA-7    53.85%  Boston-Cambridge-Somerville-Randolph
NY-10   53.39%  Manhattan-Brooklyn, West Side, Borough Park.
NY-13   50.30%  Manhattan-Bronx, Harlem, Kingsbridge
CA-12   49.49%  San Francisco
NY-15   43.17%  Bronx, Southwestern
PA-14   42.08%  Pittsburgh
PA-1    41.53%  Philadelphia, along Delaware


Pre-WWII highest in other states

OH-11   39.08%  Cleveland, Akron
RI-1    36.27%  Providence
DC-AL   35.73%  Washington
WI-4    32.66%  Milwaukee
MD-7    32.65%  "Baltimore"
MO-1    32.62%  St.Louis
IA-4    32.60%  Northwest
NJ-10   32.10%  Newark, Jersey City
MN-5    30.77%  Minneapolis
NE-3    30.39%  West, Central, Northeast, Southeast
MI-13   27.76%  Detroit
VT-AL   26.63%  Vermont
ME-1    26.11%  Southwest, Portland
OR-3    24.74%  Portland
KS-1    23.75%  West
CT-3    23.27%  Southern, New Haven
WA-7    23.19%  Seattle
IN-8    22.96%  Southwest, Evansville, Terre Haute, Perry County
NH-2    22.66%  West, Connecticut Valley, Nashua, Concord
WV-1    22.15%  Northern
SD-AL   18.17%  South Dakota
LA-2    17.96%  New Orleans-Baton Rouge
CO-1    17.83%  Denver
VA-3    16.74%  Richmond-Norfolk
KY-3    16.67%  Louisville
ND-AL   15.64%  North Dakota
MT-AL   15.01%  Montana
UT-2    12.38%  Salt Lake City, Southwest
OK-3    12.22%  West
GA-5    11.30%  Atlanta
WY-AL   11.04%  Wyoming
ID-2    10.45%  Pocatello, Idaho Falls, Boise
TX-13   10.29%  Panhandle, North, Amarillo, Wichita Falls
AL-7     9.30%  Birmingham-Montgomery, Black Belt
DE-AL    8.84%  Delaware
NC-1     8.76%  Northeast
TN-9     8.42%  Memphis
FL-14    6.85%  Tampa
SC-6     6.81%  Low Country
NM-2     6.04%  Southern
AR-4     6.04%  Southwest
MS-2     5.56%  Delta, Jackson
AZ-3     4.03%  Tucson-Phoenix
HI-1     3.57%  Honolulu
NV-2     3.16%  Reno, Northern
AK-AL    1.67%  Alaska

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Brittain33
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« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2015, 10:25:22 AM »

Why do you think that MS and AR rank so low? Is it that pre-WWII housing was in such poor shape that even in places where no one moves in and the economy is poor, people still ended up in newer housing?
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muon2
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« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2015, 11:47:18 AM »

The baby boom was a housing boom, too. Even in rural areas the GI Bill helped WWII vets get new homes. It had the least effect in built-up urban areas that would require existing housing to be removed. But areas with small rural towns saw population growth add new housing.
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Skill and Chance
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« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2015, 01:29:25 PM »

Also, I think there is a general lack of memory for just how rural the pre-WWII South and West was.  In 1900, the only cities >100K south of DC/SF were New Orleans and L.A. (at 102K).  Nashville, Richmond, and Atlanta were close, but Dallas and Houston were still <50K.  The South as we presently know it with built out suburbs and sprawl didn't really exist until after WWII.
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memphis
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« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2015, 03:05:55 PM »

Also, I think there is a general lack of memory for just how rural the pre-WWII South and West was.  In 1900, the only cities >100K south of DC/SF were New Orleans and L.A. (at 102K).  Nashville, Richmond, and Atlanta were close, but Dallas and Houston were still <50K.  The South as we presently know it with built out suburbs and sprawl didn't really exist until after WWII.
You forgot one city. [angry face emoji]
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jimrtex
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« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2015, 07:25:18 PM »

Why do you think that MS and AR rank so low? Is it that pre-WWII housing was in such poor shape that even in places where no one moves in and the economy is poor, people still ended up in newer housing?
The district with the highest percentage of pre-WWII in most southern states is the VRA district.   In those areas people were moving North into the 1970s.  The districts with the highest percentage of pre-WWII housing in Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas, Nebraska, and Iowa is the most rural districts, that have been losing population.  The worst housing can be abandoned, or perhaps not maintained, or converted to barns or storage.  But there is less need to build new housing.  Also the census doesn't ask when the last addition was built.  In a small town, or on a farm, there is plenty of room to add on.  If someone is economically successful, there may not be a "better" part of town to move to.

Pre-WWII housing in the South would not be air-conditioned, and would be designed in a different way, to keep it as not-so-hot as possible.   Wood rots in the South.   And the South was not as wealthy.  Converting a house to air conditioning or maintaining an old house is tremendously expensive.

One district that was not mentioned was CA-34, in Los Angeles, which has 35.34% pre-WWII housing.  Gerrymandering is another factor.   California districts are compact.   Though Pennsylvania is gerrymandered, the Pittsburgh district is quite compact, as a Democrat pack, while all the newer areas are chopped up in other districts.
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jimrtex
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« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2015, 07:28:31 PM »

Also, I think there is a general lack of memory for just how rural the pre-WWII South and West was.  In 1900, the only cities >100K south of DC/SF were New Orleans and L.A. (at 102K).  Nashville, Richmond, and Atlanta were close, but Dallas and Houston were still <50K.  The South as we presently know it with built out suburbs and sprawl didn't really exist until after WWII.
You forgot one city. [angry face emoji]
Vicksburg and Natchez weren't that big, and river cities like Alton and Quincy can't be considered Southern.
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memphis
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« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2015, 07:51:41 PM »

Also, I think there is a general lack of memory for just how rural the pre-WWII South and West was.  In 1900, the only cities >100K south of DC/SF were New Orleans and L.A. (at 102K).  Nashville, Richmond, and Atlanta were close, but Dallas and Houston were still <50K.  The South as we presently know it with built out suburbs and sprawl didn't really exist until after WWII.
You forgot one city. [angry face emoji]
Vicksburg and Natchez weren't that big, and river cities like Alton and Quincy can't be considered Southern.
Huh
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jimrtex
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« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2015, 08:18:43 PM »
« Edited: January 04, 2015, 11:39:40 AM by jimrtex »

Percentage of housing units built in 1950-1959

CA-38   36.16%   Montebello, Whittier, La Mirada, Norwalk, Lakewood
NY-2    34.38%   Levittown, Massapequa, and points east.
NY-4    31.53%   Hempstead
CA-32   31.34%   El Monte, West Covina, San Dimas, Duarte, Azuza...
NY-3    31.13%   Hicksville, Mineola, Nassauc County north.
CA-29   27.14%   San Fernando Valley
MI-13   26.50%   Detroit, West Central Wayne County
NY-6    25.71%   Queens, Flushing, Bayside
MI-9    25.55%   Southern Macomb, Southeast Oakland
CA-46   24.78%   Anaheim, Orange, Santa Ana


These are all suburbs of big cities that permitted the area to be built out quite quickly.  Surprising to me is NY-6, Queens was still being builit-out in the 1950s.

Highest in other states.

PA-13   24.40%   North Philadelphia, Inner Montco.
WI-4    22.68%   Milwaukee
IL-9    20.81%   Evanston, Skokie, Des Plaines
FL-24   20.45%   North Miami, Miami Gardens
NJ-9    20.31%   Paterson, Passaic, Rutherford, Fort Lee
OH-13   19.80%   Youngstown, Akron
MO-1    19.70%   St.Louis
MD-2    19.32%   Severn, Dundalk, Aberdeen, Towson
CT-1    18.88%   Hartford
KS-4    17.85%   South Central, Wichita
TX-19   17.83%   West Texas, South Plains, Lubbock, Abilene
MN-5    17.53%   Minneapolis
TN-9    17.34%   Memphis
AZ-7    16.60%   Phoenix
IN-1    16.34%   Northwest, Gary, Hammond. Michigan City
CO-1    16.31%   Denver
VA-3    15.88%   Richmond-Norfolk
MA-1    15.80%   Springfield, Holyoke, Berkshires
KY-3    15.62%   Louisville
AL-7    14.85%   Birmingham-Montgomery via Black Belt
WA-7    13.66%   Seattle
DC-AL   12.96%   Washington
OK-5    12.78%   Oklahoma City
RI-1    12.74%   Providence (RI-2 is 12.72%)
IA-4    12.13%   Northwest, Sioux City
LA-4    12.03%   Northwest, Shreveport, Natchitoches.
NM-1    11.78%   Albuquerque
GA-5    11.75%   Atlanta
WV-1    11.61%   Northern
NC-1    11.34%   Northeast
MI-2    11.14%   Jackson, Delta
HI-1    10.87%   Honolulu
NE-1    10.79%   Eastern (except Omaha), Lincoln
OR-4    10.53%   Southwest, Eugene
ND-AL    9.93%   North Dakota
DE-AL    9.74%   Delaware
ID-2     9.71%   Southeast, Pocatello, Idaho Falls, Boise
MT-AL    9.45%   Montana
WY-AL    9.20%   Wyoming
SD-AL    9.19%   South Dakota
SC-6     8.98%   Low Country, Charleston, Columbia
AR-4     8.64%   Southwest, Texarkana, Pine Bluff
UT-2     8.30%   Salt Lake City, Southwest
NH-1     8.06%   Eastern, Manchester, Portsmouth
ME-2     7.40%   Northern, Lewiston, Bangor, Madawaska
VT-AL    6.36%   Vermont
NV-1     5.36%   Las Vegas
AK-AL    5.09%   Alaska

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jimrtex
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« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2015, 08:23:00 PM »

Also, I think there is a general lack of memory for just how rural the pre-WWII South and West was.  In 1900, the only cities >100K south of DC/SF were New Orleans and L.A. (at 102K).  Nashville, Richmond, and Atlanta were close, but Dallas and Houston were still <50K.  The South as we presently know it with built out suburbs and sprawl didn't really exist until after WWII.
You forgot one city. [angry face emoji]
Vicksburg and Natchez weren't that big, and river cities like Alton and Quincy can't be considered Southern.
Huh
Isn't Cairo technically on the Ohio?  Kaskaskia?  What is that town across from Natchez?  Vidalia?

Incidentally, Graceland was builit in 1939, so Memphis does have at least one old house.
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memphis
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« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2015, 09:17:22 PM »

We had (barely) over 100k people in 1900. I don't know why you're being so strange about this. Unfortunately, there are not many 19th century structures standing today though. My hometown was extremely enthusiastic about urban renewal via demolition in the postwar period. Plenty of early 20th century homes though. Midtown, in particular, is a mostly intact early 1900s streetcar style area.
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jimrtex
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« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2015, 09:48:31 PM »

We had (barely) over 100k people in 1900. I don't know why you're being so strange about this. Unfortunately, there are not many 19th century structures standing today though. My hometown was extremely enthusiastic about urban renewal via demolition in the postwar period. Plenty of early 20th century homes though. Midtown, in particular, is a mostly intact early 1900s streetcar style area.
The OP should have been more selective in his dates.  In 1890, Richmond, Atlanta, and Nashville were larger.  Does Memphis
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memphis
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« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2015, 12:32:17 AM »

In 1890, our population was still recovering from an absolutely catastrophic Yellow Fever epidemic. And that's why there were so few Southern cities back then. Before people understood proper sanitation, germ theory, and water drainage, subtropical climates were ideal places for the spread of many diseases. Mosquitoes and poop were ubiquitous. To say nothing of unbearable odors.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2015, 01:25:17 PM »

Incidentally, Graceland was builit in 1939, so Memphis does have at least one old house.

The idea that a house built in 1939 is old is hilarious.
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Snowstalker Mk. II
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« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2015, 02:31:03 PM »

Incidentally, Graceland was builit in 1939, so Memphis does have at least one old house.

The idea that a house built in 1939 is old is hilarious.

It is in much of America.
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Skill and Chance
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« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2015, 05:40:52 PM »

In 1890, our population was still recovering from an absolutely catastrophic Yellow Fever epidemic. And that's why there were so few Southern cities back then. Before people understood proper sanitation, germ theory, and water drainage, subtropical climates were ideal places for the spread of many diseases. Mosquitoes and poop were ubiquitous. To say nothing of unbearable odors.

Yes, and I admit I was slightly off about Memphis.  Nevertheless, this goes a long way toward rebutting both the common claim on the left that modern day Southern (and occasionally Western) suburbs are the natural descendents of Jim Crow, and the common claim on the right that they represent fundamental American culture.  Southern urban areas only came about when Jim Crow was already unraveling and the culture of modern day Texas is something that simply didn't exist >50 years ago.
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Torie
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« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2015, 06:04:40 PM »

Given that so little has been built in economically comatose upstate NY, I think maybe a CD or two up there might be in play. In the City of Hudson, just about nothing residential has been built since about 1920 when it comes to housing, except for some public housing, and a townhouse development on top of one hill. But then, Hudson was the 24th largest city in the US in 1790, with about 2,700 people (3rd largest in NY, after NYC, with 33,000, and Albany, with 3,300 or so). Today, it has about 6,400.
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snowguy716
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« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2015, 07:28:47 PM »

Incidentally, Graceland was builit in 1939, so Memphis does have at least one old house.

The idea that a house built in 1939 is old is hilarious.
The idea that a not insignificant number of elderly die in their homes during the winter due to hypothermia in the 21st century in the UK is hilarious.

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